[Help Thread] 4x4 Discussion

[theROUXbiksCube]

idk my aosu is broken...

 

[josh42732]

the centers?is that what you mean by piece? like the piece under that color center? I'll try it tomorrow and get back to you

Yes, the piece under the color center.

 

[theROUXbiksCube]

idk my aosu is broken...

 

[theROUXbiksCube]

Yes, the piece under the color center.

it doesn't work for me sorry thanks for your help

 

[deoxyribose]

Getting faster at the 4x4?

I'm not a really good cuber, but I am still pretty good. Lots if not all of my 3x3 times are sub-2min, but I'm what feels like excessively slow at the 4x4. I have to use an algorithm sheet considering my memory recall is atrocious. I've gotten times around 15 minutes for one solve of the 4x4 using centers -> edges -> parity -> 3x3. Considering I've actually only had the thing for 2 days with no prior studying up to receiving it, I think 15min is pretty good. Any tips on memorizing algorithms / getting quicker?

 

[Reprobate]

I think most people will agree practice is the main thing. It just helps you get a feel for where all the pieces are (or need to be). One thing that may sound foolish was when I was learning 4x4, I would use the edge flip algorithm to flip every edge, rather than using FRUR'U' to orient 3 of the 4. Doing it multiple times on nearly every solve burned it into my brain fast.

 

[CubeWizard23]

My advice? sub 1 min (or sub 30) the 3x3 then work on bigger puzzles, not only will this help you understand how the puzzle operates but your fingers will be more used to speedsolving. dont worry about memorizong the parity just do it 45 times in a row and you will have it ingrained permanently.

i just got my 4x4 last week and i am 20.xx avging on 3x3 and am sub 2 on 4x4. also get a good 4x4 if you have a crappy one.

 

[TheSquareOne]

My advice? sub 1 min (or sub 30) the 3x3 then work on bigger puzzles

I agree with this.
I'm far from an expert on cubing, but I noticed my 4x4 times improved after I had spent time practicing 3x3.
Maybe I was recognising colours quicker, or my look-ahead quickened. Or maybe my fingers just became more dexterous!

Also, don't worry about learning algorithms. Unless you've a competition coming up (and need to rapidly drill-learn), I would recommend continuing with your algorithm sheet; it will come naturally with practice

 

[deoxyribose]

My advice? sub 1 min (or sub 30) the 3x3 then work on bigger puzzles, not only will this help you understand how the puzzle operates but your fingers will be more used to speedsolving. dont worry about memorizong the parity just do it 45 times in a row and you will have it ingrained permanently.

i just got my 4x4 last week and i am 20.xx avging on 3x3 and am sub 2 on 4x4. also get a good 4x4 if you have a crappy one.

I've been cubing for nearly 3 months, and my times have been stuck to sub 2min. I don't know if it's just that my method is slow (I use keyhole because of bad memory retention, can't memorize 25+ algs w/o forgetting at least one.) or that I'm just slow in general (any advice?).

also get a good 4x4 if you have a crappy one.

I don't know what qualifies as 'crappy' . My funds are very limited, so I bought a ShengShou from China (for only $5.85). Are ShengShou cubes bad?

 

[shadowslice e]

I've been cubing for nearly 3 months, and my times have been stuck to sub 2min. I don't know if it's just that my method is slow (I use keyhole because of bad memory retention, can't memorize 25+ algs w/o forgetting at least one.) or that I'm just slow in general (any advice?).

What method do you use? If you don't like learning algs (I hate learning them as well) switch to some other less alg intensive method such as roux, petrus or even heise.

 

[Berd]

I've been cubing for nearly 3 months, and my times have been stuck to sub 2min. I don't know if it's just that my method is slow (I use keyhole because of bad memory retention, can't memorize 25+ algs w/o forgetting at least one.) or that I'm just slow in general (any advice?).

I don't know what qualifies as 'crappy' [emoji14]. My funds are very limited, so I bought a ShengShou from China (for only $5.85). Are ShengShou cubes bad?

The shengshou 4x4s are fine, you can always mod it if you really want to.

 

[shadowslice e]

Just a memo, this should be merged with "[help thread] 4x4 discussion]"

Sent from my M1005D using Tapatalk

 

[deoxyribose]

What method do you use? If you don't like learning algs (I hate learning them as well) switch to some other less alg intensive method such as roux, petrus or even heise.

I noted it in parentheses, I use the keyhole method. Keyhole is solve middle layer then place corners in using these three algs:
U' R U' R' U2' R U' R
U R U R' U2 R U R'
R U R' U' R U R' U' R U R' U'.
I also use some obscure method for OLL and PLL.
For OLL, I use F R U R' U' F' until I get a cross, then do R U R' U R U2 (and inverse L' U' L U' L' U2') until the yellow layer is solved.
I have three PLL algs burned into my memory. I have memorized and adapted to a weird form of the Aa perm, where instead of swapping clockwise, it swaps counterclockwise. (Alg: x R2 D2 R U R' D2 R U' R x'). I also use the Ua perm (R U' R U R U R U' R' U R2) and the Z perm (M2 U M2 U M' U2 M2 U2 M' U2).

 

[shadowslice e]

I noted it in parentheses, I use the keyhole method. Keyhole is solve middle layer then place corners in using these three algs:
U' R U' R' U2' R U' R
U R U R' U2 R U R'
R U R' U' R U R' U' R U R' U'.
I also use some obscure method for OLL and PLL.
For OLL, I use F R U R' U' F' until I get a cross, then do R U R' U R U2 (and inverse L' U' L U' L' U2') until the yellow layer is solved.
I have three PLL algs burned into my memory. I have memorized and adapted to a weird form of the Aa perm, where instead of swapping clockwise, it swaps counterclockwise. (Alg: x R2 D2 R U R' D2 R U' R x'). I also use the Ua perm (R U' R U R U R U' R' U R2) and the Z perm (M2 U M2 U M' U2 M2 U2 M' U2).

So you use basically beginner's+keyhole (keyhole+ basically 4LLL)?

Try switching to something like roux because you could already do the corners in pretty much two looks.

 

[PenguinsDontFly]

So you use basically beginner's+keyhole (keyhole+ basically 4LLL)?

Try switching to something like roux because you could already do the corners in pretty much two looks.

@shadow: thats not 4LLL, its begginer's LL (spam 1 alg over and over for each step). and btw people dont like it when you "try to shove roux down theiir throat". I have been burned for it quite a few times.

@deoxy: learn 4LLL, then F2L. or F2L first.

 

[Reprobate]

I should have mentioned earlier to check out some videos on multiple edge pairing for 4x4. That is probably where most speed is gained or lost, if you're just doing one pair at a time now. F2L is an obvious next step for 3x3. It takes practice, but doesn't require any algorithms as such.

 

[shadowslice e]

@shadow: thats not 4LLL, its begginer's LL (spam 1 alg over and over for each step). and btw people dont like it when you "try to shove roux down theiir throat". I have been burned for it quite a few times

I'm not too bothered if I get negetive responses for telling people to use roux because I still think it's the best method if you don't want to learn loads of algs (at least so far) but I'll recommend something like CFOP if they don't mind learning/like learning algs.

It's also not quite beginner's LL because he doesn't just spam U-perm and sune pairs are still fairly effective but I can see what you mean. I basically did the same thing over and over until Dan and Berd convinced me to use roux.

 

[IAmAPerson]

I'm not too bothered if I get negetive responses for telling people to use roux because I still think it's the best method if you don't want to learn loads of algs (at least so far) but I'll recommend something like CFOP if they don't mind learning/like learning algs.

It's also not quite beginner's LL because he doesn't just spam U-perm and sune pairs are still fairly effective but I can see what you mean. I basically did the same thing over and over until Dan and Berd convinced me to use roux.

Learn Roux for a low-alg method? ZB is much better. Only 900+ algs to learn to master the method!

 

[SpeedCubeReview]

When solving Yao and you are finishing the last 4 centers do you try to keep the same side on bottom the whole time and just do a lot of slices or do you move the whole cube (Right 3 sides if the cross is on the left) for more efficient slices? I hope that made sense.

Also, I asked a question in the request an alt section but I don't think I got the answer I was needing. Lets say I am solving 4x4 and I have 4 unsolved edges left. When I slice over two of the edges get paired up and so would be messed up again after slicing back. The person responded with a page about the last 2/3 edges, but this seems to be an odd case where I might have to do them individually or switch two of the edges before I slice.

 

[dboeren]

As a fellow beginner I would agree that it's probably worthwhile to firm up your 3x3 before going to a bigger cube. I don't have experience with keyhole but if you're around 2 minutes then there is lots of room to improve. You just need to keep practicing and I would suggest that you do some timings of each individual step to help you identify where you need to focus.

When I started a little while back I chose to do Roux in part because it was fewer algorithms to learn, but the same idea applies to any method. I'm not even doing full solves most of the time because I know my block building (rough equivalent of F2L for you) needs work. So, I just practice blocks over and over and time that step. In the last three weeks I've gotten my block time from about 46 seconds down to about 28 seconds (average of 12), so it's paying off. I'm planning to shave a bit more off and then when I get to sub-25 start adding in the next step.

Since you're basically doing a type of CFOP, what I'd do is first drill your cross until that's looking good, then expand to F2L. Use a timer app on your computer, phone, tablet, etc... and keep records from each practice session with dates. You should be able to see your times going down over time. You don't need to finish the whole solve, just drill the part you're working on and rescramble from there.