# The New Method / Substep / Concept Idea Thread

##### Member
yes, move counts. I'm preoccupied with them lately.
I would agree with your estimates of around 15 and 17, though.

Anecdotally, my Roux solves are about 10% faster than my CFOP solves, which for me is about about a 10-15 move difference.
But I agree that lower move counts don't always mean faster times.
Just like i'm trying to see if I can be faster at my ParKoci than my Roux.
i.e. lower move count vs fewer steps

Thanks again WoowyBaby.

#### VIBE_ZT

##### Member
Do you think this 2x2x3 method could be expanded for something like 2x2x4? Or maybe any 2x2xn?
It may be possible to reduce the E layers to one layer, and then do the R pair and PL5C. I think that might prove to be pretty interesting.

Also, you need a name for this method. Saying "WoowyBaby's 2x2x3 Method" is kind of a lot.

#### WoowyBaby

##### Member
I don't own a 2x2x4 or a 2x2xAnything except 2x2x3, so I don't know.

Anybody that doesn't have a 2x2x3 Tower Cube, you can replicate it on a 4x4 by fat R2,L2,F2,B2 and regular U,D moves. Cool, right?

Also, I'm fine with "WoowyBaby's 2x2x3 Method", I don't want to name it BPLS or something weird like that.

Last edited:

#### American-Cuber

##### Member
Thoughts on lmef (low movecount edges first)
This is a method I really wish was real. Any ideas to make it possible?

#### Hazel

The thing about edges-first methods is that there just aren't any ways to make them efficient. With corners first you can still easily manipulate edges without messing up the corners, but it's not that way for edges-first. The best way of solving the corners would just be commutators, but at that point, you're better off using any other method...

#### WoowyBaby

##### Member
Haha lol, low movecount edges first. What a joke, right? There couldn't possibly be a method that is LMEF, right?
Scramble: F' R' L2 B' D L F D F' U2 B2 R2 B2 L' D2 R F2 R U2 L2
y'
D' R D F' // EO
U2 R' L D R L2 D' F2 // Edge F2L-1
U' R U R' // Place Last Edge
D2 R D R U R' D' R2 D2 R' U' R D2 R D2 // 3 D Corners
U R B' R B U2 R2 F R' F' R' U2 R2 U' // L5C
45 MOVES! TOTALLY LEGIT!

TO THE EXTREME-
Scramble: F2 L2 F B' D' L2 U' B R' F2 R2 F2 B L2 F R2 B R2 F2
D B' U F' L D F2 R2 B2 D F2 // Edges
R' U2 R B2 U2 D' L U2 L U R2 D2 F2 R2 U R2 D' L2 // Corners
27 MOVES NO WAY!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

All jokes aside, no time should be wasted exploring this honestly xD

Last edited:

#### WoowyBaby

##### Member
New Developed Method:
Skis Method

Steps:
Skis- Two 1x1x3 blocks on bottom, left and right. Basically skis. Centers do not have to be solved. Compared to Roux FB, Skis is easier to plan in inspection and requires less blockbuilding knowledge. Avg ~7? moves. And these moves are often mostly RU or RUF. If you're some sort of god you can even predict the next step,
CLL- Just like 2x2, basically all algs translate because 2x2 algs generally don't mess up DR edge. You don’t have to AUF. 42 algorithms, which are extremely developed. Algs. Sub-2 seconds for this step is fairly easy.
LR- Solve the 4 E-layer edges, but in pairs, like the LSE step LR, hence the name LR. This step may sound confusing, but just see the example solves and you will see.
Also, you don’t have to solve the pieces in any particular order and you want to align left/right centers but you don’t care about M-slice centers or any AUF.
LSE- The step everyone knows and loves. It's 2-gen which makes spamming TPS easy. Avg ~15 moves. To know more about LSE, just search up Roux method.

<50 algorithms
<50 moves
Could be thought of a mix of Corners First and Roux.
It is theoretically possible to predict everything except LSE in inspection, plan Skis, prdict CLL, see E Edges and centers, do CLL that doesn't affect them and go into LR. No other method has the capability to do this, not even close. Although this isn't that practical so this could be ignored.
Easier learning curve than Roux because you don't need to develop blockbuilding skills.
Better than corners first because this is more efficient and you know what to look for/what you're doing.
LR Step is kind of the downfall of this method, because its the only step you can't spam a billion TPS on.

EXAMPLE SOLVES-
Scramble: B2 R B2 R B2 R2 B2 F2 U2 B2 L' D L U' R2 F' U' B L B
x2
U' R B’ R U R' U R2 // Skis
R U' R' F R' F' R // CLL
y M’ U M2 x’ U M2 U’ // 1st LR
x U’ F’ U M U’ M’ F // 2nd LR
M U M’ U’ M2 U2 M’ U M U2 M’ U M2 U2 u’ // LSE
43 STM

Scramble: L2 D L' F2 R F2 L' B2 L D2 R' F2 R D U2 L' R2 F' L B'
(z x')
u F' R2 U' R' f R' f' // Skis
U' F R U R' U' F' // CLL
U2 M x' U M2 U' // 1st LR
x F' M U M U' F // 2nd LR
M' U' M U' M' U' M2 U2 M' U M2 U M2 U' // LSE
40 STM

Scramble: L2 U F2 D2 F2 D' F2 L2 D' R2 B2 U2 R F2 D2 B' U2 R U' L
U M2 F' R' U' R U R' // Skis
F R U' R' U' R U R' F' // CLL
U2 x' U2 M U' M2 U' x M U' M2 x U M2 u' M E' // LR
x' U M U' M' U' M' U M2 U M' // LSE
41 STM

Scramble: F2 D L2 F2 L2 F' U2 F' R2 B' D2 B2 L2 D' L2 R F2 L F' U2
(x2 y)
L' U R' U L // Skis
y F' R U R' U' R' F R // CLL
M2 u R2 z M U2 x U M2 U' // LR
z y U' M U M' U2 M U' M2 U' // LSE
30 STM!

Scramble: U2 F L2 U2 F D2 R2 D2 L2 U2 B2 R' D' U' L F L R2 D F2
(z y')
R' U2 B' R U' R U2 R' U R' U' R // Skis
U2 R U' R' F R' F' R // CLL
y' R2 E' R2 D U' M2 x U' M U2 M2 U' // LR
x' M' U M' U2 M U M2 U2 M U M2 U' M U2 M u' U // LSE
48 STM

Scramble: B2 U2 L U2 L F2 L2 B2 F2 D2 L U L' F L' F2 L2 R' B2
(y2)
R2 U2 F' R B' F2 // Skis
U R2 D R' U2 R D' R' U2 R' // CLL
U M' U // LR Pair
x y U2 M' U' // LR Pair
S2 M' U' // Align
y' x' U M' U M U' // EO
M2 U2 M // L/R
U' M2 U M2 U' // 4c
38 STM

CLL Algorithms:
2x2 CLL http://algdb.net/puzzle/222/cll
Most algs are from 2x2 CLL,
but some are from CMLL because a few algs mess up DR
AND RUD move algorithms are usable and nice on 3x3 but not 2x2.

Useful LR phase tricks:
x U M2 U’ - Open up and insert edge pair
F M’ U M U’ F’ - Slot to solve two peices
R2 E' R2 - Change permutation of E layer
R U M’ U’ R’ - Slot to solve one piece
- And basically anything that’s <6 moves can be a useful trick! Try to explore the cube yourself to find more!

Last edited:

#### Etotheipi

##### Member
Its interesting,it lr is kinda annoying, but maybe people could develop algs for that.

#### WoowyBaby

##### Member
Its interesting,it lr is kinda annoying, but maybe people could develop algs for that.
For the Skis Method?
No, I don’t know what you’re thinking, it’s an intuitive step, there no way to make LR algorithms.
It’s like trying to make an alg set for CFOP Cross, it just doesn’t make sense.

##### Member
Possible Yau3 idea I had. No idea if it will work.:
1) Build Roux 1x2x3 block on left.
2) Use <R, U, r, M> to solve FD, BD, & F & B centers intuitively. This can be done usually pretty quickly & resembles Yau centers.
2a) EO maybe?
3) Solve rest of cube with CFOP.

#### WoowyBaby

##### Member
Have you tested this with real solves? Everyone in this thread should actually test their ideas before spitting out whatever.
Edit: I regret saying this

Last edited:

##### Member
Have you tested this with real solves? Everyone in this thread should actually test their ideas before spitting out whatever.
I don't know Roux yet so the block felt awkward.

#### WoowyBaby

##### Member
I don't know Roux yet so the block felt awkward.
Alright. I'm sorry if I sound mean. I do think that the first steps is a pretty cool way to get to EO2x2x3, and it might actually be better than doing 2x2x2->2x2x3->EO which is what most people would do. Seems nice!
Solving the rest with CFOP would consist of DR edge, RB pair, RF pair, OCLL, PLL, which is fast

#### Etotheipi

##### Member
For the Skis Method?
No, I don’t know what you’re thinking, it’s an intuitive step, there no way to make LR algorithms.
It’s like trying to make an alg set for CFOP Cross, it just doesn’t make sense.
Maybe im just dumb, but lr is kinda hard for me to do intitively. And i dont think comparing it to cfop cross is very accuarate. Cross has probably hundreds of cases where as lr has maybe 20-30 cases, maybe less. Plus, cross is much easier to do jntuitively. But again, maybe im just dumb. =D

#### Etotheipi

##### Member
Possible Yau3 idea I had. No idea if it will work.:
1) Build Roux 1x2x3 block on left.
2) Use <R, U, r, M> to solve FD, BD, & F & B centers intuitively. This can be done usually pretty quickly & resembles Yau centers.
2a) EO maybe?
3) Solve rest of cube with CFOP.
This is quite similar to petrus except with a different way of constructing the 2x2x3. I dont now yau, so i cant really tell which is more similar, but it does look a lot like petrus. =D

#### WoowyBaby

##### Member
Maybe im just dumb, but lr is kinda hard for me to do intitively. And i dont think comparing it to cfop cross is very accuarate. Cross has probably hundreds of cases where as lr has maybe 20-30 cases, maybe less. Plus, cross is much easier to do jntuitively. But again, maybe im just dumb. =D

It actually is pretty comparable to Cross because you’re dealing with 4 edges and none/not many other edges are solved.
Edit: Algs for when there’s just like one edge missing or something actually might be useful

If you’re not very good at it, at first I wasn’t either, don’t worry you’re not dumb
To help with understanding, do an x rotation and kinda think you’re doing Roux LSE and take two edges that share a color, example red-green and orange-green. Solve them to DF and DB (meaning green on bottom) using M, U, Bw, moves to make the LR Pair, then find the blue pieces and do a similar thing. There are of course other ways to do it too!
Hope you understand this step more!

Last edited:

#### Etotheipi

##### Member
It actually is pretty comparable to Cross because you’re dealing with 4 edges and none/not many other edges are solved.
Edit: Algs for when there’s just like one edge missing or something actually might be useful

If you’re not very good at it, at first I wasn’t either, don’t worry you’re not dumb
To help with understanding, do an x rotation and kinda think you’re doing Roux LSE and take two edges that share a color, example red-green and orange-green. Solve them to DF and DB (meaning green on bottom) using M, U, Bw moves to make the LR Pair, then find the blue pieces and do a similar thing. There are of course other ways to do it too!
Hope you understand this step more!
Ok lol. For some reason i was assuming all the edges were in the e layer lol. I wasnt thinking straight. Btw thx for the follow. ill try it agian, hoperully i can do it properly. =D

#### Thom S.

##### Member
Possible Yau3 idea I had. No idea if it will work.:
1) Build Roux 1x2x3 block on left.
2) Use <R, U, r, M> to solve FD, BD, & F & B centers intuitively. This can be done usually pretty quickly & resembles Yau centers.
2a) EO maybe?
3) Solve rest of cube with CFOP.

It's called Leor

#### WoowyBaby

##### Member
Bump- I added a explanation video and more example solves to my main Skis Method post

Scramble: L2 U F2 D2 F2 D' F2 L2 D' R2 B2 U2 R F2 D2 B' U2 R U' L
U M2 F' R' U' R U R' // Skis
F R U' R' U' R U R' F' // CLL
U2 x' U2 M U' M2 U' x M U' M2 x U M2 u' M E' // LR
x' U M U' M' U' M' U M2 U M' // LSE
41 STM

Scramble: B2 U2 L U2 L F2 L2 B2 F2 D2 L U L' F L' F2 L2 R' B2
(y2)
R2 U2 F' R B' F2 // Skis
U R2 D R' U2 R D' R' U2 R' // CLL
U M' U // LR Pair
x y U2 M' U' // LR Pair
S2 M' U' // Align
y' x' U M' U M U' // EO
M2 U2 M // L/R
U' M2 U M2 U' // 4c
38 STM

Scramble: U2 F L2 U2 F D2 R2 D2 L2 U2 B2 R' D' U' L F L R2 D F2
(z y')
R' U2 B' R U' R U2 R' U R' U' R // Skis
U2 R U' R' F R' F' R // CLL
y' R2 E' R2 D U' M2 x U' M U2 M2 U' // LR
x' M' U M' U2 M U M2 U2 M U M2 U' M U2 M u' U // LSE
48 STM

Scramble: F2 D L2 F2 L2 F' U2 F' R2 B' D2 B2 L2 D' L2 R F2 L F' U2
(x2 y)
L' U R' U L // Skis
y F' R U R' U' R' F R // CLL
M2 u R2 z M U2 x U M2 U' // LR
z y U' M U M' U2 M U' M2 U' // LSE
30 STM

Last edited:

#### Sue Doenim

##### Member
LMCF's second step E2L has a lot of cases similar to those of the second step of the Skis method. Those would probably help.