Other events for Weekly competition

Which events should be added to the weekly competition?


  • Total voters
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  • Poll closed .
That is indeed the theory I thought it would be. However it amazes me that the number of moves needed grows in this way. 14 -> 19 -> 23 -> 22.
What? (Remember that my method only gives a lower bound for the God's Algorithm number - so for example we know that the depth of the 4x4 is somewhere between 31 (as per my calculations) and 77 (Norskog's Thistlethwaite-style solver).

So let me get this straight:
For a 3x3x3 there are 6 possible moves (RLUDFB) and for every move there are 3 variations (normal, half and back). I am assuming that slices turns are not allowed. This could be simplified to:
3-axis (RUF)
2 moves for every axe (RL, UD, FB or more generally: 1R 2R, 1U, 2U, 1F 2F)
3 variations (1, 2, 3)
All these possibilities are independent from each other so they give 3x2x3=18 possibilities for the n=1 moves.
For n=2 moves there would be 18^2 possibilites, but because of the relation you mentioned it will be less (1R1 + 1R2 = 1R3, 1U1 + 2U2 = 2U2 + 1U1, 2F2 + 2F2 = 1R1 + 1R3, etc)
Er... not really. (By the way 2R is M in my notation, and the singular of "axes" is "axis".) You've come close to the basic approximation, though. A 3x3 cube has 6 faces, and each face has 3 moves. Since scrambles never put the same face twice in a row the number of possibilities in this basic approximation is 18 * 15^(n-1) for n moves. This is very easy to calculate and very simple to use, since you can even use logarithms to avoid explicitly calculating it out for any n.

However there is a more complicated approximation which I was talking about, which takes into account the fact that after doing a series of moves along the same axis we cannot use a slice on that axis that was already used. This doesn't make a difference on the 3x3 but it does provide a better lower bound on larger cubes and the Megaminx (and besides we don't care about 3x3 really because a lower bound of 20 is known :P). I'll describe it more closely: we have a recurrence relation with two sequences, a and b. We will let a_n be the number of scrambles of length n which end in just one turn from the axis, and b_n be the number of scrambles of length n which end in two turns from an axis (like U' D2). Then the recurrence relation is:
a_1 = 18, b_1 = 0
a_n := 12 * a_(n-1) + 12 * b_(n-1)
b_n := 3 * a_(n-1)
Note that the 12s are because there are 4 possible faces that are not on a given axis, and to get a_n we must have changed axis right before the last term. Anyway this gives a very precise count of the number of scrambles we can generate: the number of scrambles for n moves is just a_n + b_n. This becomes a bit more tricky for larger cubes because an NxNxN cube needs N-1 of these sequences. For example on the 5x5x5 we have sequences a, b, c, d and
a_1 = 36, b_1 = 0, c_1 = 0, d_1 = 0
a_n := 24 * a_(n-1) + 24 * b_(n-1) + 24 * c_(n-1) + 24 * d_(n-1)
b_n := 9 * a_(n-1)
c_n := 6 * b_(n-1)
d_n := 3 * c_(n-1)
So the basic approximation is okay, but this calculation will give you an exact value for the number of scrambles. Recurrence relations like these can be created for any puzzle, but they get rather complicated (for example the megaminx has 4 and I imagine the gigaminx would have even more).

I wonder if you have a generic way to determine the relation and if I am correct in assuming that for a 7x7x7 there would be:
3-axis, (7-1 = 6) moves for every axe, 3 variations = 3*6*3 = 54 possibilities for the first move and 54^95 (-relation) after 95 moves.
I always assumed that the number of possibilities formula (3*(n-1)*3)^n (minus relation) would grow so fast that something like this could be true
Count(godsAlgorithmForCubeN) = 10*(N-1) (+1 for even N's)
So 0 for 1x1x1, 11 for 2x2x2, 20 for 3x3x3, 31 for 4x4x4, 40 for 5x5x5, etc.
Well yes, the approximation for 7x7 is 54 * 51^(n-1) for n moves. But as you can see the larger the cube the higher chance that the same-axis slices will get in the way of each other. Interestingly there are some scramblers which change axis after every turn; that would actually reduce the number of possibilities to 54 * 36^(n-1), which is not an approximation since turns don't affect future possible turns at all. Intriguingly this would mean that we now need 102 moves to scramble a 7x7 :)

As far as the growth of the optimal number of turns, I think we are way too far away from that kind of knowledge to even make a decent guess at it. All I have are a couple of lower bounds with absolutely no guarantee of how close they are, and for even the 4x4 it is quite difficult to get a better lower bound (you might have to optimally solve positions) or to get a decent upper bound (since you need some kind of solution method to prove that, assuming you don't have an optimal solver). So unless we can know more about at the very least the 4x4 I don't think it it is reasonable to guess a pattern based on 2x2 and 3x3. However, taking the complete and total guess that the number of moves is about three more than predicted in my calculation, I think something like
1/2 (5 (N-1)^2 + 3 (N-1) + 14) = 1/2 (5 N^2 - 7 N + 16)
for an NxNxN cube (N >= 2) might fit reasonably well. It's likely to be more or less quadratic, although of course it probably won't follow a simple sequence such as this.
 
2x2 FMC wouldn't be much fun. Everyone will just find an optimal solution every week. When I ask for an explanation everyone will say either "I just saw the whole solution" or "ABC solves 3 corners, DEFG to finish". I don't think the question would be "if" you found an optimal solution but "how fast" you did it.

Snake was already in the poll and will be in the weekly competition from now on because it got 10 votes.

Man, the weekly competition is going to be changed to a 2-weekly competition pretty soon, because it will be impossible to do all events in one week. What if we get V-Cubes up to 11x11x11 and people vote for 11x11x11 FMC and multi-blind?
 
2x2 FMC wouldn't be much fun. Everyone will just find an optimal solution every week. When I ask for an explanation everyone will say either "I just saw the whole solution" or "ABC solves 3 corners, DEFG to finish". I don't think the question would be "if" you found an optimal solution but "how fast" you did it.

Snake was already in the poll and will be in the weekly competition from now on because it got 10 votes.

Man, the weekly competition is going to be changed to a 2-weekly competition pretty soon, because it will be impossible to do all events in one week. What if we get V-Cubes up to 11x11x11 and people vote for 11x11x11 FMC and multi-blind?

How about multiple puzzle multi-BLD. Like a different puzzle would be worth different points. For example you can do 2 clocks, 3 3x3, 1 4x4 and a minx or do like 7 pryaminx, 2 3x3 and 5 4x4.
 
Man, the weekly competition is going to be changed to a 2-weekly competition pretty soon, because it will be impossible to do all events in one week. What if we get V-Cubes up to 11x11x11 and people vote for 11x11x11 FMC and multi-blind?

I think it's already there. It looks like I may not be able to get everything done this week, since we have relatives visiting and I've already missed more than a day of working on it, and all I've done is 3x3x3 fewest moves. And now speed BLD? That's going to be the hardest of all for me to add. I think I've reached my breaking point.

And right after I got my clock, too! :(
 
2x2 FMC wouldn't be much fun. Everyone will just find an optimal solution every week. When I ask for an explanation everyone will say either "I just saw the whole solution" or "ABC solves 3 corners, DEFG to finish". I don't think the question would be "if" you found an optimal solution but "how fast" you did it.


Yes, but you'll see in the next weeks the number of persons who will have done 4x4 Fewest Moves... It's a category that requires more time, and has a lot of troubles to get a optimal solution, and a complicated notation.

I say to add 2x2 because I like the puzzle and I'm able to spent a bit of time for this. I think that adding this category is not a problem (is only add one more scramble, like 4x4)

Thanks by adding Snake :D

Cheers ;)
 
How about BLD FMC? It's like regular FMC, but you have to memorize the cube and put on a blindfold before you start doing turns. You still have an hour. You'd probably wanna use a computer to type your solution... I guess at the end you can submit any solution you have written down.
 
What about FM 3x3x3 with no time limit?

Such a thing would still have a time limit - one week! :)
Per took over the FMC from Dan Harris. They have what you want. You could also submit a 1 hour solution and post what you found after 1 hour.

I really don't want to increase the number of events to much. Bld FMC doesn't sound like something that would get 10 votes
 
I don't agree with cupstacking. It's a speedsolving forum.

Magic isn't exactly "solving" either, we just include it because it was invented by Rubik lol; if it weren't invented by someone else, we wouldn't have it... therefore, stacking makes just as much sense as magic in my eyes.
Believe me, if it was up to me (or Tyson) the Magic event would be very different or just not in the competition. However, it is an official event in WCA competitions so it is in the weekly competition as well. Cupstacking won't be
 
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