[Help Thread] FMC Discussion

[Torch]

I didn't try R2 B' R D' or any other start (mostly because I knew that if I were going to do that 4C, it was gonna take me a long time) - I'll give it a shot sometime soon, and see if I can come up with anything.

Okay, cool; you can see what I did here (moves on inverse in parentheses and cancelling moves bolded). Congratulations on winning!

 

[TheDubDubJr]

Did you find anything on scramble 3 with the 2x2x2 R2 B' R D'? You can make a 2x2x3 with B U' L' B' L, R B2 U' R B', or B2 R U' R B' after that, but I couldn't really find a good continuation for any of those.

Yea I didn't look at that either.

I found a Pseudo 2x2x2 using D' U R U2 (Also tried D' U R U but wasn't a better continuation.

Then after that there is 3 different 4move continuations for a 9move 2x2x3. F' U F U', R F R' F', or R2 F R2 F'.

I went with F' U F U' and found a couple nice continuations including an easy 17 to L4C and 21 to L3C. Both have 27 optimal.

 

[not_kevin]

Yea I didn't look at that either.

I found a Pseudo 2x2x2 using D' U R U2 (Also tried D' U R U but wasn't a better continuation.

Then after that there is 3 different 4move continuations for a 9move 2x2x3. F' U F U', R F R' F', or R2 F R2 F'.

I went with F' U F U' and found a couple nice continuations including an easy 17 to L4C and 21 to L3C. Both have 27 optimal.

That's what I did :3

But I actually didn't find the 21 to L3C, I only found a 21 to 2 twisted :< What was the 21?

 

[Torch]

Yea I didn't look at that either.

I found a Pseudo 2x2x2 using D' U R U2 (Also tried D' U R U but wasn't a better continuation.

Then after that there is 3 different 4move continuations for a 9move 2x2x3. F' U F U', R F R' F', or R2 F R2 F'.

I went with F' U F U' and found a couple nice continuations including an easy 17 to L4C and 21 to L3C. Both have 27 optimal.

Looks like that was what notkevin did. Ugh, I need to look at pseudoblocks more often.

 

[TheDubDubJr]

That's what I did :3

But I actually didn't find the 21 to L3C, I only found a 21 to 2 twisted :< What was the 21?

Scramble 3: U' F2 U' F2 L2 U L U2 B L2 R' B L' F2 U' R U2 R2

(U premove on normal)
D' U R U2 // 2x2x2
F' U F U' // 2x2x3
R D' F' R' [F] // F2L-corner
[F] L2 B' L' B L' F' D' // 21 to L3C

After the 2x2x3, the 17 to L4C was this:

D' R' D R2 F' R F R2

 

[Ranzha]

I came into FMC USA 2015 with two reasonable goals:
1. Sub-32 mean
2. Beat Kit Clement

I ended up not only achieving these goals, but also coming in first place at the Berkeley location. The scrambles weren't great, but I didn't find them as awful as a lot of the better FMC competitors did.

My solutions from FMC USA 2015:

Note: Moves inside () were done on inverse. Moves without commas or colons inside [] are cancelling moves.

1. Scramble: F U B' L' F' U F2 D2 R' U' L2 D' F2 R2 U' R2 U' L2 U R2

Spoiler

(F2) R2 U' L B L' @ // ps222
(R2 B2 U2)
U2
(R B') // 223 + 3 pairs (12)
// panic
B U R U' R2 U' [B U // F2L
U' B'] D B' D' B2 U R' // AB3E (24)

@ D2 F2 U2 R B2 U2 F2 L // insertion at 57:00, cancel 0

Final: R2 U' L B L' D2 F2 U2 R B2 U2 F2 L U2 B U R U' R2 U' D B' D' B2 U R' B R' U2 B2 R2 F2 (32)

Optimal insertions were 10-movers that cancel 10 (lol not happening)

I plugged the 12-move 2x2x3 + 3 pairs into CubeExplorer, and that position can be solved in 12 moves for a 24-move solution.
NotKevin seemed to find it, and my skeleton (given the correct insertion) should have yielded that. However, I don't look for 10-move insertions on 3-edge skeletons usually because I don't have the time to look for 6-, 8-, and 10-movers. This was a case where my hands were shaking trying to find a quick 8-move insertion, and I cancelled 0.

It turns out that at the end of the F2L phase, the resulting LL case is a 10-mover that here would cancel 6, yielding the same solutions as the optimal insertion and the 12-move finish as described above.

Oh well. Just gotta know more things I guess.

2. Scramble: D' L2 F2 R2 U L2 D2 R2 B' R U L2 U F' U2 F' U B U'

Spoiler

(R F' U R B) // 222
(R2 B R' B' D2) // 2x-cross
(L' F' L F) // pair and oh boy
(D F' D') // F2L-1
(F R F2 R') // F2L
(D R D' U F U' F' D R D' F') // LL (OLLCP, EPLL skip) (32)

Final: F D R' D' F U F' U' D R' D' R F2 R' F' D F D' F' L' F L D2 B R B' R2 B' R' U' F R' (32)

I wasn't entirely sure where to go after the 9-move 2x2x3, but after doing the D2 L' F' L, I saw the pair opportunities, but wasn't sure how to approach the rest. With 15 minutes to go, I decided to FMCFAP and found the nice finish. #thefmcfapperstrikesagain

3. Scramble: U' F2 U' F2 L2 U L U2 B L2 R' B L' F2 U' R U2 R2

Spoiler

R2 B' R D' // 222
R' U' L U' L' U // 2x-cross
B R B' D @ B D' B
R B' R2 B R B' R // AB3C (24)

@ [D R2 D', L'] cancels 1, optimal

Final: R2 B' R D' R' U' L U' L' U B R B' D2 R2 D' L' D R2 D' L B D' B R B' R2 B R B' R (31)

In 10 minutes, I found a 27 to 3C backup skeleton with insertions that cancelled 2 moves for a 33. But I was determined for the sub-32 mean, so with that in my back pocket, I found this 31 with about 15 minutes to go. It sucks that the insertion only cancelled 1, but it caused a sub-32 mean nonetheless.

 

[not_kevin]

Scramble 3: U' F2 U' F2 L2 U L U2 B L2 R' B L' F2 U' R U2 R2

(U premove on normal)
D' U R U2 // 2x2x2
F' U F U' // 2x2x3
R D' F' R' [F] // F2L-corner
[F] L2 B' L' B L' F' D' // 21 to L3C

After the 2x2x3, the 17 to L4C was this:

D' R' D R2 F' R F R2

Looks like a minor typo in the F2L-corner? (Should be D', not D?)

Yeah, I should've tried to be more flexible from that start, but I saw the 12-move tripod and just went with that I did find the 17 -> 4C, but I don't do them enough >.< Any tips for getting through 4C cases quickly? It's like, in that awkward spot to me where it's not flexible enough to just find a bomb insertion and go from there (like with 2 twisted), but it's not so limited that I can actually check every corner case (like 5C). But maybe I'm doing insertions inefficiently?

1. Scramble: F U B' L' F' U F2 D2 R' U' L2 D' F2 R2 U' R2 U' L2 U R2

Spoiler

(F2) R2 U' L B L' @ // ps222
(R2 B2 U2)
U2
(R B') // 223 + 3 pairs (12)
// panic
B U R U' R2 U' [B U // F2L
U' B'] D B' D' B2 U R' // AB3E (24)

@ D2 F2 U2 R B2 U2 F2 L // insertion at 57:00, cancel 0

Final: R2 U' L B L' D2 F2 U2 R B2 U2 F2 L U2 B U R U' R2 U' D B' D' B2 U R' B R' U2 B2 R2 F2 (32)

Optimal insertions were 10-movers that cancel 10 (lol not happening)

I plugged the 12-move 2x2x3 + 3 pairs into CubeExplorer, and that position can be solved in 12 moves for a 24-move solution.
NotKevin seemed to find it, and my skeleton (given the correct insertion) should have yielded that. However, I don't look for 10-move insertions on 3-edge skeletons usually because I don't have the time to look for 6-, 8-, and 10-movers. This was a case where my hands were shaking trying to find a quick 8-move insertion, and I cancelled 0.

It turns out that at the end of the F2L phase, the resulting LL case is a 10-mover that here would cancel 6, yielding the same solutions as the optimal insertion and the 12-move finish as described above.

Oh well. Just gotta know more things I guess.

For people curious, here's the 12-mover I found after the 2x2x3+3pairs:

Spoiler

Setup, copied from Ranzha:
(F2) R2 U' L B L' @ // ps222
(R2 B2 U2)
U2
(R B') // 223 + 3 pairs (12)

Continue on normal:
B U R U' // dum de dum
R D' R D // make some thangs
U' B U R' // oops

 

[Cale S]

U' F2 U' F2 L2 U L U2 B L2 R' B L' F2 U' R U2 R2

since we're discussing this scramble, here's a nice start I found:

D' U R U2 F' (F' U') // F2L - 1 minus corner

 

[Joey VOV]

Did you find anything on scramble 3 with the 2x2x2 R2 B' R D'? You can make a 2x2x3 with B U' L' B' L, R B2 U' R B', or B2 R U' R B' after that, but I couldn't really find a good continuation for any of those.

After that 2x2, I did the R B2 U' R B' continuation, however I did it with an extra move to form a pair, so I did R B2 U' R U B'. After that, the rest of my solve looked like this:
U' R
B U' B'
R2 F R' F' R' U'
B R2 B' R' B R' B' U2

Final solution being a 29, notbad.

 

[Cale S]

ok I just found this (third scramble of FMC USA)

U' F2 U' F2 L2 U L U2 B L2 R' B L' F2 U' R U2 R2

D' U R U2 F' (F' U') // F2L - 1 minus corner
(B R B') // EO + pair
(D R2 D' R2) // F2L - 1
R D2 R' // to block comm
(F R F' D2 F R' F' D) // block comm

final solution: D' U R U2 F' R D2 R' D' F R F' D2 F R' F' R2 D R2 D' B R' B' U F (25)

 

[cmhardw]

With the same cycle, we can use the interchange B. This would leave us with a trigger of (U F U'). Since we are sending the non-interchange to its correct position, we use the comm ABA'B', being:
(U F U') B (U F' U') B'

But that doesn't work.

Help?

First thought is that the alg should be
(U F U') B' (U F' U') B
in order to affect the same three pieces, unless I don't follow the question correctly.

 

[Isaac Lai]

Scramble: R D2 B2 D2 B2 R F2 U2 L U2 R F U' B2 F L D' L2 D' F

D’ L D2 L’ U L2 // 2x2x2
F2 D’ F // 2x2x3
R2 D R D2 R B R B’ // F2L w/o cross edge
R F B’ D2 F’ B (cancelled) // insert cross edge
B’ (cancelled) R’ D R B R’ B’ D’ B R // OLL (PLL skip)

Final solution: D’ L D2 L’ U L2 F2 D’ F R2 D R D2 R B R B’ R F B’ D2 F’ R’ D R B R’ B’ D’ B R (31)

Great solve for the weekly comp, especially since this is my first proper attempt (i.e. sitting down for one hour straight and not submitting the first solution). Does anyone have any tips? The ending is pretty awful but it was the best I could find because I don't know anything about insertions and whatnot. I basically spammed solutions until I got that PLL skip.

 

[TheDubDubJr]

Foinally got a PB after almost 2 years.

This was the scramble for the Negative Time Solve 2015. http://cubefreak.net/contests/negative/

Spoiler: Negative Time Solve FMC - 19 moves

Scramble - U' L2 D' U R2 B R2 F2 L' U F' D2 R D2 R B F' D2 U' L R2 B2 D U' F L' R F D U2
Inverse - U2 D' F' R' L F' U D' B2 R2 L' U D2 F B' R' D2 R' D2 F U' L F2 R2 B' R2 U' D L2 U

i R2 B' // EO (2/2)
switch
n U2 // 2pairs (1/3)
switch
i U' L' D2 // 2 2x2x1s (3/6)
switch
n D2 [L'] R2 // 2x2x3 (3/9)
[L'] U L R // Pseudo F2L (4-1/12)
F U F' U F U2 F' // Sune Skip (7/19)
R2 // Fix Pseudo (1/20)

Although we were planning on doing this for a 2-hour attempt because of the time change. I got this 20 after about 55min into the attempt.
For some reason about 5min later I looked at the first 4 moves and realized how odd they looked and I randomly did the moves and noticed I could do them in reverse and cancel a move!

U2 D2 L2 R2 (R2 L2 D2 U2 R2 L2 D2 U2) U L R F U F' U F U2 F' R2 D2 L U B R2
// 8 move insertion that does nothing and cancels 9

R2 L2 D2 U' L R F U F' U F U2 F' R2 D2 L U B R2
19 move solution

 

[Mark Boyanowski]

Foinally got a PB after almost 2 years.

This was the scramble for the Negative Time Solve 2015. http://cubefreak.net/contests/negative/

Spoiler: Negative Time Solve FMC - 19 moves

Scramble - U' L2 D' U R2 B R2 F2 L' U F' D2 R D2 R B F' D2 U' L R2 B2 D U' F L' R F D U2
Inverse - U2 D' F' R' L F' U D' B2 R2 L' U D2 F B' R' D2 R' D2 F U' L F2 R2 B' R2 U' D L2 U

i R2 B' // EO (2/2)
switch
n U2 // 2pairs (1/3)
switch
i U' L' D2 // 2 2x2x1s (3/6)
switch
n D2 [L'] R2 // 2x2x3 (3/9)
[L'] U L R // Pseudo F2L (4-1/12)
F U F' U F U2 F' // Sune Skip (7/19)
R2 // Fix Pseudo (1/20)

Although we were planning on doing this for a 2-hour attempt because of the time change. I got this 20 after about 55min into the attempt.
For some reason about 5min later I looked at the first 4 moves and realized how odd they looked and I randomly did the moves and noticed I could do them in reverse and cancel a move!

U2 D2 L2 R2 (R2 L2 D2 U2 R2 L2 D2 U2) U L R F U F' U F U2 F' R2 D2 L U B R2
// 8 move insertion that does nothing and cancels 9

R2 L2 D2 U' L R F U F' U F U2 F' R2 D2 L U B R2
19 move solution

You should've tried inserting a 10 mover that cancels 9... (a few people will get this joke).

 

[JackJ]

Third scramble from FMC USA 2015 A few weeks ago.

U' F2 U' F2 L2 U L U2 B L2 R' B L' F2 U' R U2 R2

Spoiler

Pre move: U2
2x2: U2 R2 U' R' U
F2L - 1 pair: R D' F' R' F B' R' B
F2L 4: R' D2 R2 D R D' R D
LL: F' R' F R F' R' F R D R2

Final Solution: (32 moves)
U2 R2 U' R' U R D' F' R' F B' R' B R' D2 R2 D R D' R D F' R' F R F' R' F R D R2 U2

My final mean was 36.67, which I guess is pretty good for me. I was lucky and found PLL skips on all three of my attempts and this solution was particularly satisfying. I found it in about 10 minutes and am too inexperienced to find anything better with the other ~50 minutes I had to work with. Overall I am very pleased with my performance.

 

[ardi4nto]

Is there any resource where I can learn "domino" solving technique?
I saw this user at weekly FMC who regularly done it: https://www.ocf.berkeley.edu/~dadams/fmc/98/
And seems like it's an efficient method

What is "domino" anyway? Is it feasible to do it in 1 hour instead of regular blockbuilding, NISS, premoves, and insertion techniques?

 

[irontwig]

A Rubik's domino is a 3x3x2:

Look at his solutions and you'll probably get it, though this Baldav guy is the only one that I know that use it with any kind of regularity.

 

[shadowslice e]

Is there any resource where I can learn "domino" solving technique?
I saw this user at weekly FMC who regularly done it: https://www.ocf.berkeley.edu/~dadams/fmc/98/
And seems like it's an efficient method

What is "domino" anyway? Is it feasible to do it in 1 hour instead of regular blockbuilding, NISS, premoves, and insertion techniques?

Well, the first stage of SSC reduces the cube to a domino so it's feasible but I don't know how practical it is for FMC (the first stage is EOedge+3Dcorners, SLS= ~15 moves but you can definately do it more efficiently than that.)

 

[2180161]

Isn't that "domino method" very similar to HTA?

 

[shadowslice e]

Isn't that "domino method" very similar to HTA?

Basically yeah. Lots of FMC techniques are actually pretty similar because they all deal with EO, CP and CO.