[Help Thread] ZBLL Discussion and Help

[Daniel Lin]

I could learn full ZBLL in a week with the petrus alg system, I think. Im too lazy to right now, also because Im learning CMLL.

Not as easy as it looks. Even though you're combining algs, you still have to link case to case, and since alg combos are all similar, you might mix them up.

 

[OLLiver]

Not as easy as it looks. Even though you're combining algs, you still have to link case to case, and since alg combos are all similar, you might mix them up.

yeah a lot of my ZBLLs are 2 2 alg combos (especially 2GLL) remembering which combination of say sune AUF antisune from back takes a lot of time as the algs end up being really similar.

Also I would like to announce that my break from ZBLL is over. Anthony has inspired me to try and finish it again.
This has nothing to do with the fact that a certain nub from Minnesota is close to knowing more ZBLLs than me.

If you're reading this Chris (Olson) race to full ZBLL minus S/As?

 

[Daniel Lin]

yeah a lot of my ZBLLs are 2 2 alg combos (especially 2GLL) remembering which combination of say sune AUF antisune from back takes a lot of time as the algs end up being really similar

yeah I learn all the 2sune combos for 2gll, but I don't do alg combos for anything else

 

[Shiv3r]

Not as easy as it looks. Even though you're combining algs, you still have to link case to case, and since alg combos are all similar, you might mix them up.

according to lars petrus:
"Learning all those is still a fairly big memorization undertaking, but much smaller than memorizing 270 individual algorithms. My gut feeling number is that it's 10% of the effort. And for "muscle memory", you only need to keep 40 known fast algs up to speed, which is much easier than 270.

I think that the 2-3 more moves used compared to the perfect 12.08 is more than compensated by these factors in terms of execution speed."

 

[Daniel Lin]

My gut feeling number is that it's 10% of the effort

Naw, i would say doing this would take ~50% of the effort.

 

[supercavitation]

I keep wanting to go back to learning full ZBLL, but no. I shall not be tempted (VLS4lyfe).

Perhaps this is the wrong place to ask, but what do people think of the usefulness of ZBLL vs VLS?

 

[shadowslice e]

I keep wanting to go back to learning full ZBLL, but no. I shall not be tempted (VLS4lyfe).

Perhaps this is the wrong place to ask, but what do people think of the usefulness of ZBLL vs VLS?

As a neutral person in this discussion, I would say that VL2 may be nicer for FMC but ZBLL nicer for speedsolving because there isn't another pause for recognition after which means that in theory there should only be one pause to recognise compared to 2 for CFOP+VLS

 

[OLLiver]

I keep wanting to go back to learning full ZBLL, but no. I shall not be tempted (VLS4lyfe).

Perhaps this is the wrong place to ask, but what do people think of the usefulness of ZBLL vs VLS?

I was talking to Jay about this, he said the reason he wanted to know ZBLL was because some VLS cases suck and in those instances he would rather do EO and ZBLL rather than a bad VLS to any PLL.

Personally I think both have their usefulness. Thought which is faster I couldn't say. on that topic does VLS+PLL or EO+ZBLL have a lower avg move count? this would be really interesting to know

 

[irontwig]

PLL and ZBLL (and 1LLL) have basically the same (optimal) movecount of 12-ish htm. Of course speed-optimized would be a bit longer, but EO+ZBLL should nonetheless be shorter.

 

[Shiv3r]

Naw, i would say doing this would take ~50% of the effort.

still, thats learning the algs on an order of weeks or months instead of months or years. the combinations would be easy to remember, while also being fast.

 

[Rubiks560]

yeah a lot of my ZBLLs are 2 2 alg combos (especially 2GLL) remembering which combination of say sune AUF antisune from back takes a lot of time as the algs end up being really similar.

Also I would like to announce that my break from ZBLL is over. Anthony has inspired me to try and finish it again.
This has nothing to do with the fact that a certain nub from Minnesota is close to knowing more ZBLLs than me.

If you're reading this Chris (Olson) race to full ZBLL minus S/As?

Argh don't tempt me :'( so much work right now.

 

[Saransh Grover]

Hi guys, I needed some tips
I recently started out with ZBLL U and have finished 2 sets and am on my 3rd. Now , i've started to forget the recognition for most cases even though I remember the algs. Is this normal and is there a way to remember better in U ZBLLS?

 

[Daniel Lin]

Hi guys, I needed some tips
I recently started out with ZBLL U and have finished 2 sets and am on my 3rd. Now , i've started to forget the recognition for most cases even though I remember the algs. Is this normal and is there a way to remember better in U ZBLLS?

do ZBLL time attacks. It helps if you have a list and you put the algs in order by the recognition patterns.

 

[OLLiver]

what is the move count for a non move optimal (aka speed friendly) ZBLL vs PLL?

 

[wir3sandfir3s]

My summer project is learning full ZBLL, at least with the Petrus system. Then I'm gonna learn ZZ-CT, and then a bunch of other ZZ variations.
Anyone wanna do a race on who could learn a bunch of chosen ZZ variations first?

 

[obelisk477]

what is the move count for a non move optimal (aka speed friendly) ZBLL vs PLL?

I get 13.05 average moves from the top algs on algdb for PLL, and 16.62 average moves from the algs on jabari's sheet

 

[Shiv3r]

My summer project is learning full ZBLL, at least with the Petrus system. Then I'm gonna learn ZZ-CT, and then a bunch of other ZZ variations.
Anyone wanna do a race on who could learn a bunch of chosen ZZ variations first?

JtWong is learning petrus, and for 1llll i betcha he would definitely.

also, I learned full CMLL, I learned the last 3 sets in one day cause I was bored

 

[JTWong71]

My summer project is learning full ZBLL, at least with the Petrus system. Then I'm gonna learn ZZ-CT, and then a bunch of other ZZ variations.
Anyone wanna do a race on who could learn a bunch of chosen ZZ variations first?

Yep, I would like to race someone at learning algorithms over the summer.

I'll race on learning the Petrus-ZBLL Algorithms and maybe ZZ-CT, depending on whether or not I find something else I want to learn.

 

[Daniel Lin]

I'm having a hard time deciding between algs
y' R' U L2 D' L' U2 L D L' U R U L' or
R' U L U R' D R U2 R' D' R2 U L'

F R U R' U' R U' R' U2 R U2 R' U' F' or
y F R U R2 F R F' R U' R' F'

 

[OLLiver]

I'm having a hard time deciding between algs
y' R' U L2 D' L' U2 L D L' U R U L' or
R' U L U R' D R U2 R' D' R2 U L'

F R U R' U' R U' R' U2 R U2 R' U' F' or
y F R U R2 F R F' R U' R' F'

I use both the 2nd ones of each and like them