[Help Thread] F2L Discussion and Help

i average 21.59, and i think i do have a few tips for f2l, even though mine probably isn't any faster than yours =P.

basics - first of all, i've seen many people find a corner, then they would place it over where it needs to go. lets say we have a white cross. they would place the orange/blue/white corner over the slot where it needs to go. then from there, they would look for the edge, and then solve it. i don't think anyone here does it, but i think it's a very bad habit. i use to do it too =P. once you find a pair, solve it from where it is, don't worry about it's position, especially the first one. take advantage of the empty slots! but once your on to the the last few, it gets limited, but that's okay.

solve from different angles - also very important, solve pairs from different angles. i have even practiced every case from every angle just to have a feel of it myself. if you only know how to solve a pair from one angle, you'll have to do many cube rotations, which will slow you down. and if you're looking at the pair your solving (the slot it needs to go in is in front of you), then it minimizes the number of other pieces you can see. it will only be 2 pieces left, but it still matters.

look ahead - okay this is what i do. right when i find a pair, i memorize it's position, how to solve/pair it, and where it would need to go afterwards. while i'm solving it, i'm looking for the next pair. this is what looking ahead basically is. a good way to practice it is to; 1. solve the cross without looking (skip if you can't), 2. solve each pair without looking. so all you really do is just memorize the position of the piece, how to solve it, and where to place it, close you eyes, and then execute it. do the same for all 4 CE pairs. ( i read this somewhere on the forum).

don't stop! - this is part of looking ahead. don't stop! always keep moving, and move slowly and smoothly so that you have no pauses or delays. i didn't think it would be much, but 1 second looking for each pair can add a good 4 seconds to your solve! my average was stuck around 25 for a while, so i practiced my f2l, which reduced my average to 21. so go slow for the first 3 pairs, and finish the last pair as fast as you can, and prepare for OLL.

shortcuts - shortcuts are very useful, and are also fast (because they're shortcuts =D). learning them is up to you. i am also looking for new shortcuts, and like i said, take advantage of the empty slots. a good site to learn some shortcuts is http://cubefreak.net/F2L.html (about half way down the page), and of course, erik's site, http://www.erikku.110mb.com/F2Lalgo.html . you don't necessarily have to learn these algs, but just get an idea of how they work, then you can go on to making your own.

well that's all i can think of right now. hope this helps! feel free to ask about anything else
 
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I'm not exactly sub-15 but i can do f2l in a like 10-13 for OH...
If you are using algs you are not necessarily doing it optimally because the algs don't make use of empty slots. I would suggest practicing it intuitively and trying to minimize moves intuitively. I think if you just practice full speed you will learn to do what you are doing now faster but you may not pick up on shortcuts since you are going too fast. Go slow look for shortcuts. Look through the solutions for Stefan's f2l study a lot of those cubers are the ones you are looking for so you can see how they do their f2l.
 
The "basic" F2L (including cross) could be: 7 (cross) + (1+3+1+3)*4 slots = 7 + 8)*4 = 7+32 = 39 moves. But depending on the cases you might do need to do AUF (which is what the 1 is for, and the 3 is pairing up). So 39 should really be the *maximum* number of turns required. You should be aiming for low 30s, possibly around 30-34 moves, if not sub 30.

Though this might be be as easily mastered/implemented in speedsolving, it is a good idea to try to pair up/preserved pairs when you're building cross, and allowing you with an easier transition to F2L (so you're not clueless going the F2L stage). So many be your cross will be 8 moves instead of 6, but then you got one c/e paired up ready to go, and inserting that should require 4 moves at most, so in total it's 12 moves, compared to say, 15 moves if you hadn't "prepared" your pair. Of course in multi-slotting you'll also do some extra moves/insert differently to pair up with the next pair. But you don't need to worry about that right now, just get the basics first ;-)
 
I'm not sub-15, but I've gotten sub-25 in 2 months doing this:
Whenever a timer is not readily available, I try to do the algorithm relatively slowly, but then make absolutely no break between the next move. Its just something thats helped me- for 30ish cubers, at least those I know, there is more time between F2L algorithms then the actual execution.
 
I agree with Joël. There is no point going at the speed of wich you are able to see the next pair on the last pair. The first pair is the hardest, and then it just gets easier there for you should accelerate. Metronome should only be used to define your slowest speed. Why go at the exact same speed on every solve when solves differ in difficulty?
 
KConny said:
I agree with Joël. There is no point going at the speed of wich you are able to see the next pair on the last pair. The first pair is the hardest, and then it just gets easier there for you should accelerate. Metronome should only be used to define your slowest speed. Why go at the exact same speed on every solve when solves differ in difficulty?
Click to expand...

Yeah, I know what you mean. Some solves are so easy that I can go almost full speed on F2L because I already see the next pair.
 
although i dont have an avg of sub 15, i avg 18, i do have a 8-9 second f2l 95% of the times (which infers that my last layer sux big time).

f2l took alot of practice for me. during my practice all i did was solve the f2l and ignoring the last layer, that's why it sux. but neways, learn a couple of f2l shortcuts like open slots, just the more useful ones. and i assume that u have an intuitive f2l, so as you're doing a pair, look for other pairs/pieces and see what u need to do. also try to do a pair that can simplify the next pair. definitely finger tricks DO play a big role in this, so basically play around with the f2l ALOT! f2l comes with experience, not other things.

to give u an idea of the importance of finger tricks, i avg around 33-37 moves for f2l, which is a whole algorithm more than the top sub-15 cubers' f2l moves. but most of them avg around 8-9 secs on f2l anyway. so yea finger tricks are important, especially the R U R' U' trigger (if u do cross on left like me).

but to sum it up, PRACTICE F2L ALOT!
 
Try different things. Just experiment and use those empty slots! And also, try not to cube turn. At first it may seem awkward, but it's worth it.
 
if u learned f2l with the 41 standard cases (like I did) learning some open slot techniques will DEFINITELY improve your time
 
AlexandertheGreat said:
if u learned f2l with the 41 standard cases (like I did) learning some open slot techniques will DEFINITELY improve your time
Click to expand...

Yeah, that's how I did learn it. I already use some empty slots and it has helped. I am also planning on doing VH as my main method as soon as I finish COLL and VHF2L. The VHF2L is not really move efficient, so I plan on going full speed for last pair, which I think most people do anyway. However, for the first 3 pairs, I want to reduce my moves. I think 25 moves or less is a reasonable goal. At worst, it could be cross 7, 1-3 pair 7, so it would be 28. But since cross can many times be done in 6 and the first 2 or even 3 pairs in 6 also, I think that 25 moves is possible. What do you guys think?
 
Time to learn F2L

Currently, I average about 1min, and I'm aiming to eventually learn full Fridrich. I've just lubed my cube (with Vaseline :eek:), so I'm hoping that with practice, I can get down to 50s.

I currently do cross, bottom-layer corners, middle-layer edges, 2-look PLL, then 2-look OLL (I hope I got those the right way round :)).

Once I can get down to 50 seconds, would this be an appropriate time to learn the algorithms for F2L? I understand the theory, but it's a lot of algorithms to learn, and I doubt that I could effectively do intuitive F2L.

Thanks for any advice you can offer. :)
 
linkmaster03 said:
1. OLL comes before PLL.

2. Do intuitive F2L. Trust me, I thought I couldn't do it either. It will be slower at first, but you will learn tricks and recognize cases. It's very easy, and you don't need to learn any algorithms. Badmephisto's videos are very good:

Part 1: http://youtube.com/watch?v=k-xbcAMfWwM
Part 2: http://youtube.com/watch?v=4GxLM_dZqg4
Click to expand...

Thanks for your advice. I'll watch the videos and give it a go. :)

EDIT: Thanks again for posting the links. I've watched the first one, and that was enough to solve my F2L intuitively. I'll watch the second one to improve it when the edges are in the middle layer, but I was surprised by how easy it was! Cheers.
 
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Yes, when you first learn intuitive F2L, your times will slow down a lot. If you practice hard for a few days, your times will start to get faster a lot as you get used to intuitive F2L. Just never give up, and you'll get faster!
 
Yeah, even though I've only just started, I can see that I'm recognizing cases much easier than before, and the time it takes is slowly dropping. It's slower than my normal solve, but I'll use it anyway, as I'm sure that it's much quicker once you get the hang of it.

Thanks for all your help. :)

P.S. Regarding Vaseline, I read that it destroys the cube, but it'll give me an excuse to buy a DIY one. :p
 
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