# Older cubers discussions

#### Old Tom

##### Member
Isn’t it just T, Y, Ja and Jb?
You also need an alg to correct parity when necessary. I use Ra for that.

#### Mike Hughey

##### Super Moderator
Staff member
Only 1 alg will work, too.

You can use T perm for both corner & edge, and swap UL/UR if there is a parity.
Same logic can be used for J perm, Y perm. Setup will be slightly more complicated, though.
My daughter actually learned this method many years ago (T perm). She struggled with learning algorithms, so a method with just one algorithm was ideal. She came 2 twisted corners away from being the youngest person (at that particular time) to ever solve a 3x3x3 BLD in WCA competition. So close - so sad.

#### Oldmancfop

##### Member
I've opted for the easiest OP method for now. The part that immediately strikes me as difficult is if when I working through my edges or corners I land on the buffer piece and have to start a new cycle from another unsolved piece, how to remember which unsolved pieces I have not yet taken into account, is there a trick for this?

#### PetrusQuber

##### Member
I've opted for the easiest OP method for now. The part that immediately strikes me as difficult is if when I working through my edges or corners I land on the buffer piece and have to start a new cycle from another unsolved piece, how to remember which unsolved pieces I have not yet taken into account, is there a trick for this?
Not really, just cycle round the edges and see if they’re in the memo. There are only 12 to do. I just do top layer edges, middle layer edges, bottom layer edges. Don’t forgot an edge has two stickers, eg for Speffz D and E are the same.

#### bossel

##### Member
I can't even remember where all my edges and corners are with my eyes open ... ;-)

#### openseas

##### Member
I've opted for the easiest OP method for now. The part that immediately strikes me as difficult is if when I working through my edges or corners I land on the buffer piece and have to start a new cycle from another unsolved piece, how to remember which unsolved pieces I have not yet taken into account, is there a trick for this?
In the beginning, people use fingers to track what has been traced but it will phase out once you stack enough experience.

#### mark49152

##### Super Moderator
Staff member
I've opted for the easiest OP method for now. The part that immediately strikes me as difficult is if when I working through my edges or corners I land on the buffer piece and have to start a new cycle from another unsolved piece, how to remember which unsolved pieces I have not yet taken into account, is there a trick for this?
I think most people have a small set of targets they like to use to break into new cycles. Then as they memo, they mentally tick them off if they have been seen already and become unavailable to start new cycles. For example, for edges I prefer to start cycles on A, B, C or D. If I've traced through B and C then I'll keep note that A and D are still available. Very occasionally they'll all get used and I'll have to figure out another target to start on, but that's rare.

#### BenChristman1

##### Member
I use Y modified, R perm, J perm and T perm. I don't know if it's Ja or Jb, it's the one with the J on the right.
That's Jb.

#### Old Tom

##### Member
I use mod Y, T, Ja, Jb, and Ra for parity correction. Ja and Jb are mirror images, which I find easy to memorize and execute as such.

As to new cycles, I am still at the stage where those are hard for me for edges, but the (fewer) corners are getting much easier. It helps to remember by “what’s left” rather then by “what’s done”, since the ones left are potential targets for the buffer piece, and they get fewer as the memo trace proceeds.

I also take a quick look at the start to identify flipped/twisted (add 1) and solved (deduct 1) pieces, so I know the count for the trace, which then increases by one each time I hit the buffer piece early on. The starting count is of course 7 for corners, 11 for edges. That way I always know how many moves are left, and I am then prepared to hit the buffer piece one final (or if lucky, only) time at the end, and this confirms that I am done. This really helps!

#### Old Tom

##### Member
There is another trick in the memo trace that is helping me also: suppose the pre-inspection of the corners shows one piece twisted. So, instead of remembering “8” moves, I focus on “6 plus 2”, then I am prepared to hit the buffer piece at “6”, followed by a double hit at the twisted location. I actually don’t mind the twist (or flip) at all then, since I get to “nearly done” more quickly.

#### openseas

##### Member
It's bee a while posting here

Had a back-to-back comp last two weeks, did't do great. Out of 12 attempts (2round each), 2 success, both 50s.
It is a bit frustrating since my home success rate was improving, high 40%, stable around low 50s.
Positive thing was, all DNFs were 50s, even the slowest success (59s) was a safety solve (reviewed couple of times).

Drilling edge comms are kinda slow, still 40~50% range, need way more practice. Downside is, my corner comms are getting sloppy.

I also had big BLD attempts, all 6 DNFs :-(
Times were not good either - 2nd 4BLD was success but slight over 10min. It was within legal time limit of the comp but I was stupid and cocky, didn't ask the judge to start the stopwatch - so, a lost win. 5BLD was slightly under 20min DNF - couple of wings & T-center inverse comms.

#### One Wheel

##### Member
Today is a sad day in cubing: the removal of Feet is a dark stain on the reputation of the WCA.

On a lighter note: I’m personally finishing the year on a good note. It scared the cows, but I got my first 4BLD success this evening.

#### One Wheel

##### Member
First full 5BLD attempt, I’m very happy with the result:

I can’t seem to attach both pictures to get the whole cube, but I think I was off by 3 x-centers, 3 wings, midge parity, and 5 midges.

Edit: it just occurred to me that I’m an idiot. I need a different strategy for 5BLD midge parity than 3BLD parity. Hmmm. What’s the best approach there? Using U2/U2/r2/M2/OP in that order, at this point. 3BLD parity alg is D’ L2 D M2 D’ L2 D, executed after edges and before corners.

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#### mark49152

##### Super Moderator
Staff member
First full 5BLD attempt, I’m very happy with the result:
View attachment 11194
I can’t seem to attach both pictures to get the whole cube, but I think I was off by 3 x-centers, 3 wings, midge parity, and 5 midges.

Edit: it just occurred to me that I’m an idiot. I need a different strategy for 5BLD midge parity than 3BLD parity. Hmmm. What’s the best approach there? Using U2/U2/r2/M2/OP in that order, at this point. 3BLD parity alg is D’ L2 D M2 D’ L2 D, executed after edges and before corners.
You need to swap the wings alongside the midges. D’ L2 D M2 (F2 Rw2 F2 U2 r2 U2 F2 Rw2 F2) D’ L2 D. (I don't have a 5x5 on me, I hope I got that right!)

#### One Wheel

##### Member
You need to swap the wings alongside the midges. D’ L2 D M2 (F2 Rw2 F2 U2 r2 U2 F2 Rw2 F2) D’ L2 D. (I don't have a 5x5 on me, I hope I got that right!)
Thanks! That looks like it does what needs to be done! Another alg to learn.

#### JohnnyReggae

##### Member
A question about blind. I'm going camping in the mountains a few hours from Cape Town in the next couple days and I want to spend the time getting back into blind. When using Speffz there is an alg for Q (Edges using M2) which uses M and U moves which is easier to remember than the standard alg. Does anyone know offhand what it is. I cannot remember it for the life of me and I did not write it down or save it to any doc.

#### xyzzy

##### Member
A question about blind. I'm going camping in the mountains a few hours from Cape Town in the next couple days and I want to spend the time getting back into blind. When using Speffz there is an alg for Q (Edges using M2) which uses M and U moves which is easier to remember than the standard alg. Does anyone know offhand what it is. I cannot remember it for the life of me and I did not write it down or save it to any doc.
I don't use M2, but if you mean the DF/UB flip alg, it's (U M')3 U M (U M')4.

#### JohnnyReggae

##### Member
I don't use M2, but if you mean the DF/UB flip alg, it's (U M')3 U M (U M')4.
That's exactly it, thanks I knew it was simple, just couldn't figure out.

I have a similar one for the flower OLL, (M' U')3 M' U (M' U')3 M' U .... which was why I was getting confused

Thanks again

#### openseas

##### Member
That's exactly it, thanks I knew it was simple, just couldn't figure out.

I have a similar one for the flower OLL, (M' U')3 M' U (M' U')3 M' U .... which was why I was getting confused

Thanks again
but if you mean the DF/UB flip alg, it's (U M')3 U M (U M')4. --> Correct one is (U M')3 U M (U M')3 U M - no matter what, you can't have uneven numbers of M vs M'