[Help Thread] FMC Discussion

[CyanSandwich]

Spoiler

you can also do VLS on inverse: (L' D' L D' F L B' L' B F')

to get to the 3-corner skeleton directly

Oh cool. I don't know any VLS, but I'll add "adding a random single move before sledges and the like" to my repertoire.

 

[Cale S]

Oh cool. I don't know any VLS, but I'll add "adding a random single move before sledges and the like" to my repertoire.

yeah, those can be useful sometimes because they're basically like inserting a 10 move corner comm that cancels 8 or more (such as doing L' U R U' R' L to insert a pair instead of U R U' R'), which you probably wouldn't see when doing insertions

 

[Cale S]

23 single on the ongoing Weekly FMC

Spoiler

R L' U D L2 B R' D F2 L' B' U' D2 R' L F B2 D2 R' L


U F' // square
B' R' D // 2x2x2 + pairs
(B L' B) B2 U' L' // F2L minus edge
(B' R B R' U' R B' R' B U2) // to L3C

skeleton: U B' F' R' D @ B2 U' L' U2 B' R B R' U R B' R' L B'
@ = [U' F' U, B2]

Final solution: U B' F' R' D U' F' U B2 U' F L' U2 B' R B R' U R B' R' L B' (23)

this rolls my avg25 to 25.43

 

[Hssandwich]

Any improvements on this? I couldn't find any good 2x2x2s on the normal and only found a 6 on the inverse, but from there, I couldn't find a good continuation, so I decided to CFOP it and do an insertion for 3 corners at the end, which cancelled 4.

U2 F2 L2 U' F2 D R2 U L2 D' U' B U B2 U L U F2 L' F R

R’ F U’ L B// (5/5) Cross
U B2 U @ B’ F U’ F’// (7/12)F2L-2
U’ R’ U2 R U2 B U’ B’// (8/20)F2L-1
U F’ U F * U2 F’ U F U// (9/29) To L3C

WGR->RWB->WGO
@ D F’ U2 F D’ F’ U2 F (cancels 1)
*F D F’ U2 F D’ F’ U2 (cancels 4)

R’ F U’ L B U B2 U B’ F U’ F’ U’ R’ U2 R U2 B U’ B’ U F’ U F2 D F’ U2 F D’ F2 U F U (33)

 

[AlphaSheep]

This weekend was my first official FMC attempt. I got a 32 move single, and a 38.67 mean. I was more or less happy with the first two attempts, but the last attempt went pretty badly. I have a couple of questions regarding how I can improve.

1. Scramble: D' U2 R2 U2 L2 R2 B2 F U2 F2 R2 B2 R'D L' F' R U2 R

Spoiler

D' L' B // Edge orientation
R2 D // Make a red-blue-yellow square
U2 // Line
R2 D L D' R' // Insert red-yellow-green pair
L D' L' D L' // Make orange-green-white square
D L' (*) D2 L // Solve red-blue-white pair and yellow-green edge
D L' D' L R2 // Solve all remaining edges

Insert at (*) L' B2 L F L' B2 L F' and cancel 1 move.

Solution: D' L' B R2 D U2 R2 D L D' R' L D' L' D L' D L2 B2 L F L' B2 L F' D2 L D L' D' L R2 (32 moves)

I'm disappointed that insertion finder says I missed a couple of 2 move cancellations in my rush.

2. Scramble: D' F' L' B' U' D R F' R' U2 B' L2 U' B2 D' F2 R2 U L2 U2

Spoiler

On the inverse:
R' U B' U2 L' D // Orange-blue-white square
R' U' L // 2x2x2 block
D R' D' // Red-blue-yellow square
D R' F R' D R2 D2 // Insert red-blue-white pair

On normal:
L' F2 L // F2L missing one pair
L D L' // Edge orientation
D2 F' D F D // Solve all edges

Skeleton: L' F2 L2 D L' D2 F' D F D' R2 (+) D' R F' R2 D' L' U R D' L U2 B U' R (*)

Insert at (*) R' U2 R D2 R' U2 R D2, and cancel 3 moves.
Insert at (+) D' L U2 L' D L U2 L'

That leads to the 38 move solution: L' F2 L2 D L' D2 F' D F D' R2 D' L U2 L' D L U2 L' D' R F' R2 D' L' U R D' L U2 B U R D2 R' U2 R D2

I started from the end and moved backward while looking for insertions... But I was running out of time, so I stopped halfway through. Because of this, I missed several 2 move cancellations near the beginning. Does anyone else start from the end? What's a good procedure for looking for insertions?

3. Scramble: D2 B2 D2 L' F2 D2 L2 U2 R2 F' L' U2 L' D B L2 R B F

Spoiler

I couldn't see anything on this scramble. I really didn't know where to begin. I just went for the start I would use in a speedsolve.

On inverse:
B U2 D' L F R2 L U // EOLine
U' F2 D2 U // Red-yellow-green square (Add premove of R2)
R D2 R D' R' D' R // Red-yellow-blue pair

On normal
R2 // Premove from inverse
L2 D L' D L' // F2L missing one pair
D L' D L // Phasing edges
D L' D L D' // Solve edges

That left a 32 move skeleton with 5 unsolved corners. (Bad, even for me, but I was tired and lazy at this point):
R2 L2 D L' D L' D L' D L D L' D L D' R' D R D R' D2 R' U' D2 F2 L' R2 F' L' D U2 B'

I was really tired at this point and I only needed 54 moves or less for the AfR mean, so I didn't even try find insertions. I just tried a few commutators on the end .

B D2 B' U2 B D2 B' U2 cancels 3 moves if I swap the D and U2 at the end of my skeleton.
R (U2 R D2 R' U2 R D2 R') R'. I didn't even notice the R' R' at the end until I wrote it onto the score card.

The final solution was 46 moves: R2 L2 D L' D L' D L' D L D L' D L D' R' D R D R' D2 R' U' D2 F2 L' R2 F' L' U2 D' B' U2 B D2 B' U2 R U2 R D2 R' U2 R D2 R2

What's a good approach when it's 15 minutes into the attempt and you've seen absolutely nothing good? I looked for several blocks on both the normal and inverse, but since I was tired, and my block building isn't that great at the best of times, I saw nothing. I even tried EO from 3 different orientations...

 

[Hssandwich]

My solution (34) for the ongoing weekly FMC:

Spoiler

scramble: U R' L' D F2 D' R2 D' L' F' U' F2 U2 F2 R2 B2 U' F2 B2

D2 U’ L F’ R’//XCross (5/5)
L F’ L’ F //F2L-2 (4/9)
L U’ L’ F’ L’ B2 L F//Switch to green and XXXcross (8/17)
B’ R B’ R’//Tripod block (4/21)
B’ U’ B’ U B’ R B R’ U R’ U’ R B// Finish (13/34)

Found this in about 15 minutes, so I am quite happy about it.

 

[CyanSandwich]

I got another 23 with another 18 move 4C skeleton with ridiculous insertions.

Spoiler

U' F2 D' L' F' R2 F2 U F R U2 F2 U2 B2 L F2 R' F2 D2 L'
i: L D2 F2 R F2 L' B2 U2 F2 U2 R' F' U' F2 R2 F L D F2 U

U2 D B' (D) //2x2x2
(U') R' F' R (F2) //2x2x3
L B L B' (L2) //F2L-1
(F U F' U2) //4C (18)

sk: U2 D B' * R' F' R L B L @ B' U2 F U' F' L2 F2 U D'

* B' R' F' R B R' F R (cancels 7)
@ D' B' U2 B D B' U2 B (cancels 4)

solution: U2 D B2 R' F' R B L B L D' B' U2 B D B' F U' F' L2 F2 U D' (23)

 

[penguinz7]

My solution (34) for the ongoing weekly FMC:

Spoiler

scramble: U R' L' D F2 D' R2 D' L' F' U' F2 U2 F2 R2 B2 U' F2 B2

U’ L F’ R’//XCross (5/5)
L F’ L’ F //F2L-2 (4/9)
L U’ L’ F’ L’ B2 L F//Switch to green and XXXcross (8/17)
B’ R B’ R’//Tripod block (4/21)
B’ U’ B’ U B’ R B R’ U R’ U’ R B// Finish (13/34)

Found this in about 15 minutes, so I am quite happy about it.

FTFY. I'm not sure where you got that D2 from, but it definitely does not belong.

 

[Rmagic]

Fewest moves for this?

Hi, wanted to know a "realistic solve" (cross+f2l+algs) with the fewest moves for this scramble


Position for scramble white top, green front:
R, F, R', U2, B2, F', R2, U, F, L, D, L, D', L2, B', F, U2, D2, L, D, R, U', B2, U2, F2, R, U, R, U2, D, B', R'

thank you!

 

[Hssandwich]

FTFY. I'm not sure where you got that D2 from, but it definitely does not belong.

Thanks, whoops I have no idea where it came from either

 

[irontwig]

Spoiler

I couldn't see anything on this scramble. I really didn't know where to begin. I just went for the start I would use in a speedsolve.

On inverse:
B U2 D' L F R2 L U // EOLine
U' F2 D2 U // Red-yellow-green square (Add premove of R2)
R D2 R D' R' D' R // Red-yellow-blue pair

On normal
R2 // Premove from inverse
L2 D L' D L' // F2L missing one pair
D L' D L // Phasing edges
D L' D L D' // Solve edges

That left a 32 move skeleton with 5 unsolved corners. (Bad, even for me, but I was tired and lazy at this point):
R2 L2 D L' D L' D L' D L D L' D L D' R' D R D R' D2 R' U' D2 F2 L' R2 F' L' D U2 B'

I was really tired at this point and I only needed 54 moves or less for the AfR mean, so I didn't even try find insertions. I just tried a few commutators on the end .

B D2 B' U2 B D2 B' U2 cancels 3 moves if I swap the D and U2 at the end of my skeleton.
R (U2 R D2 R' U2 R D2 R') R'. I didn't even notice the R' R' at the end until I wrote it onto the score card.

The final solution was 46 moves: R2 L2 D L' D L' D L' D L D L' D L D' R' D R D R' D2 R' U' D2 F2 L' R2 F' L' U2 D' B' U2 B D2 B' U2 R U2 R D2 R' U2 R D2 R2

What's a good approach when it's 15 minutes into the attempt and you've seen absolutely nothing good? I looked for several blocks on both the normal and inverse, but since I was tired, and my block building isn't that great at the best of times, I saw nothing. I even tried EO from 3 different orientations...

You don't have to do EO completely on the normal or inverse. If you look you can see that 3/4 blue edges are bad, which means B(') might be a good premove. B' might be better:

Premove: B'
D B [EO+square+pairs]

Switch to the inverse:
B [EO+that stuff]
F2 R B2 U L' U [F2L-1]
L U' L U L2 R2 [L5C]

Too lazy for insertions.

 

[DuffyEdge]

Practicing for FMC Europe and got my very first sub 30!

Spoiler

Scramble - F2 D2 F R2 U2 L2 B' D2 B F R2 U' F2 L U F2 D' B D' F' L2
Inverse: 
B D B' // 2x2x2 block

R2 F' B R' B' // pseudo 2x2x3 block

Premove - D'

D R2 D' R F2 U F U' F' // all but L4C

F U F' D' F U' F' D // 3 cycle (cancels 6 moves)
Skeleton: B D B' R2 (@) F' B R' B' D R2 D' R F2 U D' F U' F' D (19)
(@) = U F U’ B2 U F’ U’ B2
Solution: F U F' D U' F2 R’ D R2 D' B R B' F B2 U F U’ B2 U F’ U’ R2 B D' B’ (26)

I got lucky with my first 3 cycle because it was right at the end but couldn’t find anything good for my final insertion, so I just +8’ed it. How do you practice finding good insertions quickly? And how often do the pros reach optimal move efficiency for insertions? I am really bad at it….

 

[ottozing]

Practicing for FMC Europe and got my very first sub 30!

Spoiler

Scramble - F2 D2 F R2 U2 L2 B' D2 B F R2 U' F2 L U F2 D' B D' F' L2
Inverse: 
B D B' // 2x2x2 block

R2 F' B R' B' // pseudo 2x2x3 block

Premove - D'

D R2 D' R F2 U F U' F' // all but L4C

F U F' D' F U' F' D // 3 cycle (cancels 6 moves)
Skeleton: B D B' R2 (@) F' B R' B' D R2 D' R F2 U D' F U' F' D (19)
(@) = U F U’ B2 U F’ U’ B2
Solution: F U F' D U' F2 R’ D R2 D' B R B' F B2 U F U’ B2 U F’ U’ R2 B D' B’ (26)

I got lucky with my first 3 cycle because it was right at the end but couldn’t find anything good for my final insertion, so I just +8’ed it. How do you practice finding good insertions quickly? And how often do the pros reach optimal move efficiency for insertions? I am really bad at it….

You actually cancelled one move with your insertion but didn't realize it

anyway, aside from just practice and knowing what to look for, you should consider writing your skeleton to the normal scramble to make things easier. Other than that, assuming you know NISS you should be fine.

 

[DuffyEdge]

You actually cancelled one move with your insertion but didn't realize it

anyway, aside from just practice and knowing what to look for, you should consider writing your skeleton to the normal scramble to make things easier. Other than that, assuming you know NISS you should be fine.

Thanks for the advice, I guess it is just practice I'll do that in my attempt today

 

[xyzzy]

Snagged the NR on my first official FMC at Singapore Open 2016! I didn't bother with skeletons at all because I'm not good at finding insertions under time pressure, so these are all bog standard NISS/Petrus solves.

Scramble #1: R B2 L' D2 L' B2 F2 L2 B2 R2 D' B2 R B' L R' B U' R2 B'

Spoiler

inverse:
B' L B F2 U' B // 2x2x2 and pair (6/6)
B D' B' R F' R' F // 2x2x3 (6/12)
D L2 D L2 D2 L // square (6/18)
F L' F' L // F2L (4/22)
F' D' R' D R F // CPEOLL (6/28)
R D2 R2 D' R2 D' R2 D2 R // 2GLL (9/37)

final solution (37):
R' D2 R2 D R2 D R2 D2 R' F' R' D' R D F L' F L F' L' D2 L2 D' L2 D' F' R F R' B D B2 U F2 B' L' B

Optimal for the LL is antisune+fruruf with one move cancelled (13f instead of 15f); I wonder why I didn't find that.

Scramble #2: B' D F' U L2 D2 F2 B' L' F2 U2 B2 D B2 D R2 L2 D' R2

Spoiler

U2 L2 F U2 // 2x2x2 (4/4)
inverse:
B L2 D' L B2 D' B' // 2x2x3 + EO (7/11)
normal:
D L2 D' L D2 // square (5/16)
L' U' F2 L' F2 L F2 U // F2L (8/24)
B' L' B L' F L' B' L F' L2 B L // ZBLL (12/36)

final solution (36):
U2 L2 F U2 D L2 D' L D2 L' U' F2 L' F2 L F2 U B' L' B L' F L' B' L F' L2 B L B D B2 L' D L2 B'

Had the standard Sune diag-swap COLL here. There's also this shorter finish (lol didn't notice CP was already solved):

F L2 F' L' F L' F' L2 // corners (8/24)
D L S L2 S' L D' // edges (9/33)

Scramble #3: L D' L' B' D' L2 U2 F' U' B U2 B2 L2 B2 U' L2 B2 U' B2 U

Spoiler

R2 U' F' D B' // 2x2x2 (5/5)
F' L U' F' // 2x2x3 + EO (4/9)
inverse:
U L U2 L U2 L U2 L // square (8/17)
normal:
U2 L' U2 L // F2L (4/21)
B R' D2 R B' U2 B R' D2 R B' // corner twist (11/32)

final solution (32):
R2 U' F' D B' F' L U' F' U2 L' U2 L B R' D2 R B' U2 B R' D2 R B' L' U2 L' U2 L' U2 L' U'

InsertionFinder makes a 29-move solution out of this, whelp.

 

[guysensei1]

Snagged the NR on my first official FMC at Singapore Open 2016! I didn't bother with skeletons at all because I'm not good at finding insertions under time pressure, so these are all bog standard NISS/Petrus solves.

Good job, that NR was just waiting to be broken, nice to see that it's something actually challenging now

 

[Bubtore]

My first try inserting a 2E3C !

Scramble // R F R2 D2 B' U2 B U2 F2 D2 F' R2 D' F D B L' F' L B2 D'
Inverse // D B2 L' F L B' D' F' D R2 F D2 F2 U2 B' U2 B D2 R2 F' R'

(F' D' F' R') // 222
U2 L' U L B L // 223 + EO
(B U' B2 U B2 U B U2) // 2E3C

Skeleton // U2 L' U L B L U2 B' * U' B2 U' B2 U B' R F D F - 18
* B2 L F R' U2 R F' L2 B L

Solution // U2 L' U L B L U2 B L F R' U2 R F' L2 B L U' B2 U' B2 U B' R F D F - 27 Moves

 

[andersonaap]

Hi everybody.

I want some general help for improvement. I would like to be more constant around 30-33.
The most my skeletons are AB5C around 23up moves.
1) tips for learn/improve/practing blockbuilding.
2) tips for learn/improve permutation of last edges to force AB3C.
3) how do you study another cuber solves?
4) I am 'adicted' with EO first aproach. any tip for identify when EO will be bad in a scramble.
5) after petrus/heise/zz/cfop/roux, which method would be good for learning some useful (at least concept/mindset) in a real solution ?
or just foucs on the previous one?

 

[RhysC]

Hi everybody.

I want some general help for improvement. I would like to be more constant around 30-33.
The most my skeletons are AB5C around 23up moves.
1) tips for learn/improve/practing blockbuilding.
2) tips for learn/improve permutation of last edges to force AB3C.
3) how do you study another cuber solves?
4) I am 'adicted' with EO first aproach. any tip for identify when EO will be bad in a scramble.
5) after petrus/heise/zz/cfop/roux, which method would be good for learning some useful (at least concept/mindset) in a real solution ?
or just foucs on the previous one?

1) You can access a blockbuilding trainer here: http://cubegrass.appspot.com/block_trainer/
2) Just spam different ways to finish your f2l-1 until you get one. 99% of the time it's possible if you try. Also remember that have more than 3 corners is perfectly ok, as long as you are decent at insertions.
3) Pick up the cube, scramble with their scramble and do their moves. See what they are doing. Note some might use interesting notation such as () for NISS.
4) It's pretty obvious, you should just do a block first if it's easier. Only do EO if you can't get a 2x2x2 in <6 moves.
5) Honestly, your solution shouldn't be method-based. If you're going to do one however, stick with Heise.

 

[Bubtore]

S // R F' R2 B2 D2 B' D2 F U2 R2 D2 U' F2 U L' D2 B' D' F2 L'
I // L F2 D B D2 L U' F2 U D2 R2 U2 F' D2 B D2 B2 R2 F R'

R B D' F //123
(L2 U' L2 U2 L D') // 4E4C

Skeleton // R B # D' * F D L' U2 L2 U L2
* F' L2 B L2 F
# L D' R D L' D' . R' D
. B R' F R B' R' F' R

Solution // R B L D' R D L' D' B R' F R B' R' F2 L2 B L2 F2 D L' U2 L2 U L2 - 25 Moves