[Help Thread] FMC Discussion

[Jaycee]

However, in your example, correct me if I'm wrong, I see only 6 cancellations at the insertion point : L [R D R'] + ([R D' R'] U2 R D R' U2) + F2 D' F'

I believe he meant : L U R' U [R U2 (L' L) R D R'] + [R D' R' U2 R] D R' U2 + F2 D' F'

So 9 moves cancelled not including the cancelling L and L'.

EDIT : Ninja'd >:O

 

[Pyjam]

OK. Thank you.

 

[spyr0th3dr4g0n]

Irish Open FMC Scramble:
L' B2 R' U2 L' F2 R D2 F2 L' U2 L' D' B R D' R U' B' R' D'

 

[irontwig]

Irish Open FMC Scramble:
L' B2 R' U2 L' F2 R D2 F2 L' U2 L' D' B R D' R U' B' R' D'

Quick attempt:

Spoiler

B R' U' R B' L2 B R B' L2 U F' U2 F2 L U L U' L2 U B' L' U' L U B L' F' (28)

B R' U' R2 B'.
U F' U2 F2 U
U' L U L U' L2 U
B' L' U' L U B L' F'

.=B R' B' L2 B R B' L2

 

[Ranzha]

I did this today:
U2 R' U' D' L' U L2 R' D L U' F U D' L D' F R F2 D' U F2 R' L2 F'


U2 D' B' R2 U' F2
B R2 D2
y x
R2 U2 R2 U' R' U R'
y R U R' U2 F' L' B' U' B L F
y z2 F2 M2' U L2' U' r2 U L2' U' R2' F2 (40)

Any suggestions? I liked the way I started =3

 

[Cubenovice]

fmc.mustcube 384

scramble F B U2 B2 U B' L2 B2 F2 R2 D' F' L' F' U' R' B2 L U' F2 D B2 F' R2 F2 D2 F2 B2 R' F2


My final submission for the no time limit:
U L . U' L2 makes square - U is an insertion (4)
D' F' R F' makes 2x2x3 (8)
B2 L' L' B' D' : B D L B' using basic FRUR'U'F' OLL to leave 5 corners (16)
at . insert F D F' U' F D' F' U to cancel 2 moves
at : insert U2 B' D' B U2 B' D B to cancel 1 move
16 moves to L5C deserves better insertions


But initailly I worked with this awesome start:

L U' L2 makes square (3)
D' F' R F' makes 2x2x3 (7)
switch to inverse:
B2 L' U' L' U makes F2L-1 with 3 oriented edges (12)

From here I was hoping for someting awesome to happen but...
L' D L2 D' L2 B' L B L' leaves 4C incl twist (21)
L2 D L' D' B' L2 B L2 leaves a 5-twist (20)
Found the exact same ones when returning to the original scramble
Some others include 21 HTM for 5C and 18 HTM for 5C of which 2 are twisted...
But I had hoped to find something better.

Can somebody find a better continuation for the 12 move F2L-1?

 

[Attila]

fmc.mustcube.net round 384.
Sorry, for my belated solution, i found this now:
Scramble: F B U2 B2 U B' L2 B2 F2 R2 D' F' L' F' U' R' B2 L U' F2 D B2 F' R2 F2 D2 F2 B2 R' F2
Solution: B2 D’ B F’ R2 B U2 B2 F2 U’ L’ R B F2 D2 B U’ B2 L F B’ U R’ F R (25 moves)
Explanation:
First time i found a 10-move solution for corners, with EG method:
B2 D F’ U R’ F2 U2 R’ F R.
Switch to inverse: R’ F’ R U2 F2 R U’ F D’ B2.
The last 2 moves (D’ B2) i used as premoves on inverse scramble:
R’ F’ R U’ S U’ f2 r u’,
same, without cube rotations,
R’ F’ R U’ B F’ L’ B2 U B’ all corners and 6 edges,
premoves change to D B2, then R’ F’ R U’ B F’ L’ B2 U B’,
D2 F2 B’ R’ L U F2 B2 U2 B’ R2 F B’ L6E.

 

[kinch2002]

Irish Open Scramble: L' B2 R' U2 L' F2 R D2 F2 L' U2 L' D' B R D' R U' B' R' D'

My solution (28 moves)
On Inverse scramble: U' B (2x2x1)
Normal (premoves B' U): R' U' (3x2x1, effectively 4 moves)
Inverse (premoves U R): U' B F R' D2 R' (2x2x3, effectively 8 moves)
F2L-1 and some EO: B L B D L2 D' L (15)
F2L, leaving 3 corners: B' L B2 L' B D' B2 D (23)
Insert an 8 move comm somewhere to cancel 3 moves (there were 2 places)

 

[irontwig]

Heh, that 28 mover was a lot more work than the one I posted to the same scramble earlier.

 

[kinch2002]

Heh, that 28 mover was a lot more work than the one I posted to the same scramble earlier.

Lol yes. I didn't see the 5 move start at all. I spent a few seconds thinking and could only see 7 moves so looked at the inverse instead.

 

[AJ Blair]

fmc.mustcube Round 385 Solution

Spoiler

Scramble: U R2 L' F B' R2 U B2 F' U' D' F U2 B R2 B2 F L R' D R U' F D' B' R2 B U F U

D L F L' F2 (2x2x2)
L D2 L2 D (2x2x3)
B' U' L2 U B' L (F2L-1)
B' L' B2 L B' L' B L (F2L)
d' B' D B' D' B2 U R (Extremely Lucky LL)

Lucked out with the PLL skip...I tried to do some more complex stuff...like finishing edges and leaving comms for the corners, and several different insertions for the last pair of F2L...I'm happy with this whether or not it was really lucky!

 

[mycube]

I found a great start at this scramble:
(current comp)

Spoiler

U' L' F' D B' R' D R F2 U' L2 F2 U2 B2 U2 R' F2 R' U2 R U2 (the scramble from this weekly competition)

start: R´ F´ R L U B´ L2 F2 U´ R´ F U

but then i don´t know what´s the best way to use all the blocks.
can someone help me?

this is my idea:
L D2 L´
U F2 U´ F2 U F2 U´
D R D´ F´ R F R2

i just need to find a commutator and it would be a 37 move solution. is there a shorter solution?

 

[Rpotts]

I found a great start at this scramble:
U' L' F' D B' R' D R F2 U' L2 F2 U2 B2 U2 R' F2 R' U2 R U2 (the scramble from this weekly competition)

Please use spoiler tags whenever you are discussing a currently active competition.

Although your continuation after the 2x2 is pretty cool, the 2x2 itself is much too long. Aim for about 5 moves for a 2x2 block such as this --

Spoiler

F L B' D' L2

 

[Pyjam]

Last week mustcube problem (386).
Nice start but I could not find a really good insertion. Can you help me?

Scramble = D2 F R F' U2 R D' B L2 U' D R' U' L2 D2 F2 L' R2 B2 U L2 U2 D' L' R2 F' U' L F2 B'

Premoves = (B2 R F' R2) : (4)
L' B2 L' D2 R : (9) 2x2x3 block
U2 B2 U2 B L' B L : (16) F2L
L @ U F U' F' L' U' : (22) OLL, all but 3 corners

At @ insert (L B2 L' F2 L B2 L' F2) = 1 move cancelled only.

 

[Erik]

24 and 26 at Altbier 2012

This weekend during FMC at Altbier 2012 I managed to do 2 sub-30's in a row: a 24 and a 26. Hope you find the solutions interesting and maybe can help me find ways to improve them even more!

Attempt 1: 24 moves

Scramble: U2 R2 B2 R2 B2 D' R2 D L2 D2 R B U B' U B R' U
Inverse scramble: U' R B' U' B U' B' R' D2 L2 D' R2 D B2 R2 B2 R2 U2

I used the inverse scramble:

F2 U B2 L2 D2 for a 5 move block

F2 U B2 F L2 D2 for the block including another 1x2x2 -> premove B to get 3x3x2

B' to finish the block
U R' U R2 U R' F R F' leaves 3 corners (ok a bit lucky maybe)
R' F2 R' B' R F2 R' B to solve the rest

Full solution (for the inverse scramble):

F2 U B2 F L2 D2 B' U R' U R2 U R' F R F' * R' F2 R' B' R F2 R' B2 (24 moves)

* if you do R2 B here you leave 3 corners. Insertion anyone?

@ Moderators, I created 2 threads. For each thread 1 so I can add notes to come.

 

[Erik]

The 2nd attempt: 26 moves

This one started MUCH more exciting than the 24, it's at least as interesting!

Scramble: F2 L D2 R2 F2 D2 U2 R' D2 R' D2 F' L' D' L2 R' D U B' L'
Inverse: L B U' D' R L2 D L F D2 R D2 R U2 D2 F2 R2 D2 L' F2

I used the normal scramble, but for some interesting stuff you also need the inverse.

Premove: F2

D L (3 moves for a 2x2x2 block ), lots of interesting blocks here! I found this to continue:
F' B' U' F B' U' which is 9 moves (including premove) for a triple X-cross including EO!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Here I puzzled a long time to get something decent to finish, the nasty thing is that after: B2 R' B R you are left with 4 flipped corners....
This is the finish I found:

B R' B' R B R' B' R B2 R' B' R B R' B R B2 and premove: F2

Full solution
D L F' B' U' F B' U' B R' B' R B R' B' R B2 R' B' R B R' B R B2 F2 (26 moves)

Stupidly I didn't try it on the inverse scramble:
Premoves: U B F' U B F L' D'

F2 R' B' R results in a 13 move F2L, but again... those nasty 4 flipped corners

 

[Cubenovice]

This weekend during FMC at Altbier 2012 I managed to do 2 sub-30's in a row: a 24 and a 26. Hope you find the solutions interesting and maybe can help me find ways to improve them even more!

Attempt 1: 24 moves
Full solution (for the inverse scramble):

F2 U B2 F L2 D2 B' U R' U R2 U R' F R F' * R' F2 R' B' R F2 R' B2 (24 moves)
* if you do R2 B here you leave 3 corners. Insertion anyone?

Congratulations! Very neat stuff.
Unless I missed something there are no insertions to improve your result...

F2 U B2 F L2 D2 . B' U R' U R2 U R' F R F' R2 : B 18 HTM leaving 3 corners
The best I found:
At . insert L' B' R B L B' R' B to cancel 2 moves = 24 HTM
or
At : insert R F2 R' B' R F2 R' B to cancel 2 moves = 24 HTM

EDIT: nice scramble, some other neat stuff although not as good as Erik's

premoves F D2
F2 U B2 F L2 F' - makes 2x2x3
L U L' - makes two squares
U2 L' - place squares
U B' U' B - leaves 4 corners of which one is twisted at 17 HTM

premoves F D2
F2 U B2 F L2 F' - makes 2x2x3
L U L' - makes two squares
U' L' U' L - create last pair
U2 L' B' U2 B U2 - insert last pair leaves 4 edges at 21 HTM (something for Guus or Atilla?)

Happy about the way I noticed the D2 premove, I found it after F2 U when checking Erik's solution for insertions (so before doing the B2 that actually completes the block)

 

[guusrs]

This weekend during FMC at Altbier 2012 I managed to do 2 sub-30's in a row: a 24 and a 26. Hope you find the solutions interesting and maybe can help me find ways to improve them even more!

Woooow, amazing Erik, and congratz with that NR.

I didn't have a look at the scrambles & your solutions yet but I certainly will.

Now we have a real challenge at Twente Open .

Guus

 

[mycube]

The last weeks I did a lot of FMC and learned stuff like Insertions and NISS. Here are some of the better results:

30 Movesolution

Spoiler

scramble: F2 R2 D2 U´ B2 R2 U2 B2 L2 D F´ L´ U´ R B U´ F U´ L´ B´ D

R´ F´ D B2 L´ U [6/6] – 2x2x2 + Pair
R´ D B´ D´ B´ [5/11] - DXC
R´ D2 R D B D B´ [7/18] – Pair
D F D´ F´ D2 F D F´ R´ D R D´ [12/30] - EO + LL-Skip

Solution: R´ F´ D B2 L´ U R´ D B´ D´ B´ R´ D2 R D B D B´ D F D´ F´ D2 F D F´ R´ D R D´ - 30 moves

30 Movesolution - 2

Spoiler

Scramble: F2 L2 D2 B U2 L2 B R2 F´ D2 B2 L2 U´ L R´ U´ B2 D U´ R U´ F´
Inverse Scramble: F U R´ U D´ B2 U R L´ U L2 B2 D2 F R2 B´ L2 U2 B´ D2 L2 F2

Start on normal:
D L2 D2 L F´ D F L2 D – 2x2x2 [9/9]
. F L U´ L2 – 2x2x2 + 1x2x3 [4/13]
Switch
U2 L U´ F U – EO/F2L-3 [5-1/17]
Switch
D´ L2 D L2 D´ L2 D U – finish except 3-corner-cycle [8-1/24]

. = U F D2 F´ U´ F D2 F´ (2 Move Cancellation) [8-2/30]

Solution: D L2 D2 L F´ D F L2 D U F D2 F´ U´ F D2 L U´ L2 D´ L2 D L2 D´ L2 D F´ U L´ U2 – 30 Moves

32 Movesolution - the current weekly competition-scramble!

Spoiler

scramble: D' F' D R2 F B' R' D2 L' B2 D L2 U2 F2 L2 F2 D' B2 D B2
inverse scramble: B2 D´ B2 D F2 L2 F2 U2 L2 D´ B2 L D2 R B F´ R2 D´ F D

start on normal:
L´ . B2 L´ U L U2 D B´ D2 – pseudo-2x2x3 [9/9]
switch to inverse:
F´ D2 F B´ L´ B´ - 2x2x2 + 1x2x2 [6/15]
switch to normal:
B´ L2 B D L´ D´ - EO [6/21]
switch to inverse:
L´ B´ L´ B - fertig [4/25]

insert at . = L´ U´ R U L U´ R´ U [8-1/32]

inverse Solution: F´ D2 F B´ L´ B´ L´ B´ L´ B D L D´ B´ L2 B D2 B D´ U2 L´ U´ L B2 U R U´ L´ U R´ U´ L2
Solution: L2 U R U´ L U R´ U´ B2 L´ U L U2 D B´ D2 B´ L2 B D L´ D´ B´ L B L B L B F´ D2 F – 32 moves

33 Movesolution

Spoiler

Scramble: D2 B2 U´ R2 U´ R2 D B2 U´ B L´ F D´ B2 R B L B´ L´
inverse Scramble: L B L´ B´ R´ B2 D F´ L B´ U B2 D´ R2 U R2 U B2 D2

inv: L D B D B2 (1x2x3 + 2 Paare)
R´ D2 L´ U L´ D2 (pseudo-2x2x3)
U´ R´ U R´ U (after the switch to the normal scramble a 2x2x3 + 2 pairs)
normal:
U F´ . U´ F – EO + 2 Pairs
R´ F R F´ U´ R U R – finish except 3-corner-cycle

. F D´ F´ U2 F D F´ U2 (Insertion with 3 Move-Cancelation)

Solution: U D´ F´ U2 F D F´ U F R´ F R F´ U´ R U R U´ R U´ R U D2 L U´ L D2 R B2 D´ B´ D´ L´ - 33 Moves

another start of a nice solution for this scramble:

Spoiler

on inverse:
L D B D B2
R U R U´
D2 L´ U L´ D2 U R2 U
but I was not able so find a good end.

35 Movesolution

Spoiler

Scramble: U´ L´ F´ D B´ R´ D R F2 U´ L2 F2 U2 B2 U2 R´ F2 R´ U2 R U2

R´ F´ R L U B´ L2 F2 U´ R´ F . U (pseudo 2x2x3 + 3 pairs) [12/12]
L D2 L´ (2x2x3 + 3 pairs) [3/15]
U F2 U´ F2 U F2 U´ (F2L-Pair3 + 1x2x2) [7/22]
D R D´ F´ R F R2 (EO + finish except 3-corner-cylce) [7/29]

. = F´ D B2 D´ F D B2 D´ [8-2/35] (2 move cancellation)

Solution: R´ F´ R L U B´ L2 F2 U´ R´ D B2 D´ F D B2 D´ U L D2 L´ U F2 U´ F2 U F2 U´ D R D´ F´ R F R2 – 35 Moves

35 Movesolution - 2

Spoiler

Scramble: B2 L2 D2 L2 U F2 U B2 F2 R2 F2 L´ R´ D F D B´ D´ L´ B´ D´
inverse Scramble: D B L D B D´ F´ D´ R L F2 R2 F2 B2 U´ F2 U´ L2 D2 L2 B2

on inverse:
. R B F U B L2 U´ B2 L - 2x2x2 [9/9]
R U´ R2 F U2 F´ - 2x2x3 [6/15]
R2 U´ F R´ F2 U2 F – 2x2x3 + 2 Pairs/EO [7/22]
R U R´ U R U´ R´ - Fertig bis 3-corner-cyle [7/29]

. = U R D R´ U´ R D´ R´ (2 Move Cancellation) [8-2/35]

inverse Solution: U R D R´ U´ R D´ B F U B L2 U´ B2 L R U´ R2 F U2 F´ R2 U´ F R´ F2 U2 F R U R´ U R U´ R´
Solution: R U R´ U´ R U´ R´ F´ U2 F2 R F´ U R2 F U2 F´ R2 U R´ L´ B2 U L2 B´ U´ F´ B´ D R´ U R D´ R´ U´ - 35 Moves

I know my 2x2x2s are to long.. Do you have some other tipps?

 

[Cubenovice]

Twente Open 2012, Three rounds of FMC

Congratulations Guus and Okayama with your 25 and 26 (official) PB solutions!
It was nice meeting and competing with you.

My FMC scores:
1 38 HTM first official non-DNF on a crappy solve
2 30 HTM Getting me joined 3rd place there were actually 5 people with 30 moves
3 DNF couldn't find anything decent


Scrambles
FMC-1: D L2 D' R2 B2 D' U' B2 L' F' R D' U' F2 U B F' L2 B2 U2
FMC-2: U' B2 U' L2 F2 D2 F2 R D2 U' R2 B L' D2 F' L2 D R' F2
FMC-3: B2 F D2 F R2 F' D L B2 D2 F' U2 R F2 L' R D B R


FMC-1: 38 HTM

Spoiler

Scramble: D L2 D' R2 B2 D' U' B2 L' F' R D' U' F2 U B F' L2 B2 U2

on inverse with premove F2
L' F' D L D' // 2x2x2
F L U L' // X-cross
F' R' F' R2 U2 R' U F U // pseudo F2L-1 finds premove F2
D F L F' L' D' // OLL leaves 4 corners (not great but thought to make it a safety solve)
invert to normal solution: F2 D L F L' F' D' U' F' U' R U2 R2 F R . F L U' L' F' D L' D' F L
at . insert R B' R' F R B R' F' to cancel 3 moves
at end add B' D' B U2 B' D B U2 to solve remaining corners

final solution 38 HTM:
F2 D L F L' F' D' U' F' U' R U2 R2 F R2 B' R' F R B R' L U' L' F' D L' D' F L B' D' B U2 B' D B U2

Competition nerves totally screwed my corner cycle recognition giving me more nerves, slowing me down etc etc
I should still look for possible insertions of the last cycle

FMC-2: 30 HTM

Spoiler

scramble: U' B2 U' L2 F2 D2 F2 R D2 U' R2 B L' D2 F' L2 D R' F2


R' B2 U2 // pseudo 2x2x2 premove F

switch to inverse with premoves U2 B2 R
F' F2 B' R U' F R' F // 2x2x3

switch to normal with premoves F' R F' U R' F' B
R' B2 U2 // 2x2x3
R' B R D B' D2 B // F2L-1
L' D2 L D' B D' B' D' // leaves 3 corners
D' B' D F D' B D F' // corner cycle cancels 2 moves with last move and undoing of premoves
F' R . F' U R' F' B // undo premoves
for 31 HTM

I wrote this down on the score sheet, double checked what I had written there.
Then solved without the corner cycle, stickered the three corners and checked from the end for a betetr insertion.
(I typically check from the start but I was very short on time)
Just in time I found R' F' R B2 R' F R B2 at . to cancel 3 moves for final solution:

normal with premoves F' R F' U R' F' B
R' B2 U2 // 2x2x3
R' B R D B' D2 B // F2L-1
L' D2 L D' B D' B' D' // leaves 3 corners
F' R . F' U R' F' B // undo premoves
at . insert R' F' R B2 R' F R B2 to cancel 3 moves

Final solution 30 HTM:
R' B2 U2 R' B R D B' D2 B L' D2 L D' B D' B' D' F2 R B2 R' F R B2 F' U R' F' B

Wrote the new ending on the score sheet below the old one, checked it twice and only then crossed out the old ending in the very last minute

Afterwards I checked the full skeleton and there was no better insertion.
Sebastien showed a straightforward continuation of my 2x2x3 into 3-twist with 2-flip (one of very few LL-algsI know) for a 29HTM finish...

FMC-3: DNF

Spoiler

you wish