Heise Method Discussion thread

[kunz]

i did find a few of those threads but i was still having trouble with it and they were all from around 2008 so i decided not to revive them.

 

[Cride5]

i did find a few of those threads but i was still having trouble with it and they were all from around 2008 so i decided not to revive them.

What specifically are you having trouble with?

 

[kunz]

step three the two corners

 

[Athefre]

What exactly about the step? Which of the three styles are you using (Edges First, Two Pairs, One Pair)? I'll assume "Two Pairs".

- Are you able to make the first pair in Step 3?
- Are you able to make the second pair while preserving the first?

If you can do both of those, your problem must be in correcting the remaining edges. You need to spend a lot of time reading these pages:

http://www.ryanheise.com/cube/two_pairs.html (Most important)
http://www.ryanheise.com/cube/conjugates.html
http://www.ryanheise.com/cube/commutators.html
http://www.ryanheise.com/cube/pair_3_cycles.html (Not necessary, but useful)

Read each page many times until you completely understand how to cycle the edges between the pairs and how to cycle the pairs around the edges. Write some of the stuff down, get a couple of cubes and practice and study how it works when you are away from the computer.

 

[kunz]

Ive read all of those many times im just not sure how im actually suppose to do it

Edit: im actually using the edges first approach and i just go the edges, commutators are confusing

 

[PM 1729]

Are you interested in speed solving or fewest moves?

If you want to adapt it as a speed solving stratergy, http://s92824201.onlinehome.us/ is useful. Its not been updated in a long time, but a very informative site.

For use in fewest moves, it would be best to look at example solves. Practice different techniques. Edges first is not the best approach in all situations.

 

[kunz]

Are you interested in speed solving or fewest moves?

If you want to adapt it as a speed solving stratergy, http://s92824201.onlinehome.us/ is useful. Its not been updated in a long time, but a very informative site.

For use in fewest moves, it would be best to look at example solves. Practice different techniques. Edges first is not the best approach in all situations.

im just interested in learning it first, it just seamed like a very interesting method.

i understand its not the best solution im just trying to do a complete solve with this method for right now

 

[kpcube]

Heise Method

So i'm not exactly sure if this belongs here because it’s more a cube theory question but as it pertains to speedcubing. I'm not a big memorization fan so I started to you the Petrus Method, as it requires very little algs. But, due to inversions and inverses, other things of that nature I had trouble understanding how the algs flip over the x and y axis’s, as well as not knowing all the algs for specific cases and it killed my times. In short, I came across the Heise Method looking for something a little more intuitive, I have the basic understanding of how the method works but my theory issue lies in completing the necessary movements, such as preserving the orientations of corner and edge pieces after step 1. Any advice or other tutorials you guys know of?

 

[riffz]

Don't use Heise. It's an advanced method useful for purposes other than speedsolving for the most part. You would be better off continuing with Petrus.

 

[kpcube]

Don't use Heise. It's an advanced method useful for purposes other than speedsolving for the most part. You would be better off continuing with Petrus.

I understand that its more for FM's then speed solving but I like the method and fell like it will help improve my F2L when I move to the Fridrich Method after my times get to sub 40 or so. I'm after the understanding of the cube that the Heise requires as well as the very few moves.

 

[AngeL]

If you're dead-set on Heise, then by all means learn it. I wouldn't recommend it however. Heise is quite advanced and it will take you a long time to get to even sub-40. You could probably be sub-20 in that time with CFOP, maybe even Roux or Petrus. Instead of putting yourself through the torture of trying to get started on Heise, why not learn a more standard method to increase your understanding of the cube? If you still want to learn Heise later when you're better, then go for it!

 

[kpcube]

I get that and it does make sense. solving now is somewhat useless as i'm stuck using a store bought cube untill my DIY's come in. I don't see the Heise as all that complicated other than how the orientation of the corners work. Looking at it it seems similer to the Petrus but I feel like i'm missing something is all

 

[Kenneth]

Heise is compleatly intuitive, you use commutators as a substitute for learned algorithms, but if you like to use it for speed you have to memorise the commutators, else it will be slow, makes no difference really...

Or, it does, you will understand the moves you use much better than you will do if you robot solve using CFOP and remember the moves to use is far easier if you understand them.

[wiki]L3C[/wiki] lists all last three corner cases.

 

[irontwig]

Heise has more L3C cases than that though, since the remaining three corners doesn't have to be on one face.

 

[kpcube]

True but can't use just cycle any of them to the top?

 

[some1rational]

I have to agree with most of the opinions here; Heise is quite an advanced method, I'd argue it's better you just learn/understand commutators and conjugates (on Heise's site) than to try to learn his whole method as the edge permutation of the last layer (whilst insertion of the last F2L pair) is something I myself am still trying to learn (I average 25 seconds with CFOP and am very confident in my F2L intuition, still working on look-ahead though)

but if you do understand commutators and conjugates, you can in effect, solve the cube on your own via your own made up algorithms (and the same concept can be pretty easily used on other twisty puzzles as well)

 

[kpcube]

I have to agree with most of the opinions here; Heise is quite an advanced method, I'd argue it's better you just learn/understand commutators and conjugates (on Heise's site) than to try to learn his whole method as the edge permutation of the last layer (whilst insertion of the last F2L pair) is something I myself am still trying to learn (I average 25 seconds with CFOP and am very confident in my F2L intuition, still working on look-ahead though)

but if you do understand commutators and conjugates, you can in effect, solve the cube on your own via your own made up algorithms (and the same concept can be pretty easily used on other twisty puzzles as well)

yeah i've decided to put it aside for now and continue with the Petrus for intuition skill and working on the cross for the fridrich. Heise is deffinately something i'd like to learn in the future but for now I don't wanna get caught up doing a bunch of different things at once and get nowear.

 

[adragast]

Problem with blocks in the Heise method

Hi All !

I feel a bit dumb because I cannot find anything on the problem I am having with the Ryan Heise method (just beginning with it).

Basically what is happening is that I am building 3 blocks 1x2x4 and when I try to create the 4th block ... I am stucked ! The fourth block is not possible to build at all because of the colour I chose. I have had this problem several times so I tried to read and read again the ryan heise website, some videos on youtube, nothing on colour/blocks restrictions except:
- they should share one colour
- one block should be inner, 3 others should be outer

So here is an example. I build my first block with (european colour cube: white vs yellow...):
- blue/white/red corner, blue/red edge, blue/white edge, blue center

Then inner block parallell to it:
- orange/white edge, orange center, white center

I fit these 2 blocks together, continue with a third block:
- green/red/white corner, green/white edge, red/green edge and green center

It is then impossible to find a fourth block...

How to choose the third/fourth block to avoid having problems ? Is there simple rules to follow ?

Thanks a lot for your help,

Adragast

 

[waffle=ijm]

woah 1x2x4 blocks.

I'm having some trouble understanding things here. Usually, I would just pretty much block build while using some commutators and reduce it down to 3 corners. I don't follow any general block building rule with Heise.

 

[oll+phase+sync]

I belive all You have to do is to select the correct face of your cube for the last block. There is also a part on his website where he tells You what to do if the "common" color is missing on one block.

Another standard tip: Orietn some edges befor You go on