[Help Thread] CFOP Discussion

[PJKCuber]

Thanks a lot Tina! You motivated me to practice more Do you OH? Because I guess you just have to practice OH a lot to get sub 20.
I'll do at least 50 solves a day now.

F2L takes a lot of practice to get comfortable with. You've only been practicing it for a week and a half. For some people it takes months to improve F2L. Just keep practicing. You're doing fine, F2L just take time. It's also a good time to start learning full PLL. Being color neutral probably won't help your times at this point but if you want to be color neutral then the earlier you start the better.

Just practice a lot. I usually do at least one average of 100 a day and some other focused practicing. Now you don't need to do 100 solves a day but the more you practice the faster you'll get. You can improve a lot in one month, especially at your speed. If you practice enough you could definitely be sub-30. At least that's my experience with teaching other people.

I understand what you mean, but my times aren't getting worse nor better. I am pretty much stagnating around 47 seconds. If I get a OLL/PLL Skip then I get a sub 40(Lucky).

 

[TinaIsAwesome]

I understand what you mean, but my times aren't getting worse nor better. I am pretty much stagnating around 47 seconds. If I get a OLL/PLL Skip then I get a sub 40(Lucky).

Just keep practicing. You will improve but it just takes time. I was stuck at 28 seconds for a very long time, probably months mainly because I hardly practiced. Once I started practicing on a regular basis I was sub-15 in a month. That's just me though and I practiced a lot. But what I'm basically trying to say is it won't happen overnight but as long as you do practice, you will improve.

 

[PJKCuber]

I have been following this guide. I've been doing F2L for 13 days. I still can't get sub 45 consistently. Any tips please? I do 50+ solves a day.
People just told me to practice 3 days ago. I 've practiced and my times haven't dropped at all. I did break my PB but that was just luck.

Does anybody know any 2Look OH OLL and 2Look OH PLL. I looked everywhere but I could only find full OH OLL/PLL algs.

 

[pipkiksass]

I have been following this guide. I've been doing F2L for 13 days. I still can't get sub 45 consistently. Any tips please? I do 50+ solves a day.
People just told me to practice 3 days ago. I 've practiced and my times haven't dropped at all. I did break my PB but that was just luck.

Does anybody know any 2Look OH OLL and 2Look OH PLL. I looked everywhere but I could only find full OH OLL/PLL algs.

Separate questions.

1) unfortunately the only thing you can do is practice. Improvement will come with time, if you follow this guide you can't go far wrong and you'll get there eventually.

2) 2-look OLL is just made up of edge orientation then corners orientation algorithms. Just choose any algs from full OLL which solve cases with 2 or 4 edges misoriented for your first look (such as F RUR'U' F'), then use the corners only algs from the full OLL sheets for your second look.

 

[TinaIsAwesome]

I have been following this guide. I've been doing F2L for one and a half week. I still can't get sub 45 consistently. Any tips please? I do 50 solves a day

Dude seriously, just practice. It really doesn't happen overnight. Like I've said before, you haven't been doing F2L for that long. I know people who have been using F2L for years and they still average around 25-30 seconds (which is where they started). There is no secret to getting faster at F2L. It's all about practice and look-ahead. Once you have the cross done there should be no pause between solving the cross and your first F2L pair. There also should not be any pausing between F2L pairs. That is your goal. Avoid pausing as much as possible. Pausing will worsen your times so don't try to solve the cube fast if you pause a lot. Going slower and not pausing is better than going fast and pausing a lot. Your aiming for efficiency not speed at this point. Speed will come later.

 

[PJKCuber]

Separate questions.

1) unfortunately the only thing you can do is practice. Improvement will come with time, if you follow this guide you can't go far wrong and you'll get there eventually.

2) 2-look OLL is just made up of edge orientation then corners orientation algorithms. Just choose any algs from full OLL which solve cases with 2 or 4 edges misoriented for your first look (such as F RUR'U' F'), then use the corners only algs from the full OLL sheets for your second look.

Yes, but are there any OH Algs because I tend to forget my algs while doing OH.

 

[pipkiksass]

Yes, but are there any OH Algs because I tend to forget my algs while doing OH.

Try Antoine's website: https://sites.google.com/site/antoineccantin/oh/oll_full

 

[PJKCuber]

Dude seriously, just practice. It really doesn't happen overnight. Like I've said before, you haven't been doing F2L for that long. I know people who have been using F2L for years and they still average around 25-30 seconds (which is where they started). There is no secret to getting faster at F2L. It's all about practice and look-ahead. Once you have the cross done there should be no pause between solving the cross and your first F2L pair. There also should not be any pausing between F2L pairs. That is your goal. Avoid pausing as much as possible. Pausing will worsen your times so don't try to solve the cube fast if you pause a lot. Going slower and not pausing is better than going fast and pausing a lot. Your aiming for efficiency not speed at this point. Speed will come later.

Yes!!! I finally got 2 sub 40 averages and a sub 30 PB.I am improving with practice. Should I learn some F2L Algs and learn Advanced F2L and look ahead to get faster? I don't want to give up or anything, but should I try an alternative method like Roux/ZZ just to see if I'm any better? Thanks for your motivation.
You helped me break a barrier I spent 2 weeks on.

 

[TinaIsAwesome]

Yes!!! I finally got 2 sub 40 averages and a sub 30 PB.I am improving with practice. Should I learn some F2L Algs and learn Advanced F2L and look ahead to get faster? I don't want to give up or anything, but should I try an alternative method like Roux/ZZ just to see if I'm any better? Thanks for your motivation.
You helped me break a barrier I spent 2 weeks on.

Nice! I think for now you just need to focus on look ahead and maybe worry about learning advanced F2L later once you're comfortable with F2L. It probably won't help much now but later it will. Yes, if you want to look into other methods go for it. I hear a lot of people switch to Roux because they find it more intuitive. I'm no expert on Roux but there are plenty of threads about it. Here's a recent one that's pretty good for beginners: http://www.speedsolving.com/forum/showthread.php?47572-Video-Roux-as-a-Beginner-Method

 

[PJKCuber]

Thanks Tina for your help I like Roux but I think I'm better at CFOP. I haven't really tried Roux but the block building just seems weird to me. I will watch cyoubx's Basic F2L Tips and Tricks Video. I am also focusing on being color neutral. I did the sub 30 with a yellow cross. So far I can do White/Yellow. I 'll do Blue/Green practice now and then Red/Orange. I am constantly improving by atleast 1.5 seconds per day now. My Average 3 days ago was 45 yesterday it was 43 and today it's 40.36. I also broke my PB(27.34) with a PLL Skip. I will now look into look ahead

 

[mns112]

i AVG about 20 sec. my F2l is 12 oll is 4 and pll is 4. how can i get faster. what should i pratice?

What about your cross?

 

[Imago]

Hi,

I'm been speed cubing for a long time now and I have been improving but after I got to sub-20 2 months ago, I can't get lower times. I'm stuck at 20 seconds. Can anyone give me help. I know 2-look OLL and many OLL algs and full PLL. Any tips would help me and other. Thanks!

get one look OLL
as fast as you can.. recognition is the key

practice your f2l.. intuivitely just play with it.

 

[Ltsurge]

This is addressed to anyone averaging less than 15s (my goal time).

I've recently gotten back into cubing after 2 years away. One of the biggest reasons that I stopped cubing (besides high school finals) was that I had begun to plateau averaging just sub 20. I have two PLLs still to learn and I am still a 2 step OLL. My rough break down of times are as follows:

cross 2 - 4s
f2l 10-12s
oll 2 - 4s
pll 2- 4s

I'm a big believer in f2l practice and I am already back into practicing lookahead etc in terms of getting better at f2l specifically. However, I don't feel like I'm making much progress. This guide says you should break through the 15s barrier approximately half a year after you break the 20s barrier. For me (not counting my break) I've been stuck at 20s for roughly 1.5 years. Is anyone else like me or am I doing something wrong...

 

[TinaIsAwesome]

This is addressed to anyone averaging less than 15s (my goal time).

I've recently gotten back into cubing after 2 years away. One of the biggest reasons that I stopped cubing (besides high school finals) was that I had begun to plateau averaging just sub 20. I have two PLLs still to learn and I am still a 2 step OLL. My rough break down of times are as follows:

cross 2 - 4s
f2l 10-12s
oll 2 - 4s
pll 2- 4s

I'm a big believer in f2l practice and I am already back into practicing lookahead etc in terms of getting better at f2l specifically. However, I don't feel like I'm making much progress. This guide says you should break through the 15s barrier approximately half a year after you break the 20s barrier. For me (not counting my break) I've been stuck at 20s for roughly 1.5 years. Is anyone else like me or am I doing something wrong...

No, you're not doing anything wrong. You're doing fine, it just comes down to practice. Your splits look pretty good except for F2L so you're right in saying that is what you should be practicing. I would also like to point out this guide is a rough guide meaning not everyone's experience will be exactly the same. For example, from the time I broke the 20 sec. barrier to the 15 sec. barrier was probably a week or so and not half a year. But I was putting in a lot of practice at the time. If it helps I was stuck averaging just above 20 seconds for 4 years before I even broke the 20 sec. barrier.

 

[Hypocrism]

This is addressed to anyone averaging less than 15s (my goal time).

I've recently gotten back into cubing after 2 years away. One of the biggest reasons that I stopped cubing (besides high school finals) was that I had begun to plateau averaging just sub 20. I have two PLLs still to learn and I am still a 2 step OLL. My rough break down of times are as follows:

cross 2 - 4s
f2l 10-12s
oll 2 - 4s
pll 2- 4s

I'm a big believer in f2l practice and I am already back into practicing lookahead etc in terms of getting better at f2l specifically. However, I don't feel like I'm making much progress. This guide says you should break through the 15s barrier approximately half a year after you break the 20s barrier. For me (not counting my break) I've been stuck at 20s for roughly 1.5 years. Is anyone else like me or am I doing something wrong...

Hey, you are in basically the same sitation as me a year ago. I quit before making the 20sec barrier, which I'd been at for a long time, and two/three years later came back and broke it within a few weeks. The same practice got me to about 13s now. Here are the main steps in improving F2L that I used during that period and still use now I'm gunning for sub 10.

1) BLD F2L pairs
-do the cross (BLD or not, as you choose) then identify your first pair. Recognise it with as few rotations as possible when you can, only turning if you can't eliminate the cubie recognition parity. Close eyes, execute. No turns can be done looking at the cube, including AUF. This is to practise inserting pairs with your muscle memory rather than conscious thought about the pair, the first step in successful look-ahead.

2) Metronome training
-start from painfully slow TPM (40-60 is awful, but stick with it. An avg100 at 60TPM made me feel like my lookahead was crazily improving. One turn per beat, if you pause stop the solve and take a mental note of what the situation was that made you pause. You'll notice situations that cause pauses and you have to work out why you pause and how to improve.

3) BLD F2L pairs, + prediction
-continue in the same way as 1), but try to notice & predict the next pair as you execute the moves-IE note the position of the pieces and try to track them. This way you're not only disengaging your attention from the pair you're working on, you're engaging it elsewhere on the cube. It is best to note the position of the pair and then track it through the moves, rather than predict it before starting, because that's not a realistic lookahead situation. Over time, "tracking" pieces turns into recognising a pattern you've done a million times before, and simply knowing where the next pair will end up. That's the main aim here.

4) Practise
-You can do these exercises all you want, but it needs to be supplemented with a large volume of speedsolves. Take into account the lessons you learned and actively try to lookahead and reduce pauses, but these are speedsolves not exercises so just try for the best speed. If you prefer you can forget LL from the speedsolves, that gives you a few more F2L solves per session, but you'll need to re-incorporate LL later on. I find that I stick at a certain speed for quite a while, as I'm polishing my lookahead and move efficiency for that time. Then I suddenly find myself at a new level since the previous level has become automatic and easy.

 

[Ltsurge]

Hey, you are in basically the same sitation as me a year ago. I quit before making the 20sec barrier, which I'd been at for a long time, and two/three years later came back and broke it within a few weeks. The same practice got me to about 13s now. Here are the main steps in improving F2L that I used during that period and still use now I'm gunning for sub 10.

1) BLD F2L pairs
-do the cross (BLD or not, as you choose) then identify your first pair. Recognise it with as few rotations as possible when you can, only turning if you can't eliminate the cubie recognition parity. Close eyes, execute. No turns can be done looking at the cube, including AUF. This is to practise inserting pairs with your muscle memory rather than conscious thought about the pair, the first step in successful look-ahead.

2) Metronome training
-start from painfully slow TPM (40-60 is awful, but stick with it. An avg100 at 60TPM made me feel like my lookahead was crazily improving. One turn per beat, if you pause stop the solve and take a mental note of what the situation was that made you pause. You'll notice situations that cause pauses and you have to work out why you pause and how to improve.

3) BLD F2L pairs, + prediction
-continue in the same way as 1), but try to notice & predict the next pair as you execute the moves-IE note the position of the pieces and try to track them. This way you're not only disengaging your attention from the pair you're working on, you're engaging it elsewhere on the cube. It is best to note the position of the pair and then track it through the moves, rather than predict it before starting, because that's not a realistic lookahead situation. Over time, "tracking" pieces turns into recognising a pattern you've done a million times before, and simply knowing where the next pair will end up. That's the main aim here.

4) Practise
-You can do these exercises all you want, but it needs to be supplemented with a large volume of speedsolves. Take into account the lessons you learned and actively try to lookahead and reduce pauses, but these are speedsolves not exercises so just try for the best speed. If you prefer you can forget LL from the speedsolves, that gives you a few more F2L solves per session, but you'll need to re-incorporate LL later on. I find that I stick at a certain speed for quite a while, as I'm polishing my lookahead and move efficiency for that time. Then I suddenly find myself at a new level since the previous level has become automatic and easy.

Hi thank you for your response. I will definitely try these things. However, I'm also struggling in terms of turning precision (i.e. finger tricks). When I'm scrambling the cube using fingertricks (just random turns) I am very (imo) smooth but when I get down to solving under timing, I seem to get really jumpy and miss time turns, often resulting in a botched algorithm and thus me losing track of where I am. Occasionally I will even lose grip of the cube and when I get my grip back, again, I lose where I was in the solve.

Now I don't want to sound self-important, but I've been cubing for a fair bit now even during my break and I would say, when I'm not timing myself, my fingertricks are smooth and generally better than my times would suggest.

Does anyone have any ideas...?

 

[Hypocrism]

Hi thank you for your response. I will definitely try these things. However, I'm also struggling in terms of turning precision (i.e. finger tricks). When I'm scrambling the cube using fingertricks (just random turns) I am very (imo) smooth but when I get down to solving under timing, I seem to get really jumpy and miss time turns, often resulting in a botched algorithm and thus me losing track of where I am. Occasionally I will even lose grip of the cube and when I get my grip back, again, I lose where I was in the solve.

Now I don't want to sound self-important, but I've been cubing for a fair bit now even during my break and I would say, when I'm not timing myself, my fingertricks are smooth and generally better than my times would suggest.

Does anyone have any ideas...?

Perhaps you could drill some algorithms. Or maybe you have an out of date cube?

 

[Ltsurge]

Perhaps you could drill some algorithms. Or maybe you have an out of date cube?

I have a set of Dayans,

Lingyun 2
Lunhui
Lubix Zhanchi
Guhong

I have not met or talked to any other cubers in person (cubing in my part of the world isn't very organised :/) so I'm not sure if my tensions/lubing technique etc are to blame. I do know my cubes tend to catch alot but I'm not sure if this is normal or not. Also having a look at the moyu weilong...

 

[Future Cuber]

Hey, you are in basically the same sitation as me a year ago. I quit before making the 20sec barrier, which I'd been at for a long time, and two/three years later came back and broke it within a few weeks. The same practice got me to about 13s now. Here are the main steps in improving F2L that I used during that period and still use now I'm gunning for sub 10.

2) Metronome training
-start from painfully slow TPM (40-60 is awful, but stick with it. An avg100 at 60TPM made me feel like my lookahead was crazily improving. One turn per beat, if you pause stop the solve and take a mental note of what the situation was that made you pause. You'll notice situations that cause pauses and you have to work out why you pause and how to improve.

Well im confortable with 145 TPM but still i average around 20s
tips for sub 15

 

[Nilsibert]

I have a set of Dayans,

Lingyun 2
Lunhui
Lubix Zhanchi
Guhong

I have not met or talked to any other cubers in person (cubing in my part of the world isn't very organised :/) so I'm not sure if my tensions/lubing technique etc are to blame. I do know my cubes tend to catch alot but I'm not sure if this is normal or not. Also having a look at the moyu weilong...

If you can turn smoothly when not timing yourself, it's just a stress thing. You put yourself under pressure. I also have this problem, especially after I get a few good solves. I get nervous and stress myself which guarantees bad times. I just try to remember that stressing doesn't help me. If I get bad times when I'm calm, I know it's because of my skills not being developed enough instead of lock ups and such. It takes some time but it's getting better and better. Just always remember to relax before you start each solve.