• Welcome to the Speedsolving.com, home of the web's largest puzzle community!
    You are currently viewing our forum as a guest which gives you limited access to join discussions and access our other features.

    Registration is fast, simple and absolutely free so please, join our community of 40,000+ people from around the world today!

    If you are already a member, simply login to hide this message and begin participating in the community!
Joined
Aug 30, 2020
Messages
1,899
Location
On a long train journey, Smashin' PBs one a stop
YouTube
Visit Channel
G perms are horrible and i have finished learning Gb and Gd. But i still need help for Ga and Gc. Do any of you have good algs?
Ga: R2 U R' U R' U' R U' R2 U' D R' U R D'
Gc: R2 u' R U' R U R' u R2 f R' f' or mirror Ga

G perms aren't bad...you need to practice them a lot. Gc is one of my favourite and fastest PLLs(at 1.3 "stackmatted").
 

tsmosher

Member
Joined
Aug 30, 2020
Messages
649
G perms are horrible and i have finished learning Gb and Gd. But i still need help for Ga and Gc. Do any of you have good algs?

Might help to know what you are using for Gb and Gd. Anyway, here's what I use (both <RUD>):

Ga:
R2 U R' U R' U' R U' R2 D U' R' U R D'

Gc:
D R2 U' R U' R U R' U R2 D' U R U' R'

Other Gc perms:
R2 u' R U' R U R' u R2 f R' f' (if you don't mind the wide moves)
(U2) R2' F2 R U2 R U2 R' F R U R' U' R' F R2 (this one is slower but is so fun to execute)
 

yCArp

Member
Joined
Jun 24, 2021
Messages
14
Location
Nowhere
Hi, I am looking for an algorithm subset that solves corner permutation and edge orientation when inserting the last f2l pair (The last f2l pair is already paired up in a block or the 3 mover insert, like in Winter Variation and Summer Variation respectively). In other words, I want to get a 2GLL in the last layer. Does such a subset of algs exist, and I dont think ZBLS is what I am looking for?
 
Joined
Aug 30, 2020
Messages
1,899
Location
On a long train journey, Smashin' PBs one a stop
YouTube
Visit Channel
Hi, I am looking for an algorithm subset that solves corner permutation and edge orientation when inserting the last f2l pair (The last f2l pair is already paired up in a block or the 3 mover insert, like in Winter Variation and Summer Variation respectively). In other words, I want to get a 2GLL in the last layer. Does such a subset of algs exist, and I dont think ZBLS is what I am looking for?
What you're looking for doesn't exist but I can tell that it will have more algs than ZBLS, ZBLL and VLS combined.
 

Darktigr

Member
Joined
Nov 24, 2021
Messages
3
Location
Indiana
You can turn almost any CPEOLL alg into an LS insert: When inserting the last pair, cancel into the CPEOLL alg. This is suboptimal in many cases, but some could be quite good.

Now, I'm looking for algorithms in a similar vein to this topic: Altcross OLL. In that thread, they discuss OLL algorithms where FD and BD are swapped (orientation maintained). I'm also curious about OLL's and F2L control with this setup, but I'm more interested in PLL.

Instead of bumping a decade old thread stump, I'm reaching out here for optimal and/or speed optimal solutions to each PLL case, but predicated with: (AUF) {M2 U2 M2}. Some pairs of PLL cases share an identical U-layer after performing the predicate (ie. V | Y, Ja | Gb etc.). I'm not sure which cases are equivalent (separated only by an AUF), so I'll post more setup cases than is probably necessary.

Without further ado, here're the setups for the cases I am referencing. Note the similarities between each pair, so the algorithms will be quite similar. Even just a single alg, or any pointers would be much appreciated:

Z's:
Setup: {(M2 U2 M2) (M2 U' M2 U' M' U2 M2 U2 M')}
Setup: {(M2 U2 M2 U) (M2 U' M2 U' M' U2 M2 U2 M')}

U's:
Setup:{(M2 U2 M2) (M2 U M' U2 M U M2)}
Setup:{(M2 U2 M2 U) (M2 U M' U2 M U M2)}

A's:
Setup: {(M2 U2 M2) (x R' U R' D2 R U' R' D2 R2 x')}
Setup: {(M2 U2 M2 U) (x R' U R' D2 R U' R' D2 R2 x')}

E's
Setup: {(M2 U2 M2) (x' R U' R' D R U R' D' R U R' D R U' R' D' x)}
Setup: {(M2 U2 M2 U) (x' R U' R' D R U R' D' R U R' D R U' R' D' x)}

T's:
Setup: {(M2 U2 M2) (R U R' U' R' F R2 U' R' U' R U R' F')}
Setup: {(M2 U2 M2 U) (R U R' U' R' F R2 U' R' U' R U R' F')}

F's:
Setup: {(M2 U2 M2) (R' U R U' R2 F' U' F U R F R' F' R2)}
Setup: {(M2 U2 M2 U) (R' U R U' R2 F' U' F U R F R' F' R2)}

Ja's:
Setup: {(M2 U2 M2) (L' U' L F L' U' L U L F' L2 U L)}
Setup: {(M2 U2 M2 U) (L' U' L F L' U' L U L F' L2 U L)}

Jb's:
Setup: {(M2 U2 M2) (R U R' F' R U R' U' R' F R2 U' R')}
Setup: {(M2 U2 M2 U) (R U R' F' R U R' U' R' F R2 U' R')}

Ga's:
Setup: {(M2 U2 M2) (R2 u R' U R' U' R u' R2 F' U F)}
Setup: {(M2 U2 M2 U) (R2 u R' U R' U' R u' R2 F' U F)}

Gb's:
Setup: {(M2 U2 M2) (R' d' F R2 u R' U R U' R u' R2)}
Setup: {(M2 U2 M2 U) (R' d' F R2 u R' U R U' R u' R2)}

Gc's:
Setup: {(M2 U2 M2) (R2' u' R U' R U R' u R2 f R' f')}
Setup: {(M2 U2 M2 U) (R2' u' R U' R U R' u R2 f R' f')}

Gd's:
Setup: {(M2 U2 M2) (D' R U R' U' D R2 U' R U' R' U R' U R2)}
Setup: {(M2 U2 M2 U) (D' R U R' U' D R2 U' R U' R' U R' U R2)}

Ra's:
Setup: {(M2 U2 M2) (L U2 L' U2 L F' L' U' L U L F L2)}
Setup: {(M2 U2 M2 U) (L U2 L' U2 L F' L' U' L U L F L2)}

Rb's:
Setup: {(M2 U2 M2) (R' U2 R U2 R' F R U R' U' R' F' R2)}
Setup: {(M2 U2 M2 U) (R' U2 R U2 R' F R U R' U' R' F' R2)}

V's:
Setup: {(M2 U2 M2) (R' U R' U' y R' F' R2 U' R' U R' F R F)}
Setup: {(M2 U2 M2 U) (R' U R' U' y R' F' R2 U' R' U R' F R F)}

Y's:
Setup: {(M2 U2 M2) (F R U' R' U' R U R' F' R U R' U' R' F R F')}
Setup: {(M2 U2 M2 U) (F R U' R' U' R U R' F' R U R' U' R' F R F')}

N's:
Setup: {(M2 U2 M2) (F' R U R' U' R' F R2 F U' R' U' R U F' R')}
Setup: {(M2 U2 M2 U) (F' R U R' U' R' F R2 F U' R' U' R U F' R')}
Happy thanksgiving!
 

xyzzy

Member
Joined
Dec 24, 2015
Messages
2,465
Now, I'm looking for algorithms in a similar vein to this topic: Altcross OLL. In that thread, they discuss OLL algorithms where FD and BD are swapped (orientation maintained). I'm also curious about OLL's and F2L control with this setup, but I'm more interested in PLL.

Instead of bumping a decade old thread stump, I'm reaching out here for optimal and/or speed optimal solutions to each PLL case, but predicated with: (AUF) {M2 U2 M2}. Some pairs of PLL cases share an identical U-layer after performing the predicate (ie. V | Y, Ja | Gb etc.). I'm not sure which cases are equivalent (separated only by an AUF), so I'll post more setup cases than is probably necessary.
This isn't what you asked, but: just solve the cross normally. You can M2 U2 M2 to influence F2L pairs, OLL, or PLL, but the average time saved from this influencing is less than the time added by having to do M2 U2 M2. (On very rare occasion this might make sense, e.g. you have a very easy "xxcross" except with a wrong cross.)

Getting to the actual answer: Besides prepending M2 U2 M2, you can also append it. This is basically the same as how PLL parity is dealt with on big cubes, so you can look to PLL parity algs (e.g. on CubeSkills or SCDB) for some inspiration. (Not all of the algs can be adapted to fixing wrong-cross PLL.) For instance, you never need to get a G perm. Any case where you can get a G perm by doing M2 U2 M2 first, you can do M2 U2 M2 from a different AUF and get J perm or R perm.

The edge-only PLLs are also good to know direct algs for, since they're easy and mostly pretty fast:
Opposite: M2 U2 M2
Adjacent: R U R' U M2 U2 M2 U R U' R'
W perm: M2 U' M' U2 M U M2
Ocw perm: M U' M2 U' M2 U' M'
Occw perm: M U M2 U M2 U M'
 

Darktigr

Member
Joined
Nov 24, 2021
Messages
3
Location
Indiana
The edge-only PLLs are also good to know direct algs for, since they're easy and mostly pretty fast:
Opposite: M2 U2 M2
Adjacent: R U R' U M2 U2 M2 U R U' R'
W perm: M2 U' M' U2 M U M2
Ocw perm: M U' M2 U' M2 U' M'
Occw perm: M U M2 U M2 U M'
The goal with the opp-swap altcross setup is to allow for easier lookahead into F2L (which includes X-cross). Sometimes the cross-fix alg can be performed in F2L to form a pair, while also giving a good next case. And because the cross-fix alg only swaps 2 pieces on the U-layer, this makes it easier to look ahead to the next case.

The cross-fix alg can be performed at any point during the solve, so the cuber has plenty of time to prepare for the slice moves. But if the cuber saves the fix for PLL and the corners are solved or adj-swap, they could also opt to solve edges and finish the solve with an A-perm.

That's why I'm reaching out. My first goal is to make a 2-look PLL with cross fix + EPLL, then CPLL. But for diag-swap corner cases, it must be better to perform a single algorithm. So I am also searching for cross fix + CPLL algs, which can be followed up by EPLL to finish. It also occurred to me that cross fix + ELL followed up by L3C (or vice versa) would make for a pretty nice LL (for when corner perm is adj/solved and at least 1 corner is oriented). So I'm glad you provided these algs, and I'll look into those resources even though I am always befuddled by 4x4 parity!
 
Top