[Help Thread] Colour Neutrality Discussion

[Matt11111]

I have a question to advanced cubers or cubers which have already did it i am a white cross solver and i really want to get colour neutral but i am worried that this can effect my times i mean my times will get worser.how long it needs to get colour neutal and can i practice and work on it with out loosing my speed (my avarage solve time is 12.53 seconds) i am happy for any advice.

Due to the fact that you're basically learning a new color scheme, your times will be a little slower for a little while as you try new colors.

 

[CriticalCubing]

I have a question to advanced cubers or cubers which have already did it i am a white cross solver and i really want to get colour neutral but i am worried that this can effect my times i mean my times will get worser.how long it needs to get colour neutal and can i practice and work on it with out loosing my speed (my avarage solve time is 12.53 seconds) i am happy for any advice.

Yes, it will affect your times and you will get slower. As you get faster, you are forming color filters. For white solving, I ignore all yellow stickers on top, that is my filter so I can track white pieces faster. When you are doing CN however, you are adding in more filters, so ofcourse that will make you slow but as you get faster, it becomes tougher to makes these filters and make it equally good as your white filter. So moet people tend to go for dual CN, mainly forming the filter to ignore all whites when solving yellow. You don't need CN to be fast, look at Lucas Etter or Antoine or Coenelius. They solve on white, then there is Dario, Mats, Kevin, Drew, Kennan so many fast solvers who solve only both colors
Do whatever seems fit, if you want to get CN, start doing it however start going dual first

 

[Ordway Persyn]

If you average around 12-13, I'd say It's not worth being fully color neutral. You should try to become dual neutral though (learn to use yellow cross).

 

[CriticalCubing]

If you average around 12-13, I'd say It's not worth being fully color neutral. You should try to become dual neutral though (learn to use yellow cross).

Dude, I know a 10 sec solver trying to become color neutral to get sub 10 :3 xD I said the same thing, he said let me try

 

[turtwig]

look at Lucas Etter or Antoine or Coenelius. They solve on white

Pretty sure Antoine Cantin solves on orange

 

[qwertycuber]

Pretty sure Antoine Cantin solves on orange

When I met him, he was colour neutral.

 

[PenguinsDontFly]

Colour neutrality helps in the end, but dual is almost as good. Single colour makes you get fast singles but inconsistent averages because you can get really easy crosses and really bad ones.

Pretty sure Antoine Cantin solves on orange

When I met him, he was colour neutral.

He's only orange.

 

[CriticalCubing]

Colour neutrality helps in the end, but dual is almost as good. Single colour makes you get fast singles but inconsistent averages because you can get really easy crosses and really bad ones.





He's only orange.

Yes, Thank you. He said to me also that he solves only on Orange

 

[Speedysolver]

And how much time can it take if i practice well? ca?

 

[cmhardw]

Colour neutrality helps in the end, but dual is almost as good. Single colour makes you get fast singles but inconsistent averages because you can get really easy crosses and really bad ones.

I completely agree with this. Switching to dual neutral improved my averages from 16s to 14s-15s. Switching to color neutral has improved my averages to 13s-14s and I feel like consistent 12s is on the horizon. And that's including my bad habit turning styles that probably still hold me back. Just switching to higher levels of color neutrality made me faster for every level I added.

And how much time can it take if i practice well? ca?

It took me a solid 4-5 years to go from dual neutral to color neutral. It took me about 1-2 years to fully switch to dual neutral from one color. The switch is long and hard and you will get slower in the meantime. If you stick with it then it's completely worth it.

Maybe switch at home, but only use what you're fast at in competition until you feel your dual or color neutral is up to snuff?

 

[Speedysolver]

i already switched to the dual cross and it have taken me no more as 2 days yellow pieces are nearly the same as white pieces i avared with yellow cross 13 second i dont think taht it will take me over a year maybe half year!!!!)))) what do you think???

 

[Speedysolver]

toda i even tried the green and blue cross but my avarage was 23 second((((

 

[cmhardw]

i already switched to the dual cross and it have taken me no more as 2 days yellow pieces are nearly the same as white pieces i avared with yellow cross 13 second i dont think taht it will take me over a year maybe half year!!!!)))) what do you think???

I think you should be able to switch in far less time than me. I'm a good example of an outlier on the high side. I cubed for a very long time on one color then tried to switch, which made it harder. Also, I don't practice as much per day as I used to which probably made it take longer.

It's probably better to think in terms of 1,000s of solves to switch.

I estimate that switching from 1 color to dual neutral took me about 15,000-25,000 solves.

Switching color neutral from dual I estimate took me about 15,000-20,000 more solves. It took me much longer because I wasn't practicing as much as I used to during this period.

How long do you think it would take you to do 20,000 solves? That could be a rough guess for how long your switch would take.

toda i even tried the green and blue cross but my avarage was 23 second((((

It helps when you switch to accept that you're a dual neutral or color neutral solver now, and that you're slower. This is a good thing because it means that everything is a pb again and you can set goals of improving your pbs until you beat your current pbs. That's what I did, and I have beaten all my old pbs from before the switch. It helped me to not get discouraged.

Also, using this strategy means to switch cold turkey, switch all at once with no transitional period of adding colors of any kind. This strategy makes you real slow at first, but it makes your overall transition happen faster in my opinion.

Good luck with your switch whatever you choose! Remember to have fun with it by setting new pbs

 

[Speedysolver]

Thank you! ccmhardw i will try to get colour neutral i thnik 20000 solves i can do durnig a period of 2-3 months or less i practicing 2 hours every da and thats only 3x3. and i have really fun how ever i will try to get sub 10 avarge and try at the same time to get colour neutral.

 

[Kudz]

toda i even tried the green and blue cross but my avarage was 23 second((((

Try all at once lol. CN is about finding easy (x)crosses not being good at solving bad crosses on all colours...
That's why my cross suck, but I can do cool xcrosses

 

[Zdudel11]

I can make a cross with any color. Then I try putting in the white corners :/

 

[antech101]

Tips on becoming color neutral

Just wondering if anyone had tips for becoming color neutral, is it just a lot of practice?

 

[TorbinRoux]

I'm not sure how to transition because I just began color neutral when I started cubing, but I would say to give yourself a lot of inspection to find the absolute best cross on any color, and then solve that. Eventually pick up your inspection pace and practice doing solves on every color cross.

 

[jaredye]

I've started using white cross till I got to about 20 seconds. Then I thought it would be fun to learn CN. I've tried jskyler91's method (see this thread). I've only done yellow and blue before I felt it's incredibly boring and frustrating. Frustrating because I often can't do the most efficient cross even if I see one, since I need to stick to one color for an entire week. Also I get very bad times.

I got a megaminx last week and I feel playing with megaminx helps me tracking and identifying F2L pairs, a lot. I've only specifically practiced yellow and blue cross, but after doing some megaminx solves I feel I can do F2L of other cross colors equally well. My CN time is still about 10% slower than white cross only time. I still need to work on memorizing the cross of other colors, and PLL recognition (I find EPLL cases are the most difficult for me to recognize on different colors for some weird reasons).

So I'd say playing some other type of puzzles, especially megaminx can help you with F2L. 2x2 can possible help as well, since you have to be CN with 2x2. But in the end to make it really work you still need to incorporate these skills into 3x3 and nothing can replace practice.

 

[MoFoYa]

I would go about it a little differently... You're not trying to get a good solve time; you're trying to get used to different colors. SO, I wouldn't worry about the best cross at first. I'd solve starting with a different color each time until I'd cycled through them all (except the one I'm good at) and repeat. This ensures that you get practice with each color equally. Later, after your times even out across all colors, start solving the best cross.

You could also start by practicing the color opposite the one you normally start with... That way your F2L pairs are the same colors and you have two crosses to choose from. When you're good at those two colors, add a third and fourth opposite sides. There are two sets of F2L colors now and 4 crosses... then add the last two colors when you're ready.

It's all about what works for you.

I remember reading somewhere that color neutrality isn't really that much of an advantage though. You save maybe a move or two on the best cross and then lose that time in recognition later. I don't recommend either way; I'm just throwing that out there.