The New Method / Substep / Concept Idea Thread

[_zoux]

Here's an idea: NMF2L (non-matching F2L)
Here's an example of what I mean:

setup: B2 L' R' B' D2 R B2 D B L' R F' R' D' F R' D z2

You can see that there is a 4-move white cross. But, look at the Right side: There's a 2x2x1 block. Let's go about the solve and pretend that the yellow/orange edge is solved, and the corner-edge pair with it is also solved. Now we have a 1-move X-cross! Here's how you would go about doing this (make sure you did the z2 in the setup!)

L // X-cross
y' R' U' R // F2L-2
R U' R' U R U R' // F2L-3
d R U R' U' R U R' // F2L-4
U S' L' U' L U L F' L' f // OLL (recognition is the same if you pretend white and yellow are the same)
Nb perm // PLL
Now just AUF and fix the F2L with an L2!

That's NMB.

 

[Thom S.]

That's NMB.

NMB is the term for about every method except CFOP

 

[Neuro]

NMF2L may be good with an excellent recog system but it might be best to use it only when it’s off by a <RFBL>2. It still has decent recognition at this stage even on OLL/PLL. If it’s off by a single turn it’s usually quite hard to recognize cases

 

[Hazel]

Random idea, not sure if this is any good or not:
1) Petrus block vertically in back-left along with solving FL and RB edges
2) Solve the rest of F2L (ignoring FR and FRD pieces) without breaking up the 2x2x1 on U
3a) Insert FR while solving EO, without breaking up the 2x2x1 – this is super easy and intuitive, 6 moves maximum for every case.
3b) L6P – shouldn't be too many algorithms

 

[_zoux]

NMB is the term for about every method except CFOP

It's still same, no sence to make a new name for it.

NMF2L may be good with an excellent recog system but it might be best to use it only when it’s off by a <RFBL>2. It still has decent recognition at this stage even on OLL/PLL. If it’s off by a single turn it’s usually quite hard to recognize cases

Recognition is very easy, just like a CN cross.

 

[@Ratas]

Great idea to cut down on the number of algs; in fact I'll probably use this while I'm learning full L7E, but it's not the most efficient. Been working on L7E really hard for the last couple of days so I'll present those algs this weekend. With rotational symmetry and AUFs there are exactly 125 unique cases, many of which are just one of the baseline cases with a couple of M or U moves tacked on to the end.

Sounds interesting; I have no idea how you're gonna do this but GL btw I've actually been making the L7E algs on a seperate sheet that's much better organized than the one you had, so I'll show that to you tonight. Recently I've also come up with a BOPE L8E method and a mega-efficient squan method that's based off of HD, so I'll show you guys those tomorrow.

Do you still remember the steps of that squan method?

 

[Thermex]

Hey everyone, sorry I've been gone for a while, I decided to take a long break from cubing. Anyone able to catch me up on what's happened in the last couple months?

Do you still remember the steps of that squan method?

I'll try to find that for you, I saved it somewhere on my computer.

 

[Duncan Bannon]

Would anyone be interested in a TTCLL for 2x2? Often times having a bar and then 2 corners facing against each other is really bad.

For example do this:

R2 F' U2 F' U F U2 F2 R2 L B2 L' X' Y'

looking at green, its really bad. If you know EG-1 you could do F' R2 U' R2 then rotate and do the EG-1. What if you did a F2 (from this position) then solved the rest in 1 alg. There are 2 cases. One is where the corners are twisted in place and 1 where when twisted it makes an Eg-1 face. I believe both would have 42 cases. Would anyone be interested in me generating some algs. I think they should be pretty nice.

Example solve:
R2 F' U2 F' U F U2 F2 R2

X' Y'
F U2 F- 3/3 - Setup (often this can be done for you, and setting up to this would most likely be worse than making a face, so this should be used like TCLL)
U' F' R' U' F L2 U' R2 F2 L F 11/14( could probably find better alg just for demonstration)

Let me know if I should gen some algs.

Edit- This is only for when the corners face opposite directions.

 

[Thermex]

Would anyone be interested in a TTCLL for 2x2? Often times having a bar and then 2 corners facing against each other is really bad.

For example do this:

R2 F' U2 F' U F U2 F2 R2 L B2 L' X' Y'

looking at green, its really bad. If you know EG-1 you could do F' R2 U' R2 then rotate and do the EG-1. What if you did a F2 (from this position) then solved the rest in 1 alg. There are 2 cases. One is where the corners are twisted in place and 1 where when twisted it makes an Eg-1 face. I believe both would have 42 cases. Would anyone be interested in me generating some algs. I think they should be pretty nice.

Example solve:
R2 F' U2 F' U F U2 F2 R2

X' Y'
F U2 F- 3/3 - Setup (often this can be done for you, and setting up to this would most likely be worse than making a face, so this should be used like TCLL)
U' F' R' U' F L2 U' R2 F2 L F 11/14( could probably find better alg just for demonstration)

Let me know if I should gen some algs.

I've thought of this before, and it's not really worth it. Right now I'm genning Twisty EG algs which are both more ergonomic and more useful in the long run than this.

 

[Duncan Bannon]

Oh yeah? Cool. Twisty EG-2 has been generated here https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet...MxiMX9a506JeAcLnUXZr8FgXAY/edit#gid=158518402 if you didn't know already. Is TEG-1 worth is though? You would have to have 3 sets of 42 algs and then that times 2 for corner permutation, so 252 algs (if I'm not mistaken) and that seem kinda nuts. But then again Will and Vilius are generating LS algs.... So are you doing TEG-1 or TEG-2 algs? I could help if you are looking for any.

 

[Duncan Bannon]

Have you ever thought of non matching layers? In particular opposite colors layers. And even broken down even more a nonmatching layer like this F' R' U2 F U2 F' R2 F' U'

x' R F2 Where F2 solves the bar in relation to the bar in the back (hopefully that makes sense)

then sometimes you can do the CLL (looking at the yellow and white (in this case) like they are the same color) then U' R U2 R' U' R U R' U2 R' F R F' then F2 to solve. Kinda like anti CLL but not a lot of these work out to be CLL cases and like anti cll. but some are impossible cases for CLL. No idea how many aren't. Neat idea. Hope this makes sense. If not, let me know and I should be able to explain.

 

[shadowslice e]

Have you ever thought of non matching layers? In particular opposite colors layers. And even broken down even more a nonmatching layer like this F' R' U2 F U2 F' R2 F' U'

x' R F2 Where F2 solves the bar in relation to the bar in the back (hopefully that makes sense)

then sometimes you can do the CLL (looking at the yellow and white (in this case) like they are the same color) then U' R U2 R' U' R U R' U2 R' F R F' then F2 to solve. Kinda like anti CLL but not a lot of these work out to be CLL cases and like anti cll. but some are impossible cases for CLL. No idea how many aren't. Neat idea. Hope this makes sense. If not, let me know and I should be able to explain.

I do this and BTR sometimes.

 

[Duncan Bannon]

How do you do it if it isn't a CLL? And is BTR, 42 for 2x2?

 

[shadowslice e]

How do you do it if it isn't a CLL? And is BTR, 42 for 2x2?

BTR is reducing L5C using conjugates yes. What do you mean if it's not CLL? I more or less use NMLL.

 

[Duncan Bannon]

I'm not very familiar with NMLL. How would that work for 2x2? Sorry for my lack of research into methods similar to that of my minds creations.

 

[Thermex]

Oh yeah? Cool. Twisty EG-2 has been generated here https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet...MxiMX9a506JeAcLnUXZr8FgXAY/edit#gid=158518402 if you didn't know already. Is TEG-1 worth is though? You would have to have 3 sets of 42 algs and then that times 2 for corner permutation, so 252 algs (if I'm not mistaken) and that seem kinda nuts. But then again Will and Vilius are generating LS algs.... So are you doing TEG-1 or TEG-2 algs? I could help if you are looking for any.

I've been generating Twisty EG-1 algs for about a month now. There are actually 430 algs total (if you count TEG-2) and 8 sets of 43 algs each for TEG-1. I personally think it's worth it, but I'm not really looking back now now that I've already generated 3 out of the 8 sets... Also I've been using NMLL for a while now along with CLL... it messes up recog a bit but I've always assumed it was something that most 2x2 solvers figured out one way or another. It's sorta helpful sometimes when there are no good CLL faces, but I wouldn't really consider it a "new method".

 

[Duncan Bannon]

I've been generating Twisty EG-1 algs for about a month now. There are actually 430 algs total (if you count TEG-2) and 8 sets of 43 algs each for TEG-1. I personally think it's worth it, but I'm not really looking back now now that I've already generated 3 out of the 8 sets...

Cool. What algs do you know? Where are you putting them? And I'd be in to help with the process.

 

[Thermex]

Cool. What algs do you know? Where are you putting them? And I'd be in to help with the process.

So far I've generated the DFR- set (DFR and DFL corners are switched, DFR is twisted out to the right), the DFL- set (DFR and DFL are switched, DFL is twisted out to the left) and about half of the DBL- set (DFR and DFL are switched, DBL is facing out to the left). The algs are really nice, the average is around 8 moves per alg for DFR- and 8.5 moves per alg for DFL- (so far the DBL- set isn't quite as nice, the average alg is about 9 moves). About 15% of the algs are 2-gen and pretty much the rest are 3-gen. I haven't really talked about my progress with anyone yet, but I'd be maybe willing to split the remaining workload with you, it's starting to get really tedious Oh and btw I put all of the algs in a really nicely organized spreadsheet using google docs.

EDIT: Tbh the TEG-2 algs you linked look pretty awful. I plan on re-generating most of them since most of them aren't ergonomic at all.

 

[abunickabhi]

I have been sitting on this concept for a while, and propose a new way of doing the LSE step of the Roux Method.
I am a method neutral solver, with respect for both CFOP and Roux , and secret deep respect for Waterman method.
And I have always thought as to why the LSE method has got the EOLR , Pinky Pie flavour and no flavour from the BLD algs domain.

After all, LSE is 6 edges (=2 3-style algs or even less), and newer ways of recognition can be brought up for LSE.
Till now, people have been struggling , to reduce LSE from 3-look to 2.5-look to 2-look(super pro) level.
But seeing it from a BLD perspective, the recognition will be much faster if you can identify the cycle cases.

I will be trying this out ,and spamming a ao1000 out of this new LSE scheme!

 

[Spencer131]

.
After all, LSE is 6 edges (=2 3-style algs or even less), and newer ways of recognition can be brought up for LSE.

The problem is that it will often take 3 comms to solve lse, just try it for yourself and see. At this point you will probably be using more moves than a standard lse solution.