[Help Thread] Colour Neutral Discussion and Help

[IAmAPerson]

Just started learning CN yesterday. I'm now solving fully CN with an average only ~4 seconds more than my yellow-cross solves. Am I doing okay? (Former averaging: 23-24; Current averaging: 27-28)

Hardest part of CN solves for me is simply finding the pieces for my F2L pairing. Cross and LL are no problems.

 

[Praetorian]

CFOP color neutrality wasn't an issue for me, when I first started I didn't think being color neutral was anything special I always did the easiest cross that was in each scramble

now ZZ color neutral is ..quite hard and I don't think it might even be worth it, are there any ZZ color neutral solvers?

 

[MarcelP]

Just started learning CN yesterday. I'm now solving fully CN with an average only ~4 seconds more than my yellow-cross solves. Am I doing okay? (Former averaging: 23-24; Current averaging: 27-28)

Hardest part of CN solves for me is simply finding the pieces for my F2L pairing. Cross and LL are no problems.

I think you are doing just fine. Or better than fine. I switched when I averaged 30 secs. It took 3 months to get my 30 secs average CN. Today I am at 20 secs average full CN. Finding the F2L is the hardest part and you just have to hang in there. Keep it up, you will benefit from CN in the end.

 

[TDM]

now ZZ color neutral is ..quite hard and I don't think it might even be worth it, are there any ZZ color neutral solvers?

There are only three orientations to inspect, so I don't think it would be very hard at all. Doing two is easy, and if you're CN with CFOP then the third would be easy too. But... I'm not, so although I can do EOLine easily enough my F2L is very slow.

I might try switching to CN with CFOP (probably unsuccessfully ) and then trying ZZ again.

 

[cashis]

There are only three orientations to inspect, so I don't think it would be very hard at all. Doing two is easy, and if you're CN with CFOP then the third would be easy too. But... I'm not, so although I can do EOLine easily enough my F2L is very slow.

I might try switching to CN with CFOP (probably unsuccessfully ) and then trying ZZ again.

Good luck! Its well worth it.

 

[MarcelP]

I might try switching to CN with CFOP (probably unsuccessfully)

Come on Louis, that is a walk in tha park for you.. It is not a matter of trying, but a matter of just doing. Don't mind the bad times at first.

 

[NeilH]

It is not a matter of trying, but a matter of just doing.

This is gr8.

 

[TDM]

Good luck! Its well worth it.

Thanks!

Come on Louis, that is a walk in tha park for you.. It is not a matter of trying, but a matter of just doing. Don't mind the bad times at first.

It won't be I've not done anything like this before. I found yellow cross/blocks were hard enough. This is definitely harder. I'm going to try though!

 

[supercavitation]

Baseline before possible transition to Full CN from Black/Yellow Dual neutral (might go back to ZZ instead):

Pink/Orange Avg12: 23.31
21.20, 20.19, 19.00, 24.73, 29.45, (17.44), 19.70, 29.35, (30.28), 21.21, 24.11, 24.20

Blue/Green Avg12: 21.03
(24.41), 19.14 (PLL skip), 20.29, 20.11, 21.87, 22.93, 21.14, 18.24, 18.94, (16.35), 23.69, 23.91

Blue/Green/Pink/Orange Avg12: 21.12
21.22, 18.92, 24.12, (17.93), 22.11, (24.56), 20.41, 20.73, 21.60, 19.67, 22.66, 19.78

Full CN Avg12 (unlimited inspection so I don't just use Black or Yellow half the time): 20.25 (Very lucky, though)
15.99, 20.00, 21.92, 18.55, 20.76, (25.09), 19.85, 22.11, 20.31, 22.01, 21.02, (15.78)

Black/Yellow Baseline Avg12: 19.79 (That was awful for me, I'm usually about 18.5)
18.61, (17.87), 19.58, 18.46, 21.52, 19.22, 19.68, 18.00, 22.58, 22.07, (23.09), 18.22

I also felt like I had no idea what I was doing for the CN solves, though on the bright side, going back to dual neutral felt really limiting.

 

[IAmAPerson]

Okay, it's been about 2 months since I started learning Color Neutrality, and I officially consider myself fully color neutral! Here's something that I found kinda cool.

So I originally started solving cubes with white exclusively. Then (I dunno why), I switched over to yellow exclusively. That's where I got my 23.XX second average at Peach State 2015. During the switch to CN, the two hardest sides for me were orange and green. Guess what? I was doing an average of 5 with every color today (Ao5 with white, Ao5 with blue, etc.) and my best time was about 15.79 seconds. Guess which side it was on? Green. A full-step solve coming close to my PB on one of my previously worst sides, being >5 seconds lower than my average. Video is here:

 

[IAmAPerson]

One day later, set a PB of <13.8 seconds. Red cross. I LOVE CN. BEST IDEA.

 

[Smiles]

I'm so happy for you haha because I also did CN transition a few years ago.

People who argue about CN seem to forget that learning anything new can get a cuber excited about cubing and can cause major improvements. That's why I personally think CN transition can be a great thing and I'm sure you'd agree!

 

[cmhardw]

4.5 years in I am finally starting to get sub-14 averages of 5 more and more often, and I feel like I am near the point where I may break my pb average of 12 in the next few weeks or so? For the first time since switching to color neutral, I feel like I have my old pb average of 12 in my sights!

I also got a 9.51 single, which is my first non-white/yellow sub-10!

Color neutral is amazing, but I definitely wish I had switched sooner.

Here is a great color neutral average for me from today, which includes the sub-10 single. Yay!

 

[IAmAPerson]

Sub-20 global averaging CN! That officially means that I am definitely faster CN than I am yellow-cross exclusive. When I started my transition, I averaged 22 or so.

Hello, sub-20 club! Next goal: sub-15.

 

[obelisk477]

4.5 years in I am finally starting to get sub-14 averages of 5 more and more often, and I feel like I am near the point where I may break my pb average of 12 in the next few weeks or so? For the first time since switching to color neutral, I feel like I have my old pb average of 12 in my sights!

I also got a 9.51 single, which is my first non-white/yellow sub-10!

Color neutral is amazing, but I definitely wish I had switched sooner.

Here is a great color neutral average for me from today, which includes the sub-10 single. Yay!

http://i62.tinypic.com/35jgztu.jpg

how do you feel like your movecounts are comparing to your old movecounts?

 

[pyr14]

i went from white > white/yellow > white/yellow/blue > white/yellow/blue/green > CN > white/yellow > CN.

so when i went CN first time, i trolled with it a bit and finally got to white/yellow averages as well. then i switched back to white/yellow for trolls, realising i could actually sub 20 white/yellow, then i suck at 3x3 again so i just switched to CN.

 

[cmhardw]

how do you feel like your movecounts are comparing to your old movecounts?

According to Lars Vandenbergh I save 0.58 turns on average for my cross switching from opposite color neutral to color neutral. I have switched to some longer, no rotation F2L algs to replace my older more move optimal but with rotation algs. So my move count has decreased by less than 0.58 turns on average I would guess.

 

[obelisk477]

According to Lars Vandenbergh I save 0.58 turns on average for my cross switching from opposite color neutral to color neutral. I have switched to some longer, no rotation F2L algs to replace my older more move optimal but with rotation algs. So my move count has decreased by less than 0.58 turns on average I would guess.

Unless you're solving and influencing a pair more along with the cross? Isnt that supposed to help some with movecount? How much easier is it to see cross+1?

 

[cmhardw]

Unless you're solving and influencing a pair more along with the cross? Isnt that supposed to help some with movecount? How much easier is it to see cross+1?

I don't know or have any quantitative numbers on cross+1 or Xcross, but qualitatively I do feel I can see cross+1 on more solves and Xcross on more solves.

 

[IAmAPerson]

I use Xcross a lot. Really helps with movecount in my opinion.