[Help Thread] Colour Neutrality Discussion

[teller]

Don't listen to anyone who says "it's just one less turn on average." It's misleading.

When you're stuck with an awful cross, it doesn't feel like "one extra turn." When you can't see into the first F2L pair during inspection, it doesn't feel like "one extra turn." One dry, abstract statement about the math does not describe the messy human reality of good and bad solves.

What is your first reaction when you get a real easy cross? Uh huh...you're thinking, "Oooh! Possible PB!" Exactly.

I took the leap a month ago. I'd encourage you to do the same. Probably better to do so early than to wait until your brain is totally welded to one color like mine was. And don't expect to achieve full neutrality overnight...in some ways it feels like starting over, a real setback. If you can accept that and be patient, you can only gain. It certainly won't hurt.

 

[ukrcuber]

Dno, im not from UK

teller, thanks for good advice

 

[Feryll]

What is your first reaction when you get a real easy cross? Uh huh...you're thinking, "Oooh! Possible PB!" Exactly.

So are you saying that a good cross will give you a psychological advantage? If so, I agree with you. Same goes for a good f2l pair or two. I always feel a lot faster when that happens.

Also, I can back up the idea of learning early. I was still above minute when I became CN. I was still using Dan Brown's method, so I didn't even know proper f2l pairing. I don't even think my times took a noticeable drop when I started so early.​

 

[Kirjava]

well, Kirjava, i want to be CN not because it's popular, or somethin

It's just something that happens. It doesn't really affect your times. Unless you are switching to CN, in which case it'll just make your times worse.

After the new world record there were a bajillion "OMG IM GONNA BE COLOUR NEUTRAL" threads. As if CN is a better technique, as opposed to simply different.

so i decide for now to learn everything completely, and only THEN to become fully CN

This is an awful, awful idea.

 

[ukrcuber]

ok) ill start it earlier)

 

[dannyz0r]

Do you always end sentences/phrases with parenthesis?

 

[ukrcuber]

no, it just happens to be a habit

 

[lorki3]

Or maybe it's just because hes good at 3x3. A lot of people are color neutral it doesn't mean that they instantly turn into Feliks

he is without color neutral really fast but with color neutral he is one second or so faster I think

 

[DavidWoner]

Or maybe it's just because hes good at 3x3. A lot of people are color neutral it doesn't mean that they instantly turn into Feliks

he is without color neutral really fast but with color neutral he is one second or so faster I think

It just seems that way because he rarely does single-color averages. I'm sure if he did only single color, or opp-color for a week then we would see times close to his good averages. Obviously a random avg12, regardless of cross color, is probably not going to beat his PB.

 

[CUB3R01]

Or maybe it's just because hes good at 3x3. A lot of people are color neutral it doesn't mean that they instantly turn into Feliks

he is without color neutral really fast but with color neutral he is one second or so faster I think

It just seems that way because he rarely does single-color averages. I'm sure if he did only single color, or opp-color for a week then we would see times close to his good averages. Obviously a random avg12, regardless of cross color, is probably not going to beat his PB.

Hm... Until this thread I have never really considered being just white/yellow with color neutrality as opposed to all color. I'm going to give that a shot!

 

[DavidSanders]

Never, I think if you didn't start soon that way you should not now.

 

[Haste_cube]

Jogjakarta cubers have a tradition(not really), Jogja goes colour netral
like for example on Monday, they use white as cross, Tuesday blue, and so on
well, maybe you should start right now if you want to be a CN

 

[Am1n-]

The average number of moves for a fixed cross is 5.81 while the average number of moves for a color neutral cross is 4.81 moves, so we're talking about saving 1 move on average.

Maybe you should look into fixed- colour X-cross and CN- X-cross, my intuition tells me the numbers would be somewhat better (4 X-cross possabilities or 24 X-cross possabilities).
But then again, who does use X-cross every solve?

mvg

 

[TheBB]

Do you always end sentences/phrases with parenthesis?

They're east-bloc style smileys. I'm guessing he's Ukrainian. I have a couple of Russian friends doing the same thing.

 

[Chuck]

Jogjakarta cubers have a tradition (not really): Jogja goes colour netral
like for example on Monday, they use white as cross, Tuesday blue, and so on
well, maybe you should start right now if you want to be a CN

Yes, it's really fun here, but rather useless for me because I only care in BLD.
Color neutral BLD will be a nightmare for image based memo system XD

 

[RyanO]

Or maybe it's just because hes good at 3x3. A lot of people are color neutral it doesn't mean that they instantly turn into Feliks

he is without color neutral really fast but with color neutral he is one second or so faster I think

I can assure you that Feliks isn't anything close to 1 second faster on average because of color neutrality. Feliks is very fast and he happens to be color neutral. It's just a coincidence. There are so many more tangible things to concentrate on that can actually help your times.

 

[Dene]

anyway the only difference CN makes is a slightly shorter cross on average. It's not like CN will magically drop 2 seconds off your time without improving other things first. Rowe and Faz are fast because they turn at ridiculous TPS, not because they are color neutral.

I am testament to this

 

[miniGOINGS]

Correct me if I'm wrong, but the only thing that colour neutrality can possibly improve is the first step. I see much more merit in partial blockbuilding colour neutrality, but not Fridrich colour neutrality.

 

[jms_gears1]

Or maybe it's just because hes good at 3x3. A lot of people are color neutral it doesn't mean that they instantly turn into Feliks

he is without color neutral really fast but with color neutral he is one second or so faster I think

I can assure you that Feliks isn't anything close to 1 second faster on average because of color neutrality. Feliks is very fast and he happens to be color neutral. It's just a coincidence. There are so many more tangible things to concentrate on that can actually help your times.

you guys dont understand what color neutrality is do you?

if Feliks does an average of 100 and only solves the white cross thats still color neutral.

If your CN you only do CN solves if your not then you dont.

when you say someone is CN your saying they have the ability to solve it, in a time consistent with your average not solving it with a different color every time.

 

[RyanO]

if Feliks does an average of 100 and only solves the white cross thats still color neutral.

Erm, no.