Blindsolving Discussion and Help

[Renslay]

By the way, are you going to Hungarian Open this weekend?

Yes, I'm going. I'm a bit excited, it will be my first time to try to do 4BLD on a competition and my second attempt to do 4BLD ever.

Edited: Dennis, I sent you a PM, but I'm not sure you get it. Where can I check what messages did I send? (I simply can not find it on my profile.)

 

[DennisStrehlau]

I'm not sure you get it.

I got it! Thank you so much.
I just finished my corner algorithms and stuff..Like 3 hours of work..

Greetings, Dennis

 

[drewsopchak]

Oh yeah I guess that could work. I could just imagine a ghost saying that. And obviously I wont confuse it for OO since OO doesn't occur for me.

Outer space.

 

[DrKorbin]

Suppose I know BH for corners. Is it worth to use similar algs for X-centers?
What I do now is: if both centers are not on top and bottom, I place them on one line (make them interchangable), then do a pure comm (well, in most cases).
If one center is on bottom, another on side, then I place bottom center opposite to buffer and do a pure comm.
If one on top, another on side, then I do pure comm.

Will using BH for X-centers really speed me up?

 

[Mike Hughey]

Suppose I know BH for corners. Is it worth to use similar algs for X-centers?
What I do now is: if both centers are not on top and bottom, I place them on one line (make them interchangable), then do a pure comm (well, in most cases).
If one center is on bottom, another on side, then I place bottom center opposite to buffer and do a pure comm.
If one on top, another on side, then I do pure comm.

Will using BH for X-centers really speed me up?

I do something similar, and I have not bothered because I don't think it will make a very big difference. The number of moves difference is quite small. I think the bigger deal is: if you do a setup move, do you have to think separately about the setup move, or is it all one fluid algorithm? If it's all one fluid algorithm, it'll probably make hardly any difference at all, but if you have a separate thinking step, it might really help. At your speed, I doubt it would make much difference. But I'm not as fast as you, so what do I know?

 

[A Leman]

For DF->FU->BD, I do:
z' F M' F R2 F' M F R2 F2 z

It's just a BH commutator, but it feels a little like an M2 alg.

And Dennis, that's actually how I made the transition to BH edges. I started by doing this "optimized M2" sort of thing. Once you get it fully optimized, you find that, in a lot of cases, if you count M2 as a single slice move, you're already doing BH. Many of these optimized M2 algorithms for 3-cycles are fully optimized commutators from a slice turn count perspective. So once you get all of them down, you start working at replacing the bad ones with true BH algorithms, and before you know it, you're full BH.

These M slice algs are one of the only places I use things like UM’UM’U’MU’M’U’MU2MU’ instead of BH. It's a Roux thing

 

[Moops]

What is an effective way to memorize edges for 4BLD? I'm struggling to see which edges need to go where.
based on their orientation. I'm using letter pair images to memo only the permutation.

 

[DrKorbin]

I do something similar, and I have not bothered because I don't think it will make a very big difference. The number of moves difference is quite small. I think the bigger deal is: if you do a setup move, do you have to think separately about the setup move, or is it all one fluid algorithm? If it's all one fluid algorithm, it'll probably make hardly any difference at all, but if you have a separate thinking step, it might really help. At your speed, I doubt it would make much difference. But I'm not as fast as you, so what do I know?

Ok, thank you! I'll try to learn (as well as BH for corners ).

What is an effective way to memorize edges for 4BLD? I'm struggling to see which edges need to go where.
based on their orientation. I'm using letter pair images to memo only the permutation.

You need to memorize only permutation. A wing cannot be suited on it's place with wrong orientation (it even cannot be physically suited there).

 

[DrKorbin]

After some thinking and learning, I decided that the method I'm using now is not bad. Almost every X-center 3-cycle I can do with 10 moves or less, so I just thought out how to do optimally all the rest cases. Besides, some of those BH algs for X-centers are not finger friendly for me, in contrast to BH for corners.

 

[Moops]

You need to memorize only permutation. A wing cannot be suited on it's place with wrong orientation (it even cannot be physically suited there).

I'm aware of that, sorry, my question wasn't clear enough. I'll use an example.

Assuming i'm using r2 for edges, with Green on front and White on top.
The piece in my buffer (DFr) has Blue on the front sticker and Orange on the bottom sticker.
It belongs in either BLu or BLd. How do I know for certain where this piece has to go?

 

[DrKorbin]

I'm aware of that, sorry, my question wasn't clear enough. I'll use an example.

Assuming i'm using r2 for edges, with Green on front and White on top.
The piece in my buffer (DFr) has Blue on the front sticker and Orange on the bottom sticker.
It belongs in either BLu or BLd. How do I know for certain where this piece has to go?

Orange on bottom and Blue on front, ok. Rotate your cube so it will be Orange on top and Blue on front. The piece you want is UFl, on the left. Now put a finger on it and rotate a cube back. Your finger is on BLu.
By the time, you will learn it by heart and won't use fingers and rotations.

 

[Henrik]

I'm aware of that, sorry, my question wasn't clear enough. I'll use an example.

Assuming i'm using r2 for edges, with Green on front and White on top.
The piece in my buffer (DFr) has Blue on the front sticker and Orange on the bottom sticker.
It belongs in either BLu or BLd. How do I know for certain where this piece has to go?

BLu

"Fastet" way to get there is F L2
so from DFr apply F gives you FLd
L2 gives you BLu

you could also look at the shortest way to the "target" (r2 away)
so that would be a B' move

with practice and many solves you just start to see stuff like this I guess (I am not there yet, I use the "shortest way to target" "method")

 

[Moops]

Thank you both. I'm starting to understand this now.

 

[Cubenovice]

you could also look at the shortest way to the "target" (r2 away)
so that would be a B' move

this is what I used to do.
I think this is what typically is referred to as "tracing".

For me the blue orange edge has targets:
Orange= X
Blue = W
In time you will just know where W and X need to go = knowing your full lettering scheme

and then r2 becomes just the same as executing M2 on 3x3

 

[CubeLord]

Alternates

http://skarrie.se/edges/

What are some alternate 3-style algorithms that work for the following cases. For some reason, these algorithms don't work for me

UF FR BL

UF FR DL

 

[cubernya]

Both of those work for me

 

[riffz]

http://skarrie.se/edges/

What are some alternate 3-style algorithms that work for the following cases. For some reason, these algorithms don't work for me

UF FR BL

UF FR DL

UF FR BL should be R U' R' z' M2 U L U' M2 z

You can also do z M2 U R U' M2 U R' U' z'

Other one works fine.

 

[CubeLord]

How many corner and edge cycles are there with UF and UBL as buffers?

 

[vd]

How many corner and edge cycles are there with UF and UBL as buffers?

If you mean BH/freestyle, then it is 440 for edges and 378 for corners.

 

[A Leman]

How many corner and edge cycles are there with UF and UBL as buffers?

The same as with any fixed buffer
corners 7*6*3^2=378 cases
edges 11*10*2^2=440 cases

440+378=818 cases