[Help Thread] 4x4 Discussion

[One Wheel]

Thanks but I'm a newb and I don't know what a u-perm is. Or maybe I know it but don't know that it's called that. Thanks again

A U-perm is a 3-cycle of edges. A couple of decent ones:
CW: R2 U R U R' U' R' U' R' U R' (mirror image left side for ccw)
Also: M2 U M U2 M' U M2 (switch U for U' for ccw)

 

[oneshot]

A U-perm is a 3-cycle of edges. A couple of decent ones:
CW: R2 U R U R' U' R' U' R' U R' (mirror image left side for ccw)
Also: M2 U M U2 M' U M2 (switch U for U' for ccw)

Awesome. Ok I knew what it was just didn't know it was called that. Thanks again

Brian

 

[shadowslice e]

I guess I'm stupid but I can't find an alg for the last step when there are two edges that need to be swapped diagonally.

R U R' U' parity U R U' R'
Basically setup, alg, undo setup.

You might be interested in looking up Commutators and Conjugates.

 

[MooseCuber]

I haven't solved 4x4 since April, and I was averaging around 1:50ish. I just got a wuque and I'm motivated to learn 4x4 again. I need a good fingertrick-able OLL parity alg, and probably some help with half centres and such. I was learning Yau method when I last solved and so I think that's where I'll pick back up. Any tips on anything Yau-related are welcome! My goal is to be sub-minute in a couple of weeks

 

[One Wheel]

OLL parity is hard, if you come up with something magic let me know.

I use the forum WCs to track my progress. My first sub-1:50 4x4 average was the 2016-29 competition over a year ago. There's no reason to believe you couldn't improve faster than me, but my most recent entry was 1:33.66, which is slightly better than typical for me. If you can get sub-1:00 in a couple of weeks good for you, but I think you're setting yourself up for disappointment.

 

[Hucklebberry]

You should try hoya, even if you don't end up using it you might wanna see if it fits you better.

 

[xyzzy]

If you can get sub-1:00 in a couple of weeks good for you, but I think you're setting yourself up for disappointment.

^^^^^^^^^ This. Sub-1:00 is hard.

I need a good fingertrick-able OLL parity alg

A good OLL parity alg will probably shave half a second compared to a "mediocre" parity alg… in every other solve, so it's really more like shaving a quarter of a second. Most fast people use lucasparity now: r U2 x r U2 r U2' r' U2 l U2' r' U2 r U2' r' U2 r'. (I'm not fast, and I don't use this parity alg. Coincidence? I think not!)

Any tips on anything Yau-related are welcome!

Check out J Perm's Yau playlist and CubeSkills.

 

[MooseCuber]

If you can get sub-1:00 in a couple of weeks good for you, but I think you're setting yourself up for disappointment.

I was meaning sub-1 single not average in case that changes anything. I have already gotten to 1:18 today, and this is only my second day of actually practising 4x4 I think I can progress down to a minute with a lot more practise. If my average is still like 1:20 to 1:25 when I get a sub-1 single, that's still fine by me.

Most fast people use lucasparity now: r U2 x r U2 r U2' r' U2 l U2' r' U2 r U2' r' U2 r'.

Thanks! I honestly could not remember how to even do OLL parity and I think this was the alg I was using before. The more I practise with it I am starting to find a good fingertrick execution that works well for me.

Check out J Perm's Yau playlist and CubeSkills.

I've looked a J Perm already a bit and I am working on half centres, and I will make sure to check out the CubeSkills tutorials for 4x4. I got a lot of my PLL algs on 3x3 from there.

 

[One Wheel]

I was meaning sub-1 single not average in case that changes anything. I have already gotten to 1:18 today, and this is only my second day of actually practising 4x4 I think I can progress down to a minute with a lot more practise. If my average is still like 1:20 to 1:25 when I get a sub-1 single, that's still fine by me.

A lucky single is much more likely. I typically average 1:35-1:40, and my best single is 1:13.xx if I recall correctly. I think I have maybe 4 sub-1:20 singles.

 

[GenTheSnail]

half centres

Jakub Hutnyk has a half-centres video on cubing world(?)
idk if that is relevant though, I think it just introduced the concept of half centres.

gl on a sub-1 single, I remember that taking forever, though I wasn't actively practicing 4x4.

 

[GarethBert11]

Getting to sub-1 is really hard to be honest. Im average around 1:05 with yau. The way I improve is to look ahead center piece and first three cross edges. Also work on edge pairing and their special cases.

 

[cuber314159]

OLL parity is hard, if you come up with something magic let me know.

I use the forum WCs to track my progress. My first sub-1:50 4x4 average was the 2016-29 competition over a year ago. There's no reason to believe you couldn't improve faster than me, but my most recent entry was 1:33.66, which is slightly better than typical for me. If you can get sub-1:00 in a couple of weeks good for you, but I think you're setting yourself up for disappointment.

I got my first sub1:50 single in late September/ early October 2016 and am almost sub1 but with a good cube and lot of practice it is possible to go faster but 2 weeks, I don't believe Feliks even did that, I would recommend you use wide r and l moves during parity as I find it about 2 seconds faster than the standard

 

[GarethBert11]

Any tips for sub-1 average? I use yau and average around 1:05

 

[jaredye]

I'm also working on getting sub 1. My last AO100 was about 1:08. I've done about 2000 solves in total.

I don't know if I can help. My personal experience is that whenever I can pair up the first 2 centers and the first 3 edges quickly, I'd get a sub 1 solve. That's probably the biggest obstacle for someone who just got into 4x4. So I imagine working on these 2 can be the most effective way to reduce time.

I've heard an advice regarding the first 2 centers. You need to thoroughly plan out 1 center and be able to see where (at least) 2 pieces of the other center will go. I can't always do this yet but I'm working on it.

Then as you're finishing the second center, there are only a few ways to do it (like Rw U2 Rw'). For each way, know how pieces will move so you can look ahead for the edges to pair up. I'm still bad at this and I think this has the biggest room for improvement for me. I would think slow solve would be useful to practice the first 3 edges.

Finally, I have a question. How many solves does it usually take to get from 1:10 to 1:00? Around 2000 or more like 10000?

 

[xyzzy]

Finally, I have a question. How many solves does it usually take to get from 1:10 to 1:00? Around 2000 or more like 10000?

Took me about 2500 timed solves (+ a few hundred untimed) over roughly five months. This is highly subjective though, and I'd bet there are plenty of people who got from 1:10 to sub-minute in 1000 solves.

 

[One Wheel]

In roughly 2000 solves I've gone from about 3:00 to about 1:35. It feels like with another 1-2,000 I could get sub-1:25, I'm not even sure I have the right muscles to get consistently sub-1. I'm sure that with time I'll get a lucky sub-1 single; I can save another 8 seconds or so off of my 3x3 stage with more efficient f2l and full OLL easily, and another 6 seconds elsewhere to get a lucky sub-1.

 

[T1_M0]

I've done about 1000 solves totally, I've gone from 4:00 down to roughly 1:05. PB average is 1:01 and single 52.xx (official). Struggling to average below the 1-minute mark.

I bounced from 1:10 pretty straight to 1:05 average in less than 100 solves. But that's ao12 (mo100 is around 5 seconds slower). To the original question, it depends a LOT. I think it's not impossible to go from 1:10 to 1:00 in 200 solves while it may also take over 1000 or 2000 solves.

 

[TreacherousToast]

I just started getting into 4x4. I use redux and I average 1:40-1:50. Any ideas on how to improve?

 

[Ordway Persyn]

Make sure you find some good parity Algorithms and start drilling them. Also you should start to learn a more advanced method (such as Yau, Hoya).

 

[Competition Cuber]

Learn Yau or Hoya ASAP, then practice with them. Get some good parity algs. Also, make sure you have a good 4x4 (get a Wuque or thunderclap 4x4).