# [Help Thread]Roux Discussion and Help

#### Chase Keene

##### Member
Thanks everyone for the support!

#### Cubing Fr3aK

##### Member
I started cubing about 3 weeks ago, never learned the beginners method, watched some one at the airport solve with the Roux method and he showed me how to do it, after a few tries I was able to get it by myself. I started out with an average time of 3 minutes, 3 weeks later I'm averaging right above 40s.. My slowest time is block building on average 20-25 seconds to finish both sides, I've moved pretty far in 3 weeks, i do on average 2-300 solves throughout the day if I can, a lot more on weekends. Any suggestions to help with block building? or should i just keep practicing with trying to look ahead and plan blocks?
I dunno if this will help as you seemed to have already learned the method. But i have recently posted a video on roux.
. It is designed for beginners using a dl dr variant of roux. I personally find that watching other explain something i already know in a different manner often gives me a deeper understanding. I am currently working on documentation and a web site for this video.

#### Djaq Harris

##### Member
So, I'm trying to get sub 20.

Do you think it's better to learn CMLL or 2-look/Permutations?

I already know two look, and I'm curious whether permutations would be a useful next step (I'm working on blocks presently and I want to plan ahead) in addition to or instead of full cmll?

#### xyzzy

##### Member
The heck is "permutations"? Do you mean something like memorising how the CMLL algs you use affect LSE?

I'd say 1-look CMLL has a better payoff.

#### Djaq Harris

##### Member
for instance Y-Perm (utation) but thanks for the feedback.

#### u Cube

##### Member
for instance Y-Perm (utation) but thanks for the feedback.
Do you mean how y perms + j perms affect pieces so you can predict your EO case? If so you should learn that, it isn't that hard but you should also learn CMLLs (start with H it is easy recognition) but for cases where you don't know the cmll you can at least predict the EO so you can save some time

#### u Cube

##### Member
You can get sub-20 btw without full CMLL I did, if you want me to help you then I can.

#### alexela

##### Member
So, I'm trying to get sub 20.

Do you think it's better to learn CMLL or 2-look/Permutations?
CMLL - You can sub-20 using 2 look corners (I know I can). So CMLL comes in last in importance. It's just algs and muscle memory. Easy Peasy.
SUB 20 = 4+5+3+6
CMLL = 3 s (together with recognition)

#### Etotheipi

##### Member
I switched from cfop to roux about a week ago, so I'm wondering what would be some good goals to work towards. I have had about a year of cubing experience before hand. Right now I'm working towards first block in 4-5 seconds, is that reasonable?

#### ImmolatedMarmoset

##### Member
I am by no means good at roux. In fact, I started at about the same time as you did! However, I would say that that kind on first block time is a bit much, and is reasonable for someone trying to get sub 20. I average around 35 with roux, and my next goal is sub 30. I don’t know what you average or what your immediate goal is, but I would make reasonable goals and small jumps in times, otherwise you will get demotivated.

#### Etotheipi

##### Member
Ok. I dont think its to much really, because its just an edge, which normally only takes one move, and two f2l pairs, which are easier to insert and plan than in cfop.

#### ImmolatedMarmoset

##### Member
Ok. I dont think its to much really, because its just an edge, which normally only takes one move, and two f2l pairs, which are easier to insert and plan than in cfop.
Yeah, but I’m trying to do it as efficiently as possible, with making a 2x2x1 block and then adding a pair, and doing that well takes time for me. I’d say my first block on good solves is around 8 seconds. I know that I’ll get fast, but I want to utilize roux’s abilities to be efficient as much as possible.

#### Etotheipi

##### Member
You do it your way, and I'll do it my way.

#### Foreright

##### Member
You do it your way, and I'll do it my way.
If you do “CFOP style Roux” you’re missing the point IMHO - the whole point of Roux if efficiency - that might mean doing a CFOP style F2L approach for one solve or building a 3x1 or a 2x2 followed by pair in another whichever is more efficient.

#### Etotheipi

##### Member
I am
If you do “CFOP style Roux” you’re missing the point IMHO - the whole point of Roux if efficiency - that might mean doing a CFOP style F2L approach for one solve or building a 3x1 or a 2x2 followed by pair in another whichever is more efficient.
I am aware of that. I still am working on breaking bad CFOP habits since i only started Roux a week ago.

#### Etotheipi

##### Member
So what are some good goals for me if i started roux a week ago, no one has answered my question really.

Ok, thanks!

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#### Etotheipi

##### Member
I did a LSE movecount ao5 and got this 16 (19) 12 11 (9) = 13 HTM. Is that good or bad?

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#### Sue Doenim

##### Member
HTM? I'm guessing you mean STM. Are you using EOLR or UFUB or anything like that? At any rate, 5 solves is not really a big enough sample size to really judge anything much. There's too much possibility of chance screwing with the average.