# [Help Thread]OLL and PLL Discussion

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#### zipper

##### Member
I just did ao5 with full OLL/PLL and without. Without PLL/OLL algs I used only T-perm and Ua-perm for PLL and for OLL sune and F(sexy)F'. With algs avg was 20.32 and without 30.98 seconds. Cube: dayan zhanzhi v5 stickerless, 55mm.

#### F2LCub

##### Member
I use 2 look OLL and PLL. It's much faster to learn than 1-look for obvious reasons.

You wouldn't need full OLL/PLL until probably sub-20.

#### Dude Blu

##### Member
I am now using 2look oll and 2look pll and average is around 35-36 with a pb of 24.67......is it time for me to learn full pll??which is the best order for learning those 21 pll's??

#### KeannyThe6x6

##### Member
I am now using 2look oll and 2look pll and average is around 35-36 with a pb of 24.67......is it time for me to learn full pll??which is the best order for learning those 21 pll's??
Learn the H perm, Z perm and the U perms first. Then learn the Y perm. After that, learn the A perms and the E perm. Next, learn the T perm, J perms, F perm, N perms and R perms. Finally, tackle the G perms.

(Note: This is the order Keanny learned all his PLLs in, so it may not work for you.)

#### One Wheel

##### Member
Learn the H perm, Z perm and the U perms first. Then learn the Y perm. After that, learn the A perms and the E perm. Next, learn the T perm, J perms, F perm, N perms and R perms. Finally, tackle the G perms.

(Note: This is the order Keanny learned all his PLLs in, so it may not work for you.)
H, U, and Z are easy. I'd recommend T and J before E, and A before any of those. You missed V, which I learned at the same time and as a variant of F.

#### greentgoatgal

##### Member
I am now using 2look oll and 2look pll and average is around 35-36 with a pb of 24.67......is it time for me to learn full pll??which is the best order for learning those 21 pll's??
I just learned them all randomly when I averaged 35-40 seconds.

#### ToastasaurusCuber

##### Member
The 2-look case with the headlights never works for me when I try it. The alg is R2 [D (R U2) R] [D' (R U2 R']. After I try the alg to the case it always looks scrambled.

#### Ninja Mango

##### Member
I think you might have written the alg wrong. Here's my alg:
R2 D R' U2 R D' R' U2 R'
Maybe you forgot the prime thing. I dunno. Happy cubing.

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#### ToastasaurusCuber

##### Member
I have it printed off so I don't I forgot a prime or something

#### Ninja Mango

##### Member
Huh. Either way, that alg I posted works.

#### alisterprofitt

##### Member
Here's the video that you probably learned it from:

There, it has the correct alg so I think you just forgot the R's. Easy mistake to make, we've all done it many times.

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#### Ninja Mango

##### Member
I actually do the U2's with my left hand, it works better for me.

#### Duncan Bannon

##### Member
I actually do the U2's with my left hand, it works better for me.
I know your learning CFOP. Learn R2, D2, U2 etc. with both hands. Or you will be like me and have to break month long habits...... Don't be like me.

EDIT- Ooo and M2. I used to crazy suck at H perm. Now it's one of my fav's.

#### Brest

##### Super Reconstructor
Staff member
The 2-look case with the headlights never works for me when I try it. The alg is R2 [D (R U2) R] [D' (R U2 R']. After I try the alg to the case it always looks scrambled.
You are probably doing the D moves in the wrong direction. Here is an animation: R2 D R' U2 R D' R' U2 R'

h2f

#### 1001010101001

##### Member
I just invented a CFOP ZB mashup ...
OLL only has 7 cases if you orient the edges (intuitively) while inserting the last slot. Think sledgehammers and algs like F' U F R U' R' can lead to very fast recognition.

##### Member
I just invented a CFOP ZB mashup ...
OLL only has 7 cases if you orient the edges (intuitively) while inserting the last slot. Think sledgehammers and algs like F' U F R U' R' can lead to very fast recognition.
You mean VHLS?

#### 1001010101001

##### Member
why are all my ideas already taken
It's a reasonably good idea but more or less all the good "low-hanging fruit" has been snapped up by now in some form or another so new stuff tends to be pretty weird (my sig probably demos this pretty well).

#### tnk351

##### Member
Learn 2 look oll and pll before full fridrich.
Knowing how f2l works is a great advantage of figuring out algs yourself.
Using algs you figured out yourself is faster than using pre-invented algorithms.
By these training, you will figure out a trick to memorize algs. Soon you can make it to full fridrich.