LSE vs ELL

[King Mike]

I'm a CFOP solver, but I'm getting bored of routine last layer. I want to try a method similar to CFCE. I love M slice algorithms so I wondered if I should learn ELL or Roux LSE.

Which one is better/faster in your opinion, and which one do you use mainly?

If I learned ELL it would have to be the 2 Gen algorithms with only M and U moves.

PS: I know the beginner method of LSE, but I want to learn the full method with algorithms

Thanks everyone!

 

[Smiles]

I don't think LSE has algorithms unless you're influencing it during CMLL.
You could just convert to Roux like I did.
I ended up converting back but I don't regret it. It was awesome.

 

[King Mike]

I don't think LSE has algorithms unless you're influencing it during CMLL.
You could just convert to Roux like I did.
I ended up converting back but I don't regret it. It was awesome.

On the edge orientation stage there are algorithms you can use, if it isnt common sense already for you.
http://wafflelikescubes.webs.com/orientation.htm

So I'm guessing you are for LSE? You didn't answer my question, lol

 

[theROUXbiksCube]

Its not really algorithms, its mostly intuitively getting a 4 flip or "arrow" then Doing M' U M'
but yeah, there are mini algorithms used to cycle from case to case
Don't do F2L then LSE, its just bad, theres no purpose for the M slice in F2L if you're just going to use full LSE, so in that case, you're just doing Roux
ELL after F2L would be more logical in this case because you are using CFOP so in that case your main method will be CFCE. Cross F2L CLL ELL

 

[TDM]

On the edge orientation stage there are algorithms you can use, if it isnt common sense already for you.
http://wafflelikescubes.webs.com/orientation.htm

1. those aren't really algorithms
2. the MU ELLs aren't necessarily the best (of the 12 or so ELLs I know, 6 of them aren't MU)
3. I would suggest learning LSE, since it's more useful than ELL. ELL is only really useful for CFCE, which very few people think is as good as CFOP.

 

[theROUXbiksCube]

1. those aren't really algorithms
2. the MU ELLs aren't necessarily the best (of the 12 or so ELLs I know, 6 of them aren't MU)
3. I would suggest learning LSE, since it's more useful than ELL. ELL is only really useful for CFCE, which very few people think is as good as CFOP.

Why learn LSE if he is going to learn CFOP, why not just learn Roux because it would be less efficient than learning LSE but still building the middle slice and rotating during F2L?

 

[King Mike]

1. those aren't really algorithms
2. the MU ELLs aren't necessarily the best (of the 12 or so ELLs I know, 6 of them aren't MU)
3. I would suggest learning LSE, since it's more useful than ELL. ELL is only really useful for CFCE, which very few people think is as good as CFOP.

Probably the only thing good about ELL is that its just mindless algorithms, like OLL and PLL.
LSE does take a little intuitive thinking, but over time I'm sure it will be just as easy.

Thanks TDM

 

[King Mike]

Why learn LSE if he is going to learn CFOP, why not just learn Roux because it would be less efficient than learning LSE but still building the middle slice and rotating during F2L?

FYI I already learned CFOP, Just saying....

 

[theROUXbiksCube]

FYI I already learned CFOP, Just saying....

well if you're going to USE cfop, and try LSE, its less efficient and overall worse than just using F2B to LSE because you don't use Mslice
and if F2L you do, and building a half cross is even less efficient, but Tao Yu is fazt

 

[King Mike]

well if you're going to USE cfop, and try LSE, its less efficient and overall worse than just using F2B to LSE because you don't use Mslice

True but my F2B is trash, I'm way faster at F2L because thats all I do.
Blockbuilding is not my thing....

 

[theROUXbiksCube]

its still less efficient leading to slower solves

 

[ryanj92]

doing LSE when you've already solved the F2L doesn't seem very efficient, I think you'd be better off with ELL

also, don't entirely 2-gen ELL when 4 of the best cases are [R U R' U', M'], inverse and mirror

 

[TDM]

True but my F2B is trash, I'm way faster at F2L because thats all I do.
Blockbuilding is not my thing....

If you're fast at F2L because you practise it a lot, then surely the thing to do would be to practise F2B so that it becomes as fast as your F2L?

 

[Bubtore]

What I propose you, is to do this :
1. Do the F2L except 1 edge and, since this step is a bit between all common methods, you can choose, if it should be a more CFOP (3/4 cross then the 4 pairs), Roux (F2B then insert an egde), or Petrus style (2x2x3 and the 2 last pairs, this is the one I prefer).
2. Solve all the corners (almost all of the CMLL algs work).
3. Insert the last edge while orienting the L5E.
4. Do the EPLL.

! For some cases it's better to do as follow :
3. Orient the L5E.
4. Solve the cube. !

I you wish, I can send you the algs for all the steps I've just described above.

 

[Artic]

Why do you keep avoiding learning Roux when clearly that is the method that suits you best? Stop beating around the bush and switch already. You want M-slices...well Roux has M-slices. Problem solved.

 

[Berd]

I would try roux!

 

[Oatch]

If you are getting bored doing the repetitive algs for OLL and PLL, then how will learning different algs help? Maybe you are just bored with the method in general. If you are really into M, U last layers like with LSE I'd take the others' advice and just try the roux method. Even if it doesn't work out for you, it will give you an insight on how else the cube can be solved and further your understanding. But as aforementioned, traditional F2L into Roux-style LSE is just inefficient and you might as well just start off solving the F2B in Roux.

 

[Petro Leum]

COLL/EPLL not on the list

 

[King Mike]

COLL/EPLL not on the list

Oops! I don't think I can change the poll since Its already started. Sorry...

 

[King Mike]

What I propose you, is to do this :
1. Do the F2L except 1 edge and, since this step is a bit between all common methods, you can choose, if it should be a more CFOP (3/4 cross then the 4 pairs), Roux (F2B then insert an egde), or Petrus style (2x2x3 and the 2 last pairs, this is the one I prefer).
2. Solve all the corners (almost all of the CMLL algs work).
3. Insert the last edge while orienting the L5E.
4. Do the EPLL.

! For some cases it's better to do as follow :
3. Orient the L5E.
4. Solve the cube. !

I you wish, I can send you the algs for all the steps I've just described above.

Yea whenever I do lazy LSE I usually do EPLL instead of the traditional way.
Your method is very similar to FreeFOP, I'll give it a try.
Thanks