[Help Thread] FMC Discussion

[Mollerz]

Are you saying you go through your skeleton multiple times first looking for 123 then a second time looking for 234 etc. Is this just to make it easier to see good insertions? Do other people do it this way as well? When I go through a skeleton I look for all of them at the same time, I'll admit it does get a little confusing at times and I have occasionally miss some good cancelations but your way seems rather time consuming, assuming I'm understanding it right.

Yeah I went through multiple times. This way I'm only looking for one insertion and I don't have to keep looking for different corners every single time. Say for example I get to my 5th move and all 123 corners are on the same face and there's no good insertion, if I then do a move and they stay on all the same face, or I do a move which affects none of them, I already know the insertion so I can see if there are any cancellations.

 

[kinch2002]

Yeah I went through multiple times. This way I'm only looking for one insertion and I don't have to keep looking for different corners every single time. Say for example I get to my 5th move and all 123 corners are on the same face and there's no good insertion, if I then do a move and they stay on all the same face, or I do a move which affects none of them, I already know the insertion so I can see if there are any cancellations.

Yes, being able to look trace the pair faster is a nice advantage, but you have to do 6 passes (5 possible first insertions, then the 2nd insertion). Do you just take the best first insertion and hope for luck with the second one?

I still think 1-pass is faster, and it gives you the chance to find the best combo of cancellations.

 

[Mollerz]

Yes, being able to look trace the pair faster is a nice advantage, but you have to do 6 passes (5 possible first insertions, then the 2nd insertion). Do you just take the best first insertion and hope for luck with the second one?

I still think 1-pass is faster, and it gives you the chance to find the best combo of cancellations.

I tried 1 pass and was completely overwhelmed by insertions.

 

[TeddyKGB]

I tried 1 pass and was completely overwhelmed by insertions.

That is how I feel a lot of the time, which is why I was somewhat intrigued by the way you do it. I never even thought about doing it that way. It just seems like it would take way too much time to be worth it.

 

[coldsun0630]

I still think 1-pass is faster, and it gives you the chance to find the best combo of cancellations.

Excuse me, but what does '1-pass' stands for?

 

[kinch2002]

Excuse me, but what does '1-pass' stands for?

When you do insertions, you work your way through the skeleton, looking for a good place to insert a commutator. A 'Pass' means that you work through the skeleton once, from beginning to end. That means that a single insertion (most common would be 3 corners) will take 1 pass. However, a double insertion such as for 4 or 5 corners, has many possibilities for stickers to cycle in each insertion.

The obvious way to insert 5 corners would be to do 6 passes: A pass for each of the sticker cycles 123/234/345/451/512 to find the best first insertion, and then a final 6th pass for the second insertion.

However, when I say that I prefer 1-pass, it means that I check all possibilities for the 2 insertions while working through the skeleton just once. Then I look back and pick the the best combo of insertions.

 

[mycube]

When you do insertions, you work your way through the skeleton, looking for a good place to insert a commutator. A 'Pass' means that you work through the skeleton once, from beginning to end. That means that a single insertion (most common would be 3 corners) will take 1 pass. However, a double insertion such as for 4 or 5 corners, has many possibilities for stickers to cycle in each insertion.

The obvious way to insert 5 corners would be to do 6 passes: A pass for each of the sticker cycles 123/234/345/451/512 to find the best first insertion, and then a final 6th pass for the second insertion.

However, when I say that I prefer 1-pass, it means that I check all possibilities for the 2 insertions while working through the skeleton just once. Then I look back and pick the the best combo of insertions.

Lol, I never thought about just doing 1-pass and take the best combo of insertions. I always did 2-pass for 4 or 5 insertions. In the first I search the best possible Insertion and in the second pass I search for the best insertion for the last 3 corners.

 

[kinch2002]

Lol, I never thought about just doing 1-pass and take the best combo of insertions. I always did 2-pass for 4 or 5 insertions. In the first I search the best possible Insertion and in the second pass I search for the best insertion for the last 3 corners.

There is one disadvantage - you miss the possible cases where one commutator overlaps with another. However, I think that the advantage of knowing the cancellations of your 2nd insertion will outweigh that disadvantage.

 

[coldsun0630]

When you do insertions, you work your way through the skeleton, looking for a good place to insert a commutator. A 'Pass' means that you work through the skeleton once, from beginning to end. That means that a single insertion (most common would be 3 corners) will take 1 pass. However, a double insertion such as for 4 or 5 corners, has many possibilities for stickers to cycle in each insertion.

The obvious way to insert 5 corners would be to do 6 passes: A pass for each of the sticker cycles 123/234/345/451/512 to find the best first insertion, and then a final 6th pass for the second insertion.

However, when I say that I prefer 1-pass, it means that I check all possibilities for the 2 insertions while working through the skeleton just once. Then I look back and pick the the best combo of insertions.

Ah-ha! Now I've understood. Could I ask you one more question?

I usually do 3-corner insertion with this method. But, when 4(or 5)corners or 3 edges left, I can't use that method. So, I use two cubes which one is from original scramble, and the other is from inverse-skeleton(which corners are solved).

So the question is, how do you insert 4~5 corners or 3(or even more) edges?

 

[Dall]

Last weekend at a competition I participated at FMC. Normally, I do solves around 40 moves so I didn't expect anything special.

At second round I got the luckiest solve I could get. I got the solve and saw an easy cross + easy pair, so I decided to give it a try with CFOP. Result with first try was 25 moves and tied NR.

I'll post the solve like I wrote it down, cross on B.

Scramble: F D R' L' F' L' F2 R2 L' D' R2 L2 F2 U2 D2 R2 D2 F U2 R2

Solve:
Cross: F' L D' L B
1st pair: F' D' F D
2nd pair: D F' D' L' F2 L
3rd pair: L F' L'
4th pair: F U F U'
OLL: U F U' F' U' R U R'

With move cancellations, total move count HTM = 25 moves.

This has got to be the luckiest solve I'll ever get

 

[TDM]

Scramble: F D R' L' F' L' F2 R2 L' D' R2 L2 F2 U2 D2 R2 D2 F U2 R2

Solve:
Cross: F' L D' L B
1st pair: F' D' F D
2nd pair: D F' D' L' F2 L
3rd pair: L F' L'
4th pair: F U F U'
OLL: U F U' F' U' R U R'

Wow, that was very lucky. Anyone want to time a speedsolve of this? And then again after practise?

 

[dbax0999]

Made some major updates to my weekly FMC site at http://www.ocf.berkeley.edu/~dadams/fmc/. Scrambles will be automatically posted at the midnight between Saturdays and Sundays.

 

[antoineccantin]

Wow, that was very lucky. Anyone want to time a speedsolve of this? And then again after practise?

The best I got was 3.42. The high number of rotations is what makes it hard to do really fast.

 

[irontwig]

Made some major updates to my weekly FMC site at http://www.ocf.berkeley.edu/~dadams/fmc/. Scrambles will be automatically posted at the midnight between Saturdays and Sundays.

http://www.ocf.berkeley.edu/~dadams/fmc/12/

wtf?

 

[dbax0999]

http://www.ocf.berkeley.edu/~dadams/fmc/12/

wtf?

I took your solution from this thread as an example of how a commented solution would like. I credited you, but I can take it down if you'd like.

 

[Sebastien]

There is one disadvantage - you miss the possible cases where one commutator overlaps with another. However, I think that the advantage of knowing the cancellations of your 2nd insertion will outweigh that disadvantage.

I don't see a reason to not combine both.

With 5 corners, I usually write down all insertions cancelling 2 moves or more together with labels as "234". I can see nice combinations then, but I usually do a second pass for the most promising first insertion(s), which takes only 1-2 minutes after all. Often, there are one or two really good cancelations and the other are clearly inferior, so it's worth to try in my opinion.

However, do you also do 1-pass for 4 corners? I can see this working without a twist in there but else not really.

What about 6/7 corners?

 

[porkynator]

Made some major updates to my weekly FMC site at http://www.ocf.berkeley.edu/~dadams/fmc/. Scrambles will be automatically posted at the midnight between Saturdays and Sundays.

I found a nice solution for this week's scramble (F2 B L F' B2 L U' F L' D2 U F' L' R2 B F' R' B R2 U'):

Spoiler

Everything on inverse
At first I found this skeleton
U //square
L' B' U //square
B2 R D' //square
B' L' B //inner square
F R2 B U2 R2 F R F' //match squares and EO
U2 F' U F U //All but 3 corners

Leaving a single corner comm insertion in 23; not bad, but I wasn't completely satisfied. After playing around a bit with blocks I found this

On inverse

U //2x2x1 (1/1)
L' B R D' //2x2x1 (4/5)
F' R' B R B' //2x2x1 (5/10)
D2 F2 R' B R2 //F2L-1 (5/15)
U F' U F U' F' U' F U' //Finish (9/24)

 

[vcuber13]

My practice attempt for this weekend.

D2 L F2 L' R2 F2 D2 R2 F2 U2 R' D L' U2 L B' R2 U' R' F'

Pre D
D’ R’ U2 D2 F’ D’ F // 2x2x2
U’ R’ B2 R U B’ D’ R D // F2L
U’ B’ D B’ D’ B2 U’ // COLL
B2 R U’ D B2 U D’ R B2 R’ // EPLL

 

[irontwig]

My practice attempt for this weekend.

D2 L F2 L' R2 F2 D2 R2 F2 U2 R' D L' U2 L B' R2 U' R' F'

Pre D
D’ R’ U2 D2 F’ D’ F // 2x2x2
U’ R’ B2 R U B’ D’ R D // F2L
U’ B’ D B’ D’ B2 U’ // COLL
B2 R U’ D B2 U D’ R B2 R’ // EPLL

Here's a better way to solve that LL:

D B R B' R' D'
D R D B' D' B R' D' R'

 

[vcuber13]

How did you find that?