Haiyan Zhuang banned for 1-3 years

[prostx23]

I'm still left wondering, what type of threats were these? I'm gonna beat you up? I'm gonna Murder you? I understand that some privacy needs to be kept to protect the innocent, but the info on "threats" made by Haiyan is very vague?

There are other possible threats too, like, "I'm going to make your life a living hell", or "I will ensure you'll never hold a competition again", etc. Not every threat is physical violence or a specific task defined.

Absolutely, you're entirely correct, the threats outlined in this thread and others have centered primarily on threats of violence though. Otherwise the information has been vague on what exactly Haiyan did to deserve a three year ban.

And, if this all comes down to Haiyan simply wanting an extra round of BLD, I assume this was known by the WCA for some time before things got out of hand, was there a reason why this could not possibly have been done or planned for ahead of time. If for no other reason than to give the squeaky wheel the oil.

You're suggesting the WCA require all Chinese competitions to hold a mandatory 2 rounds of BLD? I'm just restating it so you know how it sounds.

Not entirely...but possibly. I'm at a loss to believe some sort of compromise could not have been reached by both parties early on to prevent what we now have...perhaps the WCA even appeasing one cranky cuber just to keep the peace. Exactly how was this allowed to get so far out of hand that a cuber is banned for 3 years. Perhaps some (if even just a little) fault lies with the WCA. Unless, of course, that Haiyan is a complete wack-a-doo, and no amount of reasoning or compromise could have have made him happy...that's where I'm failing to under stand this.

Mike

 

[riffz]

Anyway, I wonder: does this decision do anything about Haiyan *himself*? If what everyone is saying against Haiyan is true, wouldn't a ban do nothing but prevent him from being at WCA competitions? A ban does not stop him from moderating mf8, harassing competition organizers or other cubers, influencing cube factories, etc. So I don't see how this fixes the situation; maybe it just makes it worse. I don't know.

The WCA has no control over mf8, cube factories, etc.

...

You're missing his point.

 

[Tyson]

Anyway, I wonder: does this decision do anything about Haiyan *himself*? If what everyone is saying against Haiyan is true, wouldn't a ban do nothing but prevent him from being at WCA competitions? A ban does not stop him from moderating mf8, harassing competition organizers or other cubers, influencing cube factories, etc. So I don't see how this fixes the situation; maybe it just makes it worse. I don't know.

The WCA has no control over mf8, cube factories, etc.

...

You're missing his point.

Well, what can the WCA do? The WCA is really just a figment in our collective imagination. There's nothing the WCA can do regarding mf8, or the harassment of organizers. But based on his behavior, he is no longer welcome at WCA events.

In terms of harassment of organizers and delegates, there is nothing the WCA can do. Really, it's up to local law enforcement at this point. So I don't think Bryan has missed the point. The simple reality is that the WCA can only do so much, and therefore, it only tries to do as much as it should. Hence, we won't even try to interfere with any of Haiyan's personal business, example: the CCA.

The only thing the WCA has control over is the WCA. All I can say is that if US Citizens are threatened abroad, I'd say at this point, it's time to go to the US Consulate and understand the local laws and regulations concerning things of this nature. But that's really the full extent of the statement... someone who behaves the way he does is no longer welcome at a WCA event, and we think everyone will benefit from his absence in WCA events at least for the near future.

If harassment continues, I can only urge whoever is affected to understand the local laws and the process of how these things are treated. This is in the same way that I can't force anyone to return prize money.

The WCA is really just a figment of the collective community's imagination. The records only have legitimacy because everyone gives it legitimacy.

 

[prostx23]

In terms of harassment of organizers and delegates, there is nothing the WCA can do. Really, it's up to local law enforcement at this point. So I don't think Bryan has missed the point. The simple reality is that the WCA can only do so much, and therefore, it only tries to do as much as it should. Hence, we won't even try to interfere with any of Haiyan's personal business, example: the CCA.

This is more or less what I was looking for. Since this was/is so bad that it rises to the level of needing the help of law enforcement, then the punishment seems just. I would assume that steps have/are being taken to try to prevent something like this from happening again?

Mike

 

[Lin@rt]

You, like many other people around at the moment, have completely failed to even bother to read up about this entire issue. There has been a plethora of information posted already revealing the history of this issue.

I urge everyone to stop making posts like "this is a bit harsh", or "he only made a small threat? This doesn't deserve a 1 year ban", because this is not a small issue, it has been recurrent for what appears to around 2 years.

It's getting really annoying.

Well, i read all the posts in this thread. There are many opinions as many people are. I think you fail to have just a little tolerance with others than think different . If it´s annoying just dont read anymore

 

[Cielo]

1. How exactly can he make WCA illegal in China?

2. And why would Chinese cubers want to compete in a league where only national records can be set?

1. Check my fb again

2. No person in China wants the facebook, youtube, twitter etc to be banned, but they have been banned for years

Can't see your fb, coz 2...

 

[penfold1992]

1 year is pretty harsh however unless he travels around a lot he wont likely miss much until he apologises...
it doesnt matter wether he thinks that he did wrong or not. he should apologise to those who feel threatened at least.

 

[Dene]

Please read more carefully. I've read this thread and every other thread related to this incident on this site from beginning to end, and most of the threads and links provided within these threads, so you'd be incorrect in stating I'm not well read on the subject. I've based my assertion (more of a question than an assertion really) based on that very limited information. If you have more specifics than what has been previously discussed I'd be happy to listen. I absolutely do not know all the facts (as most of the specifics are only known to those involved), merely that what has been written thus far portrays Haiyan as a bully, not necessarily a psychopath.

Mike

You said, and I quote "Without a bit more specificity, is this an overreaction, or over sensitivity to someone who s simply a bully? If Haiyan simply threatened to slap someone around but never followed through, and had no intention to. Isn't even 1 year a bit harsh of a punishment?", plus some more stuff. You make it clear that you think the only thing Haiyan has done is to possibly "threaten" someone. But this is only the tip of the iceberg. Did you even read this post?

 

[su466120534]

I wanna say: The punishment of Mr Zhuang has nothing to do with CCA,
he is not the creator of CCA..

 

[Sakarie]

I wanma say: The punishment of Mr Zhuang has nothing to do with CCA,
he is not the creator of CCA..

Please tell us more!

(And to everyone, please translate when quoting something in chinese.. Google translate ain't the best)

 

[prostx23]

Please read more carefully. I've read this thread and every other thread related to this incident on this site from beginning to end, and most of the threads and links provided within these threads, so you'd be incorrect in stating I'm not well read on the subject. I've based my assertion (more of a question than an assertion really) based on that very limited information. If you have more specifics than what has been previously discussed I'd be happy to listen. I absolutely do not know all the facts (as most of the specifics are only known to those involved), merely that what has been written thus far portrays Haiyan as a bully, not necessarily a psychopath.

Mike

You said, and I quote "Without a bit more specificity, is this an overreaction, or over sensitivity to someone who s simply a bully? If Haiyan simply threatened to slap someone around but never followed through, and had no intention to. Isn't even 1 year a bit harsh of a punishment?", plus some more stuff. You make it clear that you think the only thing Haiyan has done is to possibly "threaten" someone. But this is only the tip of the iceberg. Did you even read this post?

I'm reading this post for the second time, and beyond mentioning some threats of violence, this still is vague as to what specifically the threats were. This post you directed me to makes Haiyan sound like a bully or a jerk, but not necessarily someone who needs to be banned for 3 years. I still wonder if there wasn't more that could have been done by the WCA to chill this situation out before it got out of hand. It seems here that the fault lies primarily on Haiyans shoulders. He's clearly immature. But does the WCA not bear at least a little of the responsibility for letting this get to the point that one of their top flight cubers is now gone for three years and now we may see an entire country's cubers remove themselves from official competition, maybe permanently. That's f**cked up.

Mike

Edit: Just to be more clear on what I'm missing here, He doesn't get his extra round of blindfold at the comps, he throws a fit and disrupts the competitions. He makes some calls an lays a few threats of violence on some dudes... a smacck to the chops, a car bomb, a mafia style hit? What exactly is he saying here? And... so what...perhaps some folks instead of cowering in the corner when he's making those threats (not literally but it's sort of the impression that is left by the info given) should have, come to a compromise early on, or stood up to him in a like fashion. It seems to me that this shouldn't have gotten so far out of hand.

 

[deadalnix]

He was proposed to apologize and then, get no sanction. He refused. Then, later, he was proposed to apologize (again) to reduce the sentence from 3 years to 1 year.

If Haiyan wanted to be cooperative, he could end this without getting any penality. He choose the situation he is currently in.

Remeber that when saying this is harsh. This is 100% due to Haiyan choice that this ends up that way.

 

[prostx23]

He was proposed to apologize and then, get no sanction. He refused. Then, later, he was proposed to apologize (again) to reduce the sentence from 3 years to 1 year.

If Haiyan wanted to be cooperative, he could end this without getting any penality. He choose the situation he is currently in.

Remeber that when saying this is harsh. This is 100% due to Haiyan choice that this ends up that way.

You're right, but wasn't there a way to prevent this? There is another thread now discussing possible changes (only proposals of course) and I haven't checked in on it today but as of yesterday it was a reasonable frendly discussion. Was it not possible early on to have a similar discussion with Haiyan? Or was it simply a case of Haiyan saying "my way or else?" If so that's a shame.

Mike

 

[Howardw]

From what I've been seeing it seems that the some of the Chinese cubers are starting to feel like they're being controlled against their will by WCA.
Of course this was sparked by Hai Yan's banning.

quote:太好了..不用看外国人的脸色了..
说真的..我们中国那么多人才..
干嘛要受外国人控制啊..
会说普通话又怎样..?
"非我族类,其心必异"..
It means: We don't need WCA, we have a lot of support in China. Why do we let foreigners control us? And the one in quotations sort of means:
People from other countries have different intentions.

 

[nck]

From what I've been seeing it seems that the some of the Chinese cubers are starting to feel like they're being controlled against their will by WCA.
Of course this was sparked by Hai Yan's banning.

quote:太好了..不用看外国人的脸色了..
说真的..我们中国那么多人才..
干嘛要受外国人控制啊..
会说普通话又怎样..?
"非我族类,其心必异"..
It means: We don't need WCA, we have a lot of support in China. Why do we let foreigners control us? And the one in quotations sort of means:
People from other countries have different intentions.

You forgot this line.

I believe it's directly addressing keyan.

 

[Howardw]

From what I've been seeing it seems that the some of the Chinese cubers are starting to feel like they're being controlled against their will by WCA.
Of course this was sparked by Hai Yan's banning.

quote:太好了..不用看外国人的脸色了..
说真的..我们中国那么多人才..
干嘛要受外国人控制啊..
会说普通话又怎样..?
"非我族类,其心必异"..
It means: We don't need WCA, we have a lot of support in China. Why do we let foreigners control us? And the one in quotations sort of means:
People from other countries have different intentions.

You forgot this line.

I believe it's directly addressing keyan.

Keyan?

 

[r_517]

He was proposed to apologize and then, get no sanction. He refused. Then, later, he was proposed to apologize (again) to reduce the sentence from 3 years to 1 year.

If Haiyan wanted to be cooperative, he could end this without getting any penality. He choose the situation he is currently in.

Remeber that when saying this is harsh. This is 100% due to Haiyan choice that this ends up that way.

You're right, but wasn't there a way to prevent this? There is another thread now discussing possible changes (only proposals of course) and I haven't checked in on it today but as of yesterday it was a reasonable frendly discussion. Was it not possible early on to have a similar discussion with Haiyan? Or was it simply a case of Haiyan saying "my way or else?" If so that's a shame.

Mike

it has been almost two years since he asked for a second round and harassed other delegates to make him the delegate, like "if u don't add me a second round i'll cancel the sponsorship" or smash the cube onto the ground while others still BLD-ing or just what most of u had known that he grabbed the microphone and abuse the organiser and delegate publicly while others were still competing. however even then, these stuff still remained private coz the delegates wanted to talk with him. but he just refused, and continued his abusing by spreading fake evidence(some were shown in my fb) and rumors like "the delegate asked him for money", "we *all* hate some delegate. we *all* know that he corrupts" etc.

From what I've been seeing it seems that the some of the Chinese cubers are starting to feel like they're being controlled against their will by WCA.
Of course this was sparked by Hai Yan's banning.

quote:太好了..不用看外国人的脸色了..
说真的..我们中国那么多人才..
干嘛要受外国人控制啊..
会说普通话又怎样..?
"非我族类,其心必异"..
It means: We don't need WCA, we have a lot of support in China. Why do we let foreigners control us? And the one in quotations sort of means:
People from other countries have different intentions.

You forgot this line.

I believe it's directly addressing keyan.

Keyan?

the delegate Chris Krueger, whose Chinese name is Ke Yan.

 

[PatrickJameson]

Alright, this thread is doing nothing but starting rumors and speculation. Whether some are true or not we obviously don't know enough for sure to judge the actions of Haiyan and the WCA through this situation.

If you have any new information regarding this case you can email Tyson. His email can be found on this page: http://www.worldcubeassociation.org/node/12

If Tyson or anyone else directly involved has anything that will absolutely confirm or disprove all of the allegations put upon Haiyan they can post it here or on the WCA forum for us to eventually find.

For Haiyan, if you have anything to say or want something cleared up, email Tyson. Do not post it on this site. It will do nothing to help your cause.