[Help Thread] Roux Discussion and Help

[pewpewrawr]

I only ever save SB pairs if it requires 1 or no moves, I don't like to make unnecessary moves during my FB. There's almost always a SB pair that can be made with 1-2 moves right away, so unless it's shorter than that I don't see the point.

 

[GuRoux]

I mean if it's an RB pair, so the RB isn't set up to have it stored.

oh, then i guess that's a good idea if you can't figure out a good way to juggle it around while doing the first block. that actually seems like a convenient way of doing it some cases. thanks for adding that to my first block knowledge.

 

[DeeDubb]

oh, then i guess that's a good idea if you can't figure out a good way to juggle it around while doing the first block. that actually seems like a convenient way of doing it some cases. thanks for adding that to my first block knowledge.

Sure, I agree with pewpew though that it needs to be close to being stored already or else it's not worth preserving. I might make a tip video on it pretty soon.

 

[pewpewrawr]

Yay someone actually agrees with me lol. Maybe I'm just not good enough at planning ahead, but I like my FB to be short and quick, too many extra moves and I feel like I'm over thinking it. So yeah, maybe there's a more advanced technique to preserving pairs that I don't know yet? But I've found that having a free pair doesn't always equate to less moves.

 

[DeeDubb]

Yay someone actually agrees with me lol. Maybe I'm just not good enough at planning ahead, but I like my FB to be short and quick, too many extra moves and I feel like I'm over thinking it. So yeah, maybe there's a more advanced technique to preserving pairs that I don't know yet? But I've found that having a free pair doesn't always equate to less moves.

I tend to find that I get all screwed up when I try preserving a pair during a speed solve. I'm trying to get better at it, so I don't panic when it happens. Storing it out of the way seems like a possibly legit technique considering how many moves it can save you later.

In the end though, the first block should be completely memo'd (which for me it's not), so it becomes irrelevant because the best Rouxers will have the first block planned and miss the possibility of preserving the pair for the second block (unless they can somehow notice that a SB pair will form during inspection... which just seems insane)

 

[pewpewrawr]

Yes but how many moves does it really save you? Making a pair is quick and easy, wasting a bunch of moves trying to preserve one is not.

 

[DeeDubb]

Yes but how many moves does it really save you? Making a pair is quick and easy, wasting a bunch of moves trying to preserve one is not.

A bad pair on the RB can take 5 moves or so. Preserving a pair in a free slot on the FB will take 2 or 3 at most.

 

[pewpewrawr]

My first SB pair is never 5 moves, unless I'm being lazy. First pairs on the SB are 1-2 moves, 3 at most (3 is pretty rare).

 

[DeeDubb]

My first SB pair is never 5 moves, unless I'm being lazy. First pairs on the SB are 1-2 moves, 3 at most (3 is pretty rare).

What about something like this? It takes me 5 moves to pair this case up.

http://alg.cubing.net/?stage=F2L&setup=R_U_R-_U-_R_U_R-_U-_R_M-_U_M2&alg=Rw-_U-_R_U_M-

 

[pewpewrawr]

That's a second pair, second pairs can take more moves; I thought we were talking about first pairs. I would assume if you're preserving a pair during your FB you're going to use it to build the 2x2x1.

 

[DeeDubb]

That's a second pair, second pairs can take more moves; I thought we were talking about first pairs. I would assume if you're preserving a pair during your FB you're going to use it to build the 2x2x1.

I mean regardless of whether it was first or second pair. If that's the first case you saw, it would take 5 moves to pair regardless. I suppose you could search around and find a faster pair, but I usually just pair the first two I see because it ends up being faster than searching.

 

[pewpewrawr]

Always do the most optimal solution you can, that's the only way to go in roux. Once it becomes brainless you automagically see easy cases while finishing the FB. Not trying to tell you what to do, this is just my opinion.

edit: This also is why I don't time myself often. You spend too much time worrying about how "fast" you were, and not enough time worrying about the actual moves you made. I don't need a clock to tell me where I need to improve.

 

[Renslay]

Always do the most optimal solution you can, that's the only way to go in roux. Once it becomes brainless you automagically see easy cases while finishing the FB. Not trying to tell you what to do, this is just my opinion.

I agree. I can see on myself the improvement of the lookahead on the SB, and thus I can choose shorter (thus faster) pairings and block buildings.

 

[pewpewrawr]

Oh yea, sorry if my edit sounded rude. I was saying "you" in a general sense, not specifically directing it at anyone.

 

[DeeDubb]

Here's a scramble where I found storing to be helpful:

L F2 U2 L2 D2 R U2 R' D2 U2 L F' U2 B' R D U' R' D2 F2 U'

 

[GuRoux]

Here's a scramble where I found storing to be helpful:

L F2 U2 L2 D2 R U2 R' D2 U2 L F' U2 B' R D U' R' D2 F2 U'

how, i'm looking around and it doesn't seem like it. i see a very easy blue block with yellow on bottom that can be built easily while keeping the green pair.

 

[DeeDubb]

how, i'm looking around and it doesn't seem like it. i see a very easy blue block with yellow on bottom that can be built easily while keeping the green pair.

Yeah, you can add one extra move to preserve the pair while you finish the last pair of your first block, or spend one move storing it at the beginning (actually zero moves if you slice the middle up instead of bringing both pairs down).

 

[GuRoux]

Yeah, you can add one extra move to preserve the pair while you finish the last pair of your first block, or spend one move storing it at the beginning (actually zero moves if you slice the middle up instead of bringing both pairs down).

hmm, the way i'm doing it it doesn't actually have to be stored or moved out of the way, maybe i'm not seeing something as efficient?

 

[DeeDubb]

hmm, the way i'm doing it it doesn't actually have to be stored or moved out of the way, maybe i'm not seeing something as efficient?

What's your FB? I have to do an extra turn when I pair up the second one. You probably are doing it better.

 

[Renslay]

Here's a scramble where I found storing to be helpful:

L F2 U2 L2 D2 R U2 R' D2 U2 L F' U2 B' R D U' R' D2 F2 U'

Not for my colors.