[Help Thread] OLL and PLL Discussion

[rjohnson_8ball]

No edges oriented:    1/8 = 12.5%
2 edges in "L" shape: 4/8 = 50%
2 edges in "I" shape: 2/8 = 25%
All edges oriented:   1/8 = 12.5%

Thanks for correcting me Lucas! DOH! I did not recognize there would be twice as many L shapes as I shapes.

 

[primalpanic]

2 Look OLL/PLL

I am a wannabee speedcuber
I have learned badmephisto's beginner method and I believe I waste most of my time on last layer.
So I want to learn 2 look oll/pll 1st.
I know there is a badmephisto video but i need something i can carry around printed out so i was
wondering if anyone knew of a website or a pdf file or something similar where the 2 look oll/pll algs are listed.
If you could help I would be very grateful
P.S. This is my 1st ever post so Hi everybody :rolleyes:
Thank You.

 

[MTGjumper]

How long have you been cubing? If you've only just started, practice the beginner method until you're ~sub-1 minute. If you are already past this, ignore me =P

OLL/PLL algs are listed in a sticky in the speedcubing section. For 4 Look Last Layer, you need to learn 16 algs.

 

[hawkmp4]

Uh.
Seriously, just look in the video descriptions for each video on youtube. He lists the algorithms AND links to his website with the diagrams.
Didn't even have to use google :O

 

[PCwizCube]

http://www.cubefreak.net/twolook.html

I personally don't like the algorithms he uses, but use whatever algorithms you want.

 

[Littlegupper]

I have learned the method of Joel van Noort. On his website: http://solvethecube.110mb.com/simple_solution.html step 4,5,6 and 7 are the 2 look OLL PLL steps. I beginned with these steps and I do like the algorithms, with that method I have a PB of 44 seconds

 

[Someone]

2 look OLL/PLL 44 sec??? isnt it supposed to shave off abt 10 sec of ur time?

 

[LuffyOniiSan]

umm. www.cubewhiz.com would be good, it has printable oll and pll algs. About 4 pages all.

 

[blgentry]

I have learned the method of Joel van Noort. On his website: http://solvethecube.110mb.com/simple_solution.html step 4,5,6 and 7 are the 2 look OLL PLL steps. I beginned with these steps and I do like the algorithms, with that method I have a PB of 44 seconds

While that is a fine solution, it is absolutely NOT a 2 look OLL and 2 look PLL. That solution uses a 4 look OLL and a 4 look PLL (worst case scenarios) for a total of 8 looks.

To turn that solution into a 4 LLL (2L OLL, 2L PLL), you need to add on 9 algorithms. I can detail them if you are interested, or you can just read Macky's page on the subject. That's pretty much where I learned, but I use different algs than he does. We all "shop around" for algs that suit us best.

Brian.

 

[Littlegupper]

I have learned the method of Joel van Noort. On his website: http://solvethecube.110mb.com/simple_solution.html step 4,5,6 and 7 are the 2 look OLL PLL steps. I beginned with these steps and I do like the algorithms, with that method I have a PB of 44 seconds

While that is a fine solution, it is absolutely NOT a 2 look OLL and 2 look PLL. That solution uses a 4 look OLL and a 4 look PLL (worst case scenarios) for a total of 8 looks.

To turn that solution into a 4 LLL (2L OLL, 2L PLL), you need to add on 9 algorithms. I can detail them if you are interested, or you can just read Macky's page on the subject. That's pretty much where I learned, but I use different algs than he does. We all "shop around" for algs that suit us best.

Brian.

Oke, I didn't knew that, I thought he meant 2 steps for the OLL and 2 steps for the PLL :rolleyes:, sorry for that .
I am currently learning the 2 look OLL PLL algorithms from Dan Harris http://www.cubestation.co.uk/cs2/index.php?page=3x3x3/cfop/oll/oll
http://www.cubestation.co.uk/cs2/index.php?page=3x3x3/cfop/pll/pll
correct me if that are not 2 look OLL PLL

 

[Littlegupper]

2 look OLL/PLL 44 sec??? isnt it supposed to shave off abt 10 sec of ur time?

I had a PB of 44 seconds not with de 2 look OLL/PLL, I had it with the simple solution of Joel van Noort. You solve the cube in 7 steps. If I know the 2 look OLL PLL I will be faster

 

[blgentry]

Oke, I didn't knew that, I thought he meant 2 steps for the OLL and 2 steps for the PLL :rolleyes:, sorry for that .
I am currently learning the 2 look OLL PLL algorithms from Dan Harris http://www.cubestation.co.uk/cs2/index.php?page=3x3x3/cfop/oll/oll
http://www.cubestation.co.uk/cs2/index.php?page=3x3x3/cfop/pll/pll
correct me if that are not 2 look OLL PLL

Those pages you have linked to are lists of all of the OLLs (57) and all of the PLLs (21). If you learn *all* of those, you'll have a 2 Look Last Layer. That is, one look for OLL, and one look for PLL. But that's not the same as a 4 Look Last Layer. A 4 Look Last Layer is composed of a 2 Look OLL and a 2 Look PLL.

Said another way, you can rank these in increasing order of difficultly as:

8 LLL = 4 L OLL, 4 L PLL
4 LLL = 2 L OLL, 2 L PLL
3 LLL = 2 L OLL, 1 L PLL
2 LLL = 1 L OLL, 1 L PLL

What you're doing now is an 8 LLL and you are trying to get to a 4 LLL .

Macky's page breaks down the steps and lists the algs that (presumably) he uses:

http://www.cubefreak.net/twolook.html

If you can't quite figure out how to transition from your current method to a 4 LLL, I'd be happy to answer questions to help you out.

BTW, I meant to say in my last post that a 44 sec PB is pretty good IMHO with a beginner's last layer. Certainly others have done better, but that's pretty respectable. A 4 LLL should make you a good bit faster.

Brian.

 

[jonny guitar]

wondering if anyone knew of a website or a pdf file or something similar where the 2 look oll/pll algs are listed.

I took the algos and pics from Burtons site, resized them and imported them into a columned word file with oll's on front and pll's on back. I carried that around with me and as I memorized the algos I would delete from the pic so each week I would print out a new page with only the ones I couldn't remember on them...ones that I kinda had but sometimes forgot I would make a little smaller pics off. It was a cool way to show the progress that I was making and was nice and easy to carry around with me in my back pocket.

 

[Littlegupper]

Oke, I didn't knew that, I thought he meant 2 steps for the OLL and 2 steps for the PLL :rolleyes:, sorry for that .
I am currently learning the 2 look OLL PLL algorithms from Dan Harris http://www.cubestation.co.uk/cs2/index.php?page=3x3x3/cfop/oll/oll
http://www.cubestation.co.uk/cs2/index.php?page=3x3x3/cfop/pll/pll
correct me if that are not 2 look OLL PLL

Those pages you have linked to are lists of all of the OLLs (57) and all of the PLLs (21). If you learn *all* of those, you'll have a 2 Look Last Layer. That is, one look for OLL, and one look for PLL. But that's not the same as a 4 Look Last Layer. A 4 Look Last Layer is composed of a 2 Look OLL and a 2 Look PLL.

Said another way, you can rank these in increasing order of difficultly as:

8 LLL = 4 L OLL, 4 L PLL
4 LLL = 2 L OLL, 2 L PLL
3 LLL = 2 L OLL, 1 L PLL
2 LLL = 1 L OLL, 1 L PLL

What you're doing now is an 8 LLL and you are trying to get to a 4 LLL .

Macky's page breaks down the steps and lists the algs that (presumably) he uses:

http://www.cubefreak.net/twolook.html

If you can't quite figure out how to transition from your current method to a 4 LLL, I'd be happy to answer questions to help you out.

BTW, I meant to say in my last post that a 44 sec PB is pretty good IMHO with a beginner's last layer. Certainly others have done better, but that's pretty respectable. A 4 LLL should make you a good bit faster.

Brian.

Oke, thanx for your help . Now I know a little bit more about de OLL/PLL.

Currently I use 4 OLL (maximum). In the worst case i have only the center piece. Then I flip two edges. Then I flip the last two edges. Then I use two algorithms to finish the OLL.
and 3 PLL (maximum). In the worst case only 1 corner piece is correct. I use an algoritm twice if 1 corner piece is correct and that algorithm one when 2 corner pieces are placed correct. And then I use an algorithm to place the last 3 edges at the correct place.

I hope you understand me:rolleyes: and maybe you can help
tnx

 

[blgentry]

Currently I use 4 OLL (maximum). In the worst case i have only the center piece. Then I flip two edges. Then I flip the last two edges. Then I use two algorithms to finish the OLL.

Yes. Correct: 4 Look OLL in the worst case.

and 3 PLL (maximum). In the worst case only 1 corner piece is correct. I use an algoritm twice if 1 corner piece is correct and that algorithm one when 2 corner pieces are placed correct. And then I use an algorithm to place the last 3 edges at the correct place.

Yes, up until the last step with the edges. In the worst case, all 4 edges will be out of place, in either an H or Z permutation. In that case you'll have to apply the 3 edge cycle twice, which makes this step a total of 4 looks, or a 4 Look PLL.

I hope you understand me:rolleyes: and maybe you can help
tnx

I'm pretty sure I understood all of that. What do you want help with? Have you tried reading Macky's page yet?

Brian.

 

[brunson]

Oke, thanx for your help . Now I know a little bit more about de OLL/PLL.

Currently I use 4 OLL (maximum). In the worst case i have only the center piece. Then I flip two edges. Then I flip the last two edges. Then I use two algorithms to finish the OLL.
and 3 PLL (maximum). In the worst case only 1 corner piece is correct. I use an algoritm twice if 1 corner piece is correct and that algorithm one when 2 corner pieces are placed correct. And then I use an algorithm to place the last 3 edges at the correct place.

I hope you understand me:rolleyes: and maybe you can help
tnx

In order to eliminate one look from your worst case OLL all you need to do is learn one no-edges-oriented OLL algorithm. Currently when you have no edges of the cross you do two algs to get the cross. If you were to use *any* of the algorithms 1, 2, 3, 4, 17, 18, 19, 20, you will solve the cross in one alg. That will reduce your OLL from a 4 look to a 3 look.
Brian (blgentry) was the person who pointed this out to me and I was like, "Woah!"

After than, what you should learn for your OLL are the 7 "edges oriented" OLLs, 21-27. That will allow you to complete your OLL in two algorithms, worst case.

As far as going to a 2 look PLL, first you need two corner PLLs, one to swap adjacent corners (an A or a T or a J, perhaps) and one to swap opposite corners (Y). Then you would need to learn all the permute edges algs (cwU, ccwU, Z and H).

All of this is just a reiteration of what is on http://www.cubefreak.net/twolook.html if you'd read it.

 

[Littlegupper]

Wow, thanx for al your good help, I think i am the beginner here . First I gonna start to reducee my OLL from a 4 look to a 3 look. Then I can reduce it to a 2 look. That looks a lot of nicer than learing it from a 4 look to a 1 look.

If I have done that, I will improve my PLL. Many thanx, for the site and the help
Brunson and Blgentry

 

[Raffael]

Maybe you should try some partial edge control.
It's a relatively easy concept to understand and it can save you quite an amount of OLL's to learn.

 

[cookingfat]

I recently learnt 2 look OLL and 2 look PLL from badmephisto's youtube videos. I learnt 2 or 3 algorithms per day and it knocked about 15 seconds off my time. I was averaging about 75 seconds and it's now down to a minute. I've been cubing for about a month now, so I'm getting there.

 

[bour1992]

oll and pll help

Can you help me on how and when can I use oll and pll algorithms?

Till now i used to make the f2l first and after that i make a cross on the up layer with the algorithm F R U Ri Ui Fi.
And then:
R U Ri U R U U Ri to correct the edges
U R Ui Li U Ri Ui L to position the corners
Ri Di R D to correct the corners
to complete the top layer.

Thanks in advance.