#### theROUXbiksCube

##### Member
k4 but for 5x5
http://snk.digibase.ca/k4/ it can be applied to 5x5, but alter the commutators a little bit, it is a hard method, GL if you wish to stick with it

#### PenguinsDontFly

##### Member
isnt this just called K5?

#### Damien Porter

##### Member
Case 1 - just do R' F' # F R where # is how you solve
x x o x x
x x x x x
x x x x x
x x x x x
x x o x x

My alg: R' F' M' U M' U M' U M' U2 M' U M' U M' U M' F R

Case 2 - r B simple comutator B' r'

My alg: r B U' R u R' U R u' R' B' r'

Case 3 is ill defined. Is it a 5 cycle or a 3 cycle and a swap.

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#### TannerZ

##### Member
ummm i am so new to this
case 1: can you explain the # a little more
case 2: what is a comutator?
case 3: can you elaborate on what a 5 cycle or a 3 cycle is?

#### Damien Porter

##### Member
ummm i am so new to this
case 1: can you explain the # a little more
case 2: what is a comutator?
case 3: can you elaborate on what a 5 cycle or a 3 cycle is?
Case 1: # stands for the algorithm that you would use to solve that other case. The idea is if you have to flip two adjacent edges, move 1 so they are opposite, flip them, then return the edge to where it belongs.

Case 2: To understand comutators have a look here at our wiki.

Case 3: a 5 cycle is where you move piece 1 >2>3>4>5>1. This creates a cycle with 5 pieces. In general an n cycle is piece 1>2>...>n>1. You did not say weather case 3 was a 5 cycle or a 3 cycle and a 2 cycle. Even though both pieces that have to move to the right may have the same color, there are unique pieces and must go to the right spot.

Also for cases 1 and 2 I did provide algorithms that could be used.

#### Torch

##### Member
So I measured my splits for 5 5x5 solves, averaged them, and got this:

F2C: 18 (0:18)
L4C: 23 (0:41)
F8E: 53 (1:34)
L4E: 21 (1:55)
3x3: 21 (2:16)

The first time is the number of seconds each step takes, and the time in parentheses is the total elapsed when each step is finished. I average about 2:15-2:20. What steps should I work on?

#### penguinz7

##### Member
So I measured my splits for 5 5x5 solves, averaged them, and got this:

F2C: 18 (0:18)
L4C: 23 (0:41)
F8E: 53 (1:34)
L4E: 21 (1:55)
3x3: 21 (2:16)

The first time is the number of seconds each step takes, and the time in parentheses is the total elapsed when each step is finished. I average about 2:15-2:20. What steps should I work on?
Probably just practice whole solves. Nothing really stands out to me as slow. Maybe your centers, but I don't really know.

#### ryanj92

##### Member
So I measured my splits for 5 5x5 solves, averaged them, and got this:

F2C: 18 (0:18)
L4C: 23 (0:41)
F8E: 53 (1:34)
L4E: 21 (1:55)
3x3: 21 (2:16)

The first time is the number of seconds each step takes, and the time in parentheses is the total elapsed when each step is finished. I average about 2:15-2:20. What steps should I work on?
21 for 3x3x3 stage seems quite slow, considering your 3x3x3 times...
i think your balance between centres and edges times is okay, 21 for l4e is pretty slow though, maybe you need to work on efficiency there?

#### Torch

##### Member
21 for 3x3x3 stage seems quite slow, considering your 3x3x3 times...
i think your balance between centres and edges times is okay, 21 for l4e is pretty slow though, maybe you need to work on efficiency there?

I think the 3x3 stage times can be explained by a combination of having to make a cross without inspection, 5x5s being harder to turn than 3x3s, and my 5x5 in particular being really bad. I'll work on it though.

I just do a whole lot of "slice over, R U R' F R' F' R, slice back" for L4E. Also I have to do the 4x4 parity alg half the time. Is there any way to improve that?

I'll upload a video possibly tonight.

#### ryanj92

##### Member
I think the 3x3 stage times can be explained by a combination of having to make a cross without inspection, 5x5s being harder to turn than 3x3s, and my 5x5 in particular being really bad. I'll work on it though.

I just do a whole lot of "slice over, R U R' F R' F' R, slice back" for L4E. Also I have to do the 4x4 parity alg half the time. Is there any way to improve that?

I'll upload a video possibly tonight.
it's probably worth learning a few more l2e algs! i think most of them are very good (or at least, considerably better than setting up to the common parity and then solving that)
also, M' U2 M is super useful for l4e, especially if nothing's paired at the beginning

#### Torch

##### Member
it's probably worth learning a few more l2e algs! i think most of them are very good (or at least, considerably better than setting up to the common parity and then solving that)
also, M' U2 M is super useful for l4e, especially if nothing's paired at the beginning
Definitely going to start those L2E algs, I just found some of them are algs I already know, like the 4BLD wing parity alg.

And here's a video:

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#### joshsailscga

##### Member
So I measured my splits for 5 5x5 solves, averaged them, and got this:

F2C: 18 (0:18)
L4C: 23 (0:41)
F8E: 53 (1:34)
L4E: 21 (1:55)
3x3: 21 (2:16)

The first time is the number of seconds each step takes, and the time in parentheses is the total elapsed when each step is finished. I average about 2:15-2:20. What steps should I work on?
I saw your solve video you put up as well; centers are fine for your averages, I have 30-35 second centers and a sub-1:55 global average.
I haven't separated my splits for F8E and L4E, but I'm around 50-55 for all 12 together, and I would guess I'm around 15ish on L4E.
Definitely learn those L2E algs, other than that I can't offer much advice as my L4E is really bad.
If you are trying to get serious at 5x5, get a Yuxin. It is so much better than a SS or Aochuang and less than half the price of a Huachuang. That should really cut your 3x3 stage, I'm around 20-21 with a Yuxin while averaging barely sub-15 on normal 3x3.
To wrap up, though, at this point your best bet besides some L2E algs is just to invest time in solves. I cut down to around 2:00 flat without focusing on anything or learning any sort of L2C or L2E.

#### DELToS

##### Member
I did a 5x5 solve that was about what I average (3:05.20) and here are my splits for that solve:

F2C: 29.94
L4C: 30.02
F8E: 1:08.36
L4E: 28.33
3x3: 37.55

What should I improve on? All these steps are also about what I average on them.
Cube: Yuxin

#### qwertycuber

##### Member
I did a 5x5 solve that was about what I average (3:05.20) and here are my splits for that solve:

F2C: 29.94
L4C: 30.02
F8E: 1:08.36
L4E: 28.33
3x3: 37.55

What should I improve on? All these steps are also about what I average on them.
Cube: Yuxin
It seems as though you need to improve on the centers. ON the F2C, I try to solve both centers at once.

#### Hssandwich

##### Member
I did a 5x5 solve that was about what I average (3:05.20) and here are my splits for that solve:

F2C: 29.94
L4C: 30.02
F8E: 1:08.36
L4E: 28.33
3x3: 37.55

What should I improve on? All these steps are also about what I average on them.
Cube: Yuxin
Definitely 3x3 stage.

#### unsolved

##### Member
I decided to add "stage solving" to my 5x5x5 brute force solver. So the reduction method solves centers first. Rather than code it to build blocks, I wrote code to have the program pre-solve every possible arrangement of exchanging up to 4 centers simultaneously, ignoring what happens to the edges and corners.

I don't know if any of these oddball Algs would be of interest to the group. I can guarantee each is the shortest number of moves required to do any of these center swaps.

Edit: For example, the longest center solve for 3 centers exchanges between the top and front faces requires 11 turns:

https://alg.cubing.net/?type=alg&puzzle=5x5x5&alg=2R_U2_2L-_U_2R-_3F_R2_3F-_2L2_F_2L-

There are several that take this long, but none longer. If someone has a faster solution for the white and green centers only, please let me know.

Edit 2: The program finished the 4 centers vs. 4 centers positions, and now is working on 5 against 5:

Amazingly, most of the 5 center positions can be solved in 10 moves or fewer. The one above is solved by:

U 2R U' 3R U 3R' U' 2R2 F' 2R

https://alg.cubing.net/?type=alg&puzzle=5x5x5&alg=U_2R_U-_3R_U_3R-_U-_2R2_F-_2R

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#### PJKCuber

##### Member
Text

www.BigCubes.com/5x5x5

Algs

Meep
Last Two Centers
Last Two Edges

Kirjava
K4 LL <-- parity algs for last two edges

Videos

Erik Akkersdijk
LanceTheBlueKnight
RobH0629
Dan Cohen
Kevin Lee
MeMyselfAndPi
Feliks Zemdegs
SixSquareFaces
CuberFelix1996
TheGbpackr
Rob Yau

Original Post:
I need some tips on speedsolving the 5x5. I have been practicing a bit, and I want to start working on tricks to improve my times. If you have any, please let me know. Thanks
The links to the videos don't seem to work.

M

#### Malkom

##### Guest
Whats the optimal splits for 5x5 using redux?

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