My Full ZBLL List

Would i be correct in thinking that the permutation of the pieces will always be arranged as a PLL case during OLL. So the Sune ZBLL set (for example) will have 21 ZBLL algs?
 
gyroninja said:
AUFing would change the corner orientation.
Click to expand...

Oh, that saddens me deeply.

Would it be worth it to start learning these algs? Because even if I learn all the cases, that's only for having a top cross which I feel is kind of a waste since all the edges need to be oriented and there's still 50 other cases that would require 2-look LL.
 
ThatCubeDude11 said:
Oh, that saddens me deeply.

Would it be worth it to start learning these algs? Because even if I learn all the cases, that's only for having a top cross which I feel is kind of a waste since all the edges need to be oriented and there's still 50 other cases that would require 2-look LL.
Click to expand...

I'm not sure how new you are to cubing, but worth is subjective. Whether ZBLL is worth learning, is constantly at debate. As a general rule, I'd say you have to be willing to learn ZBLL because you like the idea, rather than expecting significant improvement. 472 algs is a long way to go for the half a second it saves every few solves.
 
Bindedsa said:
I'm not sure how new you are to cubing, but worth is subjective. Whether ZBLL is worth learning, is constantly at debate. As a general rule, I'd say you have to be willing to learn ZBLL because you like the idea, rather than expecting significant improvement. 472 algs is a long way to go for the half a second it saves every few solves.
Click to expand...

Well, I average around 16 seconds and I've been cubing for nearly 2 years. I was thinking about maybe starting to learn it, at least the more recognizable cases, but when you put it in perspective of saving very little time every few solves. It seems to not be worth it. For me, now, the only way it seems reasonable to learn ZBLL would be to learn full ZBLL to 1-look with all OLL cases, not the 7 subsets, however, that is thousands of algs that I'm not sure anyone would learn. Unless you filter out all of the cases that almost never show up, and cases with no oriented edges which can be controlled during F2L.
 
ThatCubeDude11 said:
Well, I average around 16 seconds and I've been cubing for nearly 2 years. I was thinking about maybe starting to learn it, at least the more recognizable cases, but when you put it in perspective of saving very little time every few solves. It seems to not be worth it. For me, now, the only way it seems reasonable to learn ZBLL would be to learn full ZBLL to 1-look with all OLL cases, not the 7 subsets, however, that is thousands of algs that I'm not sure anyone would learn. Unless you filter out all of the cases that almost never show up, and cases with no oriented edges which can be controlled during F2L.
Click to expand...
You could always learn zz...
 
ThatCubeDude11 said:
Well, I average around 16 seconds and I've been cubing for nearly 2 years. I was thinking about maybe starting to learn it, at least the more recognizable cases, but when you put it in perspective of saving very little time every few solves. It seems to not be worth it. For me, now, the only way it seems reasonable to learn ZBLL would be to learn full ZBLL to 1-look with all OLL cases, not the 7 subsets, however, that is thousands of algs that I'm not sure anyone would learn. Unless you filter out all of the cases that almost never show up, and cases with no oriented edges which can be controlled during F2L.
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VHLS can be done intuitively and isn't too hard. You could also do ZZ and have a really fun F2L.

Also, I wouldn't say that 1LLL is impossible. Especially as BindeDSA is learning it right now. There are ~4500 cases i believe.
 
I really want to learn ZBLL. I can learn pretty fast (6 Algs a day) if I focus. I cannot focus for my life. I'm probably doing something wrong. My recognition is ok (I've only learned a few algorithms though). How did you learn, in as much detail as possible? I seriously need some help. Thanks!
 
wir3sandfir3s said:
I really want to learn ZBLL. I can learn pretty fast (6 Algs a day) if I focus. I cannot focus for my life. I'm probably doing something wrong. My recognition is ok (I've only learned a few algorithms though). How did you learn, in as much detail as possible? I seriously need some help. Thanks!
Click to expand...
I did it the same way I did OLL, I learned random cases, when ever I felt like it. I averaged about 1.5 algs a day, my biggest tip is to slow down and drill algs rather than just learning more and more algs. Something like that works with OLL, because it's not a pretty small set, so you can finish the set then worry about recalling algs. ZBLL is way too big for that, try to break it up into sections, set goals, but then practice all of the algs you have learned rather than just moving on.
 
Hi!
Nice list Jabari!

I used to be able to change algs in a duplicated list, but i cant do that anymore. Can you explain why? Would be nice if i have that Feature again as i really like tat list design overall, especially that the Image is created as you type an alg. I'm in the proccess of learning zbll and i Forget algs from time to time, so it would be nice to have my algs saved there.
thanks
 
shadowslice e said:
Also, I wouldn't say that 1LLL is impossible. Especially as BindeDSA is learning it right now. There are ~4500 cases i believe.
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Well, to keep the 4500 algorithms 'fresh', one would have to run a utility that queried the solver with all 4500 algorithms in a random sequence, with one show per algorithm. Assuming 3 seconds to 'memory fetch' and execute each algorithm (which allows for the longer memory 'fetch' time for such a large sequence), then 'refreshing' the full set in a single sitting would take 4500 x 3 seconds = 3 hours 45 minutes. That's not an unrealistic amount of time except your hands (and brain) would get very tired without breaks. Adding in a few short breaks and it would take 4 hours to refresh the set. I'd say the person would need to refresh the set at least 2-3 times per week to avoid forgetting cases. So, still possible for someone with strong motivation. I guess the next question is how much time do they save by not having to do edge orientation during F2L? I.e. time gain of 1LLL vs. ZBLL.


Eric Fattah
BC, Canada
 
efattah said:
Well, to keep the 4500 algorithms 'fresh', one would have to run a utility that queried the solver with all 4500 algorithms in a random sequence, with one show per algorithm. Assuming 3 seconds to 'memory fetch' and execute each algorithm (which allows for the longer memory 'fetch' time for such a large sequence), then 'refreshing' the full set in a single sitting would take 4500 x 3 seconds = 3 hours 45 minutes. That's not an unrealistic amount of time except your hands (and brain) would get very tired without breaks. Adding in a few short breaks and it would take 4 hours to refresh the set. I'd say the person would need to refresh the set at least 2-3 times per week to avoid forgetting cases. So, still possible for someone with strong motivation. I guess the next question is how much time do they save by not having to do edge orientation during F2L? I.e. time gain of 1LLL vs. ZBLL.


Eric Fattah
BC, Canada
Click to expand...
Good post. What about only avoiding dot cases? i.e. how long to refresh the set with only partial edge control?
 
So the OH section are just a collection of algs for every case and the OH (Jabari) section are the specific algs you use?
Also, is it still the latest version?
 
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