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GuRoux

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Hello. I use roux as my main method, and my PB times are in my signature down below. My solve breakup is usually 8 second for first 2 blocks, 1, 2, or 3 seconds for (full) CMLL (depending on the case), and 4 or 5 seconds for my LSE, with minimal pauses (other than a third of a second for CMLL). I am always working on blocks, and I am getting faster. I know my CMLL is slow, but I'm working on that too. What I'm worried about is my LSE. I have been stuck at 4/5 seconds since i was averaging 30 seconds, and I feel that I can improve to 3 maybe 2 seconds, but I can't seem to eliminate unnecessary turns between steps. For example, after orienting edges (4a) I always do an M' to line up centers (white or yellow on top) and then continue with L and R edges. Any tips?

i don't understand how you can just not do a M'. i know when i finish 4a, my yellow and white centeres are always top and bottom. Just try to get rid of your pauses. try doing LSE smooth like alexander lau but at a slower more manageable pace. at this pace you should be able to get rid of you pauses and incorporate efficiency. it should transfer on to your speed solves.
 
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What I meant by the M' at the end of 4a is this: lets say you have UB and UL edges mis-oriented. This is a simple 2-flip, which is M' U M' U2 M' U/U' and then edges are oriented, but centers are mis-aligned. At this stage in my progression, I know how to orient UB and UL edges quickly and it is in my muscle-memory, but after M' U M' U2 M' U/U' , I end up doing an M', but then for 4b, I do an M2 to get LR edges to the bottom layer, which could have been avoided by doing an M instead of an M'. Remember that this is just an example of the type of move cancelling I need to work on. Overall, thanks for the advice. Talking about alex lau, anyone know how he does 4a and 4b at the same time? Or his recognition method for 4c? In most of his videos he just says his recognition is weird.
 

GuRoux

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What I meant by the M' at the end of 4a is this: lets say you have UB and UL edges mis-oriented. This is a simple 2-flip, which is M' U M' U2 M' U/U' and then edges are oriented, but centers are mis-aligned. At this stage in my progression, I know how to orient UB and UL edges quickly and it is in my muscle-memory, but after M' U M' U2 M' U/U' , I end up doing an M', but then for 4b, I do an M2 to get LR edges to the bottom layer, which could have been avoided by doing an M instead of an M'. Remember that this is just an example of the type of move cancelling I need to work on. Overall, thanks for the advice. Talking about alex lau, anyone know how he does 4a and 4b at the same time? Or his recognition method for 4c? In most of his videos he just says his recognition is weird.


I use his recognition method. I think he calls it the "because my recognition method." you just predict the what the BU sticker color will be before it actually gets there. i think 4a and 4b at the same time is just running through your head where the UL and UR pieces will be after you solve eo in different ways. yeah, now i know what you mean with the M' moves. i haven't even thought about this type of cancellation.
 

maps600

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1) if someone tells me how i will do it.
2) on chess.com blitz live is 1825 and corresspondence is 1875. My official uscf is 1688 but i haven't played in tournaments for a long time. Probably high 1800s because that's what i consistently perform.
3) carlsbad
4) thai and chinese

1) yeah ill flip it, just send it to me somehow
4) im chinese too :)
 

maps600

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What I meant by the M' at the end of 4a is this: lets say you have UB and UL edges mis-oriented. This is a simple 2-flip, which is M' U M' U2 M' U/U' and then edges are oriented, but centers are mis-aligned. At this stage in my progression, I know how to orient UB and UL edges quickly and it is in my muscle-memory, but after M' U M' U2 M' U/U' , I end up doing an M', but then for 4b, I do an M2 to get LR edges to the bottom layer, which could have been avoided by doing an M instead of an M'. Remember that this is just an example of the type of move cancelling I need to work on. Overall, thanks for the advice. Talking about alex lau, anyone know how he does 4a and 4b at the same time? Or his recognition method for 4c? In most of his videos he just says his recognition is weird.

He says he can usually do 4a and 4b intuitively every time from what ive heard.
 

JediJupiter

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When you're doing 4a, since it doesn't require much thought when you're used to it, why don't you track the UL and UR pieces? Say I had to do M U M', and the UL piece was in the UF location before applying moves and the UR piece was in UL before applying moves, I'd adjust it so that I'd do M U' so they were matched up, and M or M' depending on how the corners were then positioned. This is just an example, but I think being colour not-neutral-at-all helps with recognition.
Edit: might as well add in my 4c method too
Recognise the case before performing the U or U' of step 4b. I noticed that sometimes I'd finish off with a U, then do a U2 anyway, but I don't implement it in solves since hard to recognise, but it's a cool idea and you guys might like it.
Edit: actually I do use it in solves. I normally notice the U2 M2 U2 case and that's the only time I'd use it.
 
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tpt8899

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full (at least attempting)... Don't know if its going to work out. If it doesn't work out, x2 y will be it for me... Still got time to decide.
 
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Seems like y is good enough for me. Roux is a lot harder to be totally cn with because there are 24 different orientations, while with cfop there are only 6 because white cross counts as 1 because it doesn't matter what colour is in front. I tried to be x2 cn as well, but I mix up white and yellow anyway when I'm doing white on bottom. I might consider a white cube with black stickers to stop my problem...
 

JediJupiter

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Seems like y is good enough for me. Roux is a lot harder to be totally cn with because there are 24 different orientations, while with cfop there are only 6 because white cross counts as 1 because it doesn't matter what colour is in front. I tried to be x2 cn as well, but I mix up white and yellow anyway when I'm doing white on bottom. I might consider a white cube with black stickers to stop my problem...
I'm not CN at all, and really there are no cases which are seriously bad anyway. I think the advantages of having a good block are not as good as being able to look ahead further, and knowing exactly what you're looking for when you see the cube.
 

GuRoux

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Seems like y is good enough for me. Roux is a lot harder to be totally cn with because there are 24 different orientations, while with cfop there are only 6 because white cross counts as 1 because it doesn't matter what colour is in front. I tried to be x2 cn as well, but I mix up white and yellow anyway when I'm doing white on bottom. I might consider a white cube with black stickers to stop my problem...

i'm only doing y2. If you get an easy first block, try tracking RD edge so you will smoothly go into you second block.
 
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How often do other x2/y (or y2/x) people one look first block? I do about 60% of the time, and do it 100% of the time when I keep myself from freaking out with "only" 8 seconds of inspection left.
 

rybaby

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How often do other x2/y (or y2/x) people one look first block? I do about 60% of the time, and do it 100% of the time when I keep myself from freaking out with "only" 8 seconds of inspection left.

Almost 100% of the time, as long as the scramble isn't really bad. To practice this, just take as much inspection as you need.
 

rowan

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full (at least attempting)... Don't know if its going to work out. If it doesn't work out, x2 y will be it for me... Still got time to decide.

I'm full CN. There's one other full CN; he's a lot faster than me. I know most people won't believe full CN is "worth" it until someone is sub-10 or something, which is a terrible way to determine the viability of something, but if that's what you need to be shown that it's worthwhile, I can't help you there.

Personally, I think it works out just fine, I can't honestly imagine doing Roux any other way. Any claims that it "doesn't work" can't really be backed up; the suggestion that it harbors recognition are all based on anecdotal evidence and mean nothing as far as I'm concerned. However, the benefits I see in being fully color neutral are measurable. Even if CN did harm your recognition, I think this could be overcome with practice, unlike the move count limits that different color neutralities offer. There's only so much room for improvement in LSE and CMLL, it seems unfortunate to handicap your blocks in any way.
 
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if you're close don't give up, it's a lot harder to learn later. I'm planning to try to x2 y2, that seems easier to be than y to me.

I am basically y cn, but red first block is only a second slower. Does x2 make much of a difference time wise? Because the more time you spend deciding on your block, you could be planning out the block and maybe preserving RD edge.
 
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