TheNextFeliks
Veteran
I avg like 2:15 with about 1 min memo. Which should I work on more memo or execution? How should I improve it?
Blindsolving Discussion and Help
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etshy
Veteran
Both , Memo could easily get SUB30 if you're using a stable image system
execution is slow , M2/OP should be around 40~45 secs
How to inprove memo is only by practicing and pushing your memo , and try to decrease the time of thinking of images , let it be very natural to you by practicing a lot
To improve Execution I have no idea
I still turn slowly , you need some tips from some one really fast in turning , not me sorryrandomtypos
Regular
switch to m2 on edges if you already haven't.
push memo to around 30s, then switch to 3-style corners
TheNextFeliks
Veteran
I use m2. I am now at 1:50 with about 40 second memo. Started incorporating a few easy cycles.
JianhanC
Veteran
I'm dabbling in multi, and don't do 3BLD much because I feel that it will place too much emphasis on the memo ( I use the first location in my memo for 3BLD), and neglect using the other locations. But when I do do 3BLD occasionally between multis, memo is a lot faster (rather a moot point). So my question is, should I consciously pursue 3BLD, and risk underdeveloping my multi memo system?
Another question: what is the alg to fix the m2 parity on 5x5?
Another question: what is the alg to fix the m2 parity on 5x5?
Last edited:
JF1zl3
Veteran
Has anyone ever thought of using a letter scheme in which the 6 vowels are placed on the 6 special targets for M2? (FU, UF, UB, BU, BD, DB)
I could see this being useful because anytime you hit a vowel you will know that you need to take a more algorithmic approach towards the target rather than doing what you would do for an outer or inner target. Obviously once you learn to do them automatically this will be of no use to you, but when learning how targets work in the early stages of BLD, this may give a boost in memorizing how targets work.
A negative effect of this lettering scheme is that you would lose the easy flow of going clockwise around each side counting a letter down from the alphabet to find whatever target you're BLD seeking, but I see it as being analogous to learning DVORAK or QWERTY keyboards. They don't have the simple flow of going A,B,C,D... from left to right, but yet many people have them memorized very fluently, and thus I feel this could be applied to the cube to help you better yourself in knowing how targets behave.
I guess an even more general question, what other types of lettering schemes are out there? I tried the wiki and could only find speff's.
I am currently working on building an excel spreadsheet of all the letter pairs from scratch and I was wondering, is there ever a need for the combination AA or BB or anything? I have those spots blacked out. I also have all the pairs in which the two letters occur on the same cubie marked in either blue or red depending on if its an edge or a corner. you know what, here is a picture:
I do have the blank version of this saved if anyone would like to start their own spreadsheet.
And I was ALSO wondering, has the following ever been proposed:
A type of system in which each letter pair has two (maybe 3) different words associated with it, one being a noun, one being a verb, and whatever else one might feel necessary And during memo they can more easily transform a set of Pairs into a story because each word can be placed at any point in the sentence and be grammatically (more or less) correct.
An example of why this would be necesarry would be when you get a memo consisting EXCLUSIVELY of nouns. This constantly happens to me, because I always create nouns for some reason. Like on JM i would make maybe Jim, instead of maybe JuMp. But if JM was drilled into my head to be BOTH of those, then I could use each interchangeably!
I could see this being useful because anytime you hit a vowel you will know that you need to take a more algorithmic approach towards the target rather than doing what you would do for an outer or inner target. Obviously once you learn to do them automatically this will be of no use to you, but when learning how targets work in the early stages of BLD, this may give a boost in memorizing how targets work.
A negative effect of this lettering scheme is that you would lose the easy flow of going clockwise around each side counting a letter down from the alphabet to find whatever target you're BLD seeking, but I see it as being analogous to learning DVORAK or QWERTY keyboards. They don't have the simple flow of going A,B,C,D... from left to right, but yet many people have them memorized very fluently, and thus I feel this could be applied to the cube to help you better yourself in knowing how targets behave.
I guess an even more general question, what other types of lettering schemes are out there? I tried the wiki and could only find speff's.
I am currently working on building an excel spreadsheet of all the letter pairs from scratch and I was wondering, is there ever a need for the combination AA or BB or anything? I have those spots blacked out. I also have all the pairs in which the two letters occur on the same cubie marked in either blue or red depending on if its an edge or a corner. you know what, here is a picture:
I do have the blank version of this saved if anyone would like to start their own spreadsheet.
And I was ALSO wondering, has the following ever been proposed:
A type of system in which each letter pair has two (maybe 3) different words associated with it, one being a noun, one being a verb, and whatever else one might feel necessary And during memo they can more easily transform a set of Pairs into a story because each word can be placed at any point in the sentence and be grammatically (more or less) correct.
An example of why this would be necesarry would be when you get a memo consisting EXCLUSIVELY of nouns. This constantly happens to me, because I always create nouns for some reason. Like on JM i would make maybe Jim, instead of maybe JuMp. But if JM was drilled into my head to be BOTH of those, then I could use each interchangeably!
DrKorbin
Veteran
And I was ALSO wondering, has the following ever been proposed:
A type of system in which each letter pair has two (maybe 3) different words associated with it, one being a noun, one being a verb, and whatever else one might feel necessary And during memo they can more easily transform a set of Pairs into a story because each word can be placed at any point in the sentence and be grammatically (more or less) correct.
An example of why this would be necesarry would be when you get a memo consisting EXCLUSIVELY of nouns. This constantly happens to me, because I always create nouns for some reason. Like on JM i would make maybe Jim, instead of maybe JuMp. But if JM was drilled into my head to be BOTH of those, then I could use each interchangeably!
This is Person-Action-Object (PAO). I think Mike Hughey use (or used) it.
JF1zl3
Veteran
Thank you, I will look it up.
Cubenovice
Forever Slow
U' F2 U M2 U' F2 U
and
y2 R U R' U' Rw2 F2 U2 r2 U2 F2 Rw2 U R U' R'
Edit: and here is an example 5x5x5 BLD solve that includes parity. I wrote it sometime last year:
This is scramble 1 from BLD race 2012-30
Bw2 R Uw U2 F2 L R2 D' F L2 Dw2 U' B' L' Bw Dw' Lw' U2 R2 B Fw' D' Uw2 L D2 Uw L2 U R' B2 L Bw2 Dw2 R2 D Bw' Fw Lw2 Fw2 F2 Dw' R' Fw L B' Fw' D Uw Lw2 B F' Uw2 Lw2 B Lw' Rw' F' L U B'
Full solve written out under spoiler tag, letters after // are my letter-pairs.
Parity fixes in bold.
z2 // orient
// x-centers commutators
R' l u l' U' l u' l' U R // DF
D2 r' u2 r' U2 r u2 r' U2 r r D2 // KV
B r U r' u2 r U' r' u2 B' // IE
b' u b U2 b' u' b U2 // GC
D r r U2 r' d2 r U2 r' d2 r' D' // SN
L2 r U2 r' d r U2 r' d' L2 // TB
f' d2 f U' f' d2 f U // QJ
D' r' r' U r d r' U' r d' r D // PU
L r' U r d' r' U' r d L' // RW
R' f' U2 f d f' U2 f d' R // HX
D2 r' d' r' U r d r' U' r r D2 // OM
r d2 r' U r d2 r' U' // XD
// + centers commutators
M' u' M'U M u M' U' M M // BV
S u' S' U' S u S' U // AK
Rw b U b' E b U' b' E' Rw' //HS
S' u' S U2 S' u S U2 // ED
E' b U b' E b U' b' // CF
L M d M' U' M d' M' U L' // LG
L' E r U2 r' E' r U2 r' L // WI
d' M' U' M d M' U M // QT
b' b' U b E b' U' b E' b //PR
E r' U2 r E2 r' U2 r E // UO
D2 r' r' U2 r E' r' U2 r E r D2 // MO
// Wings r2
L2 B L2 B' r2 B L2 B' L2 // U
B' R B r2 B' R' B // B
r2 // G
F d R U R' d' R U' R' F' r2 // P
U' L U r2 U' L' U // V
B' R B U R2 U' r2 U R2 U' B' R' B // H
B L2 B' r2 B L2 B' // T
U R' U' r2 U R U' // W
l2 B' R B U R2 U' r2 U R2 U' B' R' B l2 // L
U' L' U r2 U' L U // S
B' R2 B r2 B' R2 B // Q
R2 U R2 U' r2 U R2 U' R2 // A
r2 // G
U R U' r2 U R' U' // R break into new cycle
R2 B' R2 B r2 B' R2 B R2 // X
L2 U' L2 U r2 U' L2 U L2 // E
U' L2 U r2 U' L2 U // M
l B' R B U R2 U' r2 U R2 U' B' R' B l' // O
l' B' R B U R2 U' r2 U R2 U' B' R' B l // C
r2 F R U R' d R U' R' d'F' // D
B' R' B r2 B'R B // J
U R U' r2 U R' U' // R
B L' B' r2 B L B' // F break into new cycle
U R2 U' r2 U R2 U' // I
B L B' r2 B L' B' // N
B L' B' r2 B L B' // F
// Midges M2
U' L2 U M2 U' L2 U // M
U R U' M2 U R' U' // R
L2 B L2 B' M2 B L2 B' L2 // U
M2 // G
B' R B M2 B' R' B // B break into new cycle
U' L' U M2 U' L U // S
U R' U' M2 U R U' // W
B' R B M2 B' R' B // B
B L' B' M2 B L B' // F break into new cycle
D M' U R2 U' M U R2 U' D' M2 // P
B L' B' M2 B L B' // F
U' F2 U M2 U' F2 U // parity
M' M' U' M' U' M' U2 M U' M U' M U2 M // flip D
// Corners Old Pochmann
D' R U' R' U' R U R' F' R U R' U' R' F R D // R
D R2 U' R' U' R U R' F' R U R' U' R' F D' // T
D F' R U' R' U' R U R' F' R U R' U' R' F R F D' // M
R' F R U' R' U' R U R' F' R U R' U' R' F R F' R // E
F R' R U' R' U' R U R' F' R U R' U' R' F R R F' // J
F' R U' R' U' R U R' F' R U R' U' R' F R F // V
F R U' R' U' R U R' F' R U R' U' R' F R F' // G
// parity fix
y2 R U R' U' Rw2 F2 U2 r2 U2 F2 Rw2 U R U' R'
// x-centers commutators
R' l u l' U' l u' l' U R // DF
D2 r' u2 r' U2 r u2 r' U2 r r D2 // KV
B r U r' u2 r U' r' u2 B' // IE
b' u b U2 b' u' b U2 // GC
D r r U2 r' d2 r U2 r' d2 r' D' // SN
L2 r U2 r' d r U2 r' d' L2 // TB
f' d2 f U' f' d2 f U // QJ
D' r' r' U r d r' U' r d' r D // PU
L r' U r d' r' U' r d L' // RW
R' f' U2 f d f' U2 f d' R // HX
D2 r' d' r' U r d r' U' r r D2 // OM
r d2 r' U r d2 r' U' // XD
// + centers commutators
M' u' M'U M u M' U' M M // BV
S u' S' U' S u S' U // AK
Rw b U b' E b U' b' E' Rw' //HS
S' u' S U2 S' u S U2 // ED
E' b U b' E b U' b' // CF
L M d M' U' M d' M' U L' // LG
L' E r U2 r' E' r U2 r' L // WI
d' M' U' M d M' U M // QT
b' b' U b E b' U' b E' b //PR
E r' U2 r E2 r' U2 r E // UO
D2 r' r' U2 r E' r' U2 r E r D2 // MO
// Wings r2
L2 B L2 B' r2 B L2 B' L2 // U
B' R B r2 B' R' B // B
r2 // G
F d R U R' d' R U' R' F' r2 // P
U' L U r2 U' L' U // V
B' R B U R2 U' r2 U R2 U' B' R' B // H
B L2 B' r2 B L2 B' // T
U R' U' r2 U R U' // W
l2 B' R B U R2 U' r2 U R2 U' B' R' B l2 // L
U' L' U r2 U' L U // S
B' R2 B r2 B' R2 B // Q
R2 U R2 U' r2 U R2 U' R2 // A
r2 // G
U R U' r2 U R' U' // R break into new cycle
R2 B' R2 B r2 B' R2 B R2 // X
L2 U' L2 U r2 U' L2 U L2 // E
U' L2 U r2 U' L2 U // M
l B' R B U R2 U' r2 U R2 U' B' R' B l' // O
l' B' R B U R2 U' r2 U R2 U' B' R' B l // C
r2 F R U R' d R U' R' d'F' // D
B' R' B r2 B'R B // J
U R U' r2 U R' U' // R
B L' B' r2 B L B' // F break into new cycle
U R2 U' r2 U R2 U' // I
B L B' r2 B L' B' // N
B L' B' r2 B L B' // F
// Midges M2
U' L2 U M2 U' L2 U // M
U R U' M2 U R' U' // R
L2 B L2 B' M2 B L2 B' L2 // U
M2 // G
B' R B M2 B' R' B // B break into new cycle
U' L' U M2 U' L U // S
U R' U' M2 U R U' // W
B' R B M2 B' R' B // B
B L' B' M2 B L B' // F break into new cycle
D M' U R2 U' M U R2 U' D' M2 // P
B L' B' M2 B L B' // F
U' F2 U M2 U' F2 U // parity
M' M' U' M' U' M' U2 M U' M U' M U2 M // flip D
// Corners Old Pochmann
D' R U' R' U' R U R' F' R U R' U' R' F R D // R
D R2 U' R' U' R U R' F' R U R' U' R' F D' // T
D F' R U' R' U' R U R' F' R U R' U' R' F R F D' // M
R' F R U' R' U' R U R' F' R U R' U' R' F R F' R // E
F R' R U' R' U' R U R' F' R U R' U' R' F R R F' // J
F' R U' R' U' R U R' F' R U R' U' R' F R F // V
F R U' R' U' R U R' F' R U R' U' R' F R F' // G
// parity fix
y2 R U R' U' Rw2 F2 U2 r2 U2 F2 Rw2 U R U' R'
Last edited:
Ollie
Legend
1. Yes, there probably is some value to that sort of lettering when it comes to teaching. It does, however, prevent you from developing 'your own' lettering scheme somewhat since you have to build around the vowels. The result might not be as intuitive as Speff's or whatever you might come up with my yourself and thus you would have to 'learn' your lettering scheme which makes BLD harder in the early stages. Once you have your own lettering scheme that you can recite perfectly and automatically, like you've already acknowledged, you will always know that G, M or X will relate to the M-slice, for example.
2. Double letters may be useful for solving other puzzles BLD where there the total of a particular set of pieces is greater than the number of letters in the alphabet, such as on the Megaminx. The wiki letter pairs list already accommodates for these.
3. Yes. It is also a key idea of the Dominic System. Most of my letter pairs relate to a person or an object where applying the relative verb of that word also works. i.e. AB CD could be Abba listening to a CD. Similarly CD AB could be a CD performing an Abba song.
I also have a lot of letter pairs where multiple images can be used interchangeably. AD could be my friend Adam, an advert or someone adding two things together.
JF1zl3
Veteran
Thank you Ollie, that does help a lot. I can definitely see the sentence method working on me a lot better than the methods I have been trying.
A Leman
Veteran
1) probably, I don't see how it would be that helpful.
2)I lettered in the order UF,FU,UL,LU,UB,BU=a,b,c,d,e,f It works fine for me.
3)The letters with 2 targets on the same piece will be used for big bld. and I would also describe a flipped UL edge as DiCe for multi. for stuff like AA, I am thinking about using it for floating buffers, but I am really not at the point where I should practice that. I have not found good images for all of these yet (I am missing ii, uu, ww)
4)I have trouble remembering verbs. I do have multiple images that work for some of my pairs though. I also remember reading Simon Reinhard explaining why he dislikes prepared verbs and I respect his opinion.
etshy
Veteran
I'm Familiar with 4BLD and 5BLD , and I guess 6BLD throw 9BLD won't be any difference except more pieces to memorize , but I can't imagine how I can get AA or BB ,,etc , can you give an example of this if you have time
?
Cubenovice
Forever Slow
I Letter clockwise:
Around layers for edges: UR, RU, UF, FU, UL, LU, UB, BU = a b c d e f g h
I started "lettering" at UR because I initially started BLD with Old Pochman and a was my buffer piece.
Then I continu on D: DR, RD, DF, FD, DL, LD, DB, BD = i j k l m n o p
leaves just the E slice edges: RF, FR, FL, LF, LB, BL, BR, RB = q r s t u v w x
Corners I labelled clockwise around the cubie:
OP buffer ULB= a b c then continue clockwise around the face: URB = d e f, URF = g h i; UFL = j k l, DBL = m n o, DLB = p q r, DFR = s t u and finally DLF = v w x
ULB = a b c means:
ULB cubie: sticker at U = a , sticker at L = b and sticker at B = c
Works fine for me
You can "letter" however you want but especially at the beginning it helps when there is some sort of system to it.
This allows you to identify letters by "reasoning" if you do not yet know your letters by heart.
Around layers for edges: UR, RU, UF, FU, UL, LU, UB, BU = a b c d e f g h
I started "lettering" at UR because I initially started BLD with Old Pochman and a was my buffer piece.
Then I continu on D: DR, RD, DF, FD, DL, LD, DB, BD = i j k l m n o p
leaves just the E slice edges: RF, FR, FL, LF, LB, BL, BR, RB = q r s t u v w x
Corners I labelled clockwise around the cubie:
OP buffer ULB= a b c then continue clockwise around the face: URB = d e f, URF = g h i; UFL = j k l, DBL = m n o, DLB = p q r, DFR = s t u and finally DLF = v w x
ULB = a b c means:
ULB cubie: sticker at U = a , sticker at L = b and sticker at B = c
Works fine for me
You can "letter" however you want but especially at the beginning it helps when there is some sort of system to it.
This allows you to identify letters by "reasoning" if you do not yet know your letters by heart.
A Leman
Veteran
I'm Familiar with 4BLD and 5BLD , and I guess 6BLD throw 9BLD won't be any difference except more pieces to memorize , but I can't imagine how I can get AA or BB ,,etc , can you give an example of this if you have time
He asked about both the double pairs like AA which I don't use, but may use for buffers in the future and for "letter pairs that have 2 targets on the same piece" like UFR,RUF which would be DE for me which would be a Center Comm.
Cubenovice
Forever Slow
I'm Familiar with 4BLD and 5BLD , and I guess 6BLD throw 9BLD won't be any difference except more pieces to memorize , but I can't imagine how I can get AA or BB ,,etc , can you give an example of this if you have time
The piece you quoted related to two target on the same piece, this is not AA or BB but rather DC for a flipped edge or twisted corner.
AA could be at a switch between corners and edges but typically you would break your memo to be able to seperate them.
AA could be usefull if you do OP corners on big bld, you may need to shoot twice to the same target to bring your centers back to the original position
TheOneOnTheLeft
tOOtl
Maybe inuit for ii. Just a suggestion.
etshy
Veteran
That clears up a lot , thanks
The piece you quoted related to two target on the same piece, this is not AA or BB but rather DC for a flipped edge or twisted corner.
AA could be at a switch between corners and edges but typically you would break your memo to be able to seperate them.
AA could be usefull if you do OP corners on big bld, you may need to shoot twice to the same target to bring your centers back to the original position
Exactly , i was sure that there is no way I can get the same Letter , that's what confused me , but I didn't think about using it in OP corners to bring my centers back , I solve corners last so that I can escape from this problem
thanks for the clarification
Cubenovice
Forever Slow
I solve corners last so that I can escape from this problem
I used to too...
But now I solve them first so I don't have to memo corners too deep.
Memo last, solve first and poof, they are forgotten
Really saves time but you must control the center position by either doing nothing, shoot a double target or leave one corner unsolved until the end of the solve (+fix parity)
A Leman
Veteran
I used to too...
But now I solve them first so I don't have to memo corners too deep.
Memo last, solve first and poof, they are forgotten
Really saves time but you must control the center position by either doing nothing, shoot a double target or leave one corner unsolved until the end of the solve (+fix parity)
Oleg gave me a good idea for corners. I cross my legs if I have parity and I check after centers for 4bld or at the end of the solve for 5bld wheather my legs are crossed or not.
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