[Help Thread] CFOP Discussion

[PurpleBanana]

Umm alright. So I solve with LBL atm. My pb is 22.05 ( did 2 layers and the alg for yellow cross and done ) and I average 30-39. Is it time for me to learn 4LLL? I also learned intuitive f2l but it's slow. I take long to recognize a case and execute it. For 4LLL I'm learned the algs, but the alg I do to set up the last layer (R' F R' B2 R F' R' B2 R2) is really slow cuz of the back moves. Any help with this alg? THanks!

Intuitive F2L is slow for everyone right after they learn it. Continue to practice it and your times will improve. At your average you should definitely be using 4LLL as well, so begin using that if you aren't already. 3 algs for EO, 7 for CO, 2 for CP, 4 for EP = 16 total. Simple, and uses minimal memorization.

The R' F R' B2 R F' R' B2 R2 alg is an A-perm, and the way to perform this alg is to start with an x rotation and then do the alg using R, U, and D instead of R, F, and B. Thus: x R' U R' D2 R U' R' D2 R2. When you're using 2-look PLL you will perform this alg in 2/3 of your solves.

 

[TheFearlessPro]

Intuitive F2L is slow for everyone right after they learn it. Continue to practice it and your times will improve. At your average you should definitely be using 4LLL as well, so begin using that if you aren't already. 3 algs for EO, 7 for CO, 2 for CP, 4 for EP = 16 total. Simple, and uses minimal memorization.

The R' F R' B2 R F' R' B2 R2 alg is an A-perm, and the way to perform this alg is to start with an x rotation and then do the alg using R, U, and D instead of R, F, and B. Thus: x R' U R' D2 R U' R' D2 R2. When you're using 2-look PLL you will perform this alg in 2/3 of your solves.

I'm learning 4LLL right now. I know of 2 patterns for corners and ik all the edges for the 2-look oll. I tested with the X rotation for the a Perm, kinda worked it but thanks for writing it out!. Thanks for the advice, it helps a lot. As for intuitive f2l, shall I start working on it once I am able to do 4LLL at a certain amount of time or..
P.s- have a 4LLL tab (the document) right now!

 

[One Wheel]

The A-perm I use, because it's easy to remember, is l U' R D2 R' U R D2 R2. Or mirrored. Headlights in front, and the first move is a double layer move turning the 2x2 block in the back toward yourself.

 

[PurpleBanana]

I'm learning 4LLL right now. I know of 2 patterns for corners and ik all the edges for the 2-look oll. I tested with the X rotation for the a Perm, kinda worked it but thanks for writing it out!. Thanks for the advice, it helps a lot. As for intuitive f2l, shall I start working on it once I am able to do 4LLL at a certain amount of time or..
P.s- have a 4LLL tab (the document) right now!

You can really learn the whole 4LLL in one night, or a couple days at most, especially since you seem to already know some of it. So, sure, learn that first, and once you know the algs, practice them while beginning to learn intuitive F2L. Don't delay F2L any more than that though, since the longer you wait to switch from LBL, the harder it is to make that switch.

What site are you using for your 4LLL algorithms?

 

[TheFearlessPro]

You can really learn the whole 4LLL in one night, or a couple days at most, especially since you seem to already know some of it. So, sure, learn that first, and once you know the algs, practice them while beginning to learn intuitive F2L. Don't delay F2L any more than that though, since the longer you wait to switch from LBL, the harder it is to make that switch.

What site are you using for your 4LLL algorithms?

It takes me time to memorize the algs, i use this one http://www.scribd.com/doc/131985555/4-Look-Last-Layer. I only need to learn one more pll alg, and 2 oll algs. I'll start practicing both tomorrow.

 

[PurpleBanana]

It takes me time to memorize the algs, i use this one http://www.scribd.com/doc/131985555/4-Look-Last-Layer. I only need to learn one more pll alg, and 2 oll algs. I'll start practicing both tomorrow.

The algs from that document seem fine, with two exceptions; the alternate angle for the A-perm which we discussed, and the second CO case, also known as an antisune, for which it recommends you use a mirrored sune. The algorithm given as an alternate is far better and you should learn that one instead.

 

[Praetorian]

try not to do many cube rotations during your f2l, because its slower. try to practice f2l by scrambleing it without rotating the cube and then slowly inserting pairs without rotating the cube. this dropped my times from 42 sec average to about 20 average.

there's nothing wrong with rotations, it's just using them the correct way in a situation is what you need to do, using them too much or using them when not needed is a bad thing

completely rotationless F2L has disadvantages, especially with all the different types of cases at any angle

 

[TheFearlessPro]

The algs from that document seem fine, with two exceptions; the alternate angle for the A-perm which we discussed, and the second CO case, also known as an antisune, for which it recommends you use a mirrored sune. The algorithm given as an alternate is far better and you should learn that one instead.

Alright thanks! I just need to learn 2 algs now (just the olls) Im averaging in the 40s with 4lll now lol. For intuitive f2l, im having lots of pauses due to bad recognition. WHat can i do to fix this? just practice?

 

[Lachlanj5]

Alright thanks! I just need to learn 2 algs now (just the olls) Im averaging in the 40s with 4lll now lol. For intuitive f2l, im having lots of pauses due to bad recognition. WHat can i do to fix this? just practice?

Just practise as much F2L as you can, I average about 40 without f2l as I haven't learned it but it's what everyone recommends


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[CornerCutter]

What should my F2L be when I sub-25? I average 27-29sec right now and that's my next goal. I want to know what I should work on.

Thanks.

 

[TheFearlessPro]

CornerCutter, do you mind telling me how you average that? Like if you use 2look oll and pll and where you learned f2l ?

 

[shadowslice e]

What should my F2L be when I sub-25? I average 27-29sec right now and that's my next goal. I want to know what I should work on.

Thanks.

I don't CFOP but I am sub-20 with it and my F2L is around 14 with VHLS in the last slot so I can do COLL/EPLL.

What are your splits? I would guess for sub-25 it would be good to have an F2L of around 15-18 seconds ideally.

 

[CornerCutter]

CornerCutter, do you mind telling me how you average that? Like if you use 2look oll and pll and where you learned f2l ?

I know Full OLL(most 54/57) and Full PLL, and I use intuitive F2L. I know I could have waited for full OLL, but I didn't hear about waiting until after I had learned all of them.

I don't CFOP but I am sub-20 with it and my F2L is around 14 with VHLS in the last slot so I can do COLL/EPLL.

What are your splits? I would guess for sub-25 it would be good to have an F2L of around 15-18 seconds ideally.

I will do my splits soon and will let you know.

 

[PurpleBanana]

I know Full OLL(most 54/57)...

What are the 3 you haven't learned and why haven't you learned them???

 

[CornerCutter]

What are the 3 you haven't learned and why haven't you learned them???

http://badmephisto.com/oll.php - 49, 54, 55. Too lazy? I need some better algs. Badmephisto posted a new alg on 54 and it looks pretty easy.

 

[CornerCutter]

I don't CFOP but I am sub-20 with it and my F2L is around 14 with VHLS in the last slot so I can do COLL/EPLL.

What are your splits? I would guess for sub-25 it would be good to have an F2L of around 15-18 seconds ideally.

Here are my splits:

F2L Ao5: 16.44

1. (18.29)
2. 16.81
3. 16.92
4. 15.59
5. (15.18)

LL Ao5: 8.41

1. (7.56)
2. 9.62
3. (10.00)
4. 7.67
5. 7.93

 

[PurpleBanana]

http://badmephisto.com/oll.php - 49, 54, 55. Too lazy? I need some better algs. Badmephisto posted a new alg on 54 and it looks pretty easy.

For 54 use the first alg he gives. It's just a bunch of triggers strung together so very easy to learn. For 55 I use (U2) F U R U2 R' U' R U2 R' U' F'. For 49 you can use his alg or search on algdb.net for a better one. I use r U2 R2 F R F' U2 r' F R F' for this case which is quite awful and I really should switch to a better one.

 

[Praetorian]

For 54 use the first alg he gives. It's just a bunch of triggers strung together so very easy to learn. For 55 I use (U2) F U R U2 R' U' R U2 R' U' F'. For 49 you can use his alg or search on algdb.net for a better one. I use r U2 R2 F R F' U2 r' F R F' for this case which is quite awful and I really should switch to a better one.

49 - R B' R2 F R2 B R2 F' R first B' with right index flick F' with left index entirely regripless and really fast
54 - r U2 R' U' (R U R' U') R U' r' , double front wide antisune
55 - r U2 R' U' M (R U R' U') r U' r' or without the M, r U2 R' U' R2 r' U R' U' r U' r'

 

[sqAree]

That's different images.

49 - (y) R' F R U R U' R2 F' R2 U' R' U R U R'
54 - M U (R U R' U') (R' F R F') M'
55 - F U R U2 R' U' R U2 R' U' F' as PurpleBanana pointed out.

You have to figure out pre-AUFS by yourself.

 

[CornerCutter]

Thanks for those algs guys. I'll learn those soon. I just got a new Ao12: 25.49