In general is sub 30 possible?

[jskyler91]

Again, our difference is precisely here. I'm saying the cubers in China seem to be very serious about it, implying (although admittedly I don't know this) that there are many thousands of them who have had sub-30 solves (and even averaged sub-30) without ever going to a competition. I could be wrong, but I suspect a large percentage of those 40,000 people on MF8 who are regular posters are sub-30 (and I actually mean sub-30 average). So in other words, I think there are many more over there than there are here on Speedsolving.com.



The original question was this, so we are talking singles:

Both of our forms of logic are solid, if our assumptions are correct of course, therefore the only way to truly settle this would be with data which neither or us have. What can be agreed upon, however, is that a lot of people have had sub 30 singles

 

[peterbone]

I really suspect the hard thing for many older solvers is that we tend to fall into habits more easily, and have to struggle more to overcome those bad habits than a younger solver would. I'm quite sure the main thing holding me back from sub-20 is that I don't push myself out of my bad habits enough. It should be no harder than learning to play a difficult piece on the piano, but I've learned strategies for practicing properly on piano that help me accomplish that, and somehow I have trouble translating that to strategies for practicing cubing.

Hi Mike. Have you considered giving up the sub-20 race for a while? It could be this that is holding you back and keeping you from changing your 'bad habits'. I'm sure you know that by changing how you solve (learning fingertricks, etc) you will get slower before getting faster and so it's tempting to stick with your current solve style. I may start to participate in the sub-20 race soon but I want to make sure that my solve style is good enough to get sub-20 consistently first.
Given the average age of people on this site, I put myself in the 'older solvers' category. I started speedcubing at the age of 30.

 

[GlowingSausage]

I average:
Sub 15-16 with CFOP (Cross, F2L, OLL, PLL)
Sub 20 with advanced LBL (Cross, 1st layer, 2nd layer, OLL, PLL)
sub 30 with beginners LBL (Cross, 1st layer, 2nd layer, LL edges in 2 steps, LL corners in 2 steps)
sub 30-40 with Roux (1st Block, 2nd Block, CMLL[I use OLLs & PLLs], LSE) I've only done about 65 solves with it.

(written the 3rd time now -.-)

 

[Rune]

I average:
Sub 15-16 with CFOP (Cross, F2L, OLL, PLL)
Sub 20 with advanced LBL (Cross, 1st layer, 2nd layer, OLL, PLL)
sub 30 with beginners LBL (Cross, 1st layer, 2nd layer, LL edges in 2 steps, LL corners in 2 steps)
sub 30-40 with Roux (1st Block, 2nd Block, CMLL[I use OLLs & PLLs], LSE) I've only done about 65 solves with it.

(written the 3rd time now -.-)

And next time write it in the Accomplishment Thread.

 

[GlowingSausage]

And next time write it in the Accomplishment Thread.

Yeah... I totally forgot about that thread for a while. I'll do so, when I get a PB

 

[~Adam~]

I suspect the number is much higher than that. In any event, we have clear evidence of at least 8924 people. (That's how many are recorded in the WCA database right now as having solved it in less than 30 seconds for an official WCA solve.) I would guess there are probably that many people or more in China alone who have never been to a competition but have solved it in less than 30 seconds at home. (And when I say more, I realize it could be LOTS more.) I would think a safe minimum on the number is probably at least 30,000 people. And actually, if I had to guess, I'd guess around 100,000. But I have absolutely no data to back it up - it's a pure guess. It could be as low as about 30,000; it could be as high as a million or more.

I know 3 people who can solve in under 30 secs who I doubt will ever compete. I know probably 5 more that I could get sub 30 within a couple of months if they let me try. There must be tons of people like this that for one reason or another haven't/won't compete.

 

[skeletonboy]

Sub-30 isn't all the hard. You just need the right potential like patience, interest, and dedication, that's really it. (Except for common sense of course).

Teaching a class of people trying to be good speedcubers, only 2 have reached sub-30? Well, I guess the other people aren't all that dedicated. The ratio is (quite sure) not 45:2.
You see, many cubers cube as a hobby or interest, therefore they would naturally dedicate a lot of time into it. If you count lucky solves, there could be a huge number of people who have done a sub-30 single.

 

[Mike Hughey]

Hi Mike. Have you considered giving up the sub-20 race for a while? It could be this that is holding you back and keeping you from changing your 'bad habits'. I'm sure you know that by changing how you solve (learning fingertricks, etc) you will get slower before getting faster and so it's tempting to stick with your current solve style.

You're probably right. But I doubt I'll do that, because I've competed every time and now I feel a sort of compulsion to continue. In theory, I should be able to just be willing to get slower for the competition if necessary; I'll try that. (But of course, due to subconscious behavior, it might not be possible for me to actually do it.) I have little doubt that some of my problem is just my own silly quirks getting in the way.

 

[Rune]

You're probably right. But I doubt I'll do that, because I've competed every time and now I feel a sort of compulsion to continue. In theory, I should be able to just be willing to get slower for the competition if necessary; I'll try that. (But of course, due to subconscious behavior, it might not be possible for me to actually do it.) I have little doubt that some of my problem is just my own silly quirks getting in the way.

A good(?) advice but in totally wrong time!

 

[DaveyCow]

Sub-30 isn't all the hard. You just need the right potential like patience, interest, and dedication, that's really it. (Except for common sense of course).

hmmm well I'm *intensely* interested and dedicated and I'm only 45 after 10 months... so what does that say about me, in your estimation?

 

[skeletonboy]

hmmm well I'm *intensely* interested and dedicated and I'm only 45 after 10 months... so what does that say about me, in your estimation?

Improve your solve where it needs improvement most. I averaged 35 seconds just a month ago, and I soon learned that my last layer took me 16 seconds. Holy cow! I quickly went ahead and learned some algorithms. After 2-3 weeks, I was getting some sub-30 averages. I knew that wasn't enough, but I didn't want to cram too many algorithms in my brain because I might forget them. With that, I tried improving my F2L. I noticed I had quite a bit of long stalls of pair inspection in the solve. I learned one of the most popular useful techniques for F2L, the lookahead.

Yes it is hard to get used to (for some people) and you might even get worse times. But with practice, and turning slowly so that your brain will catch on to the movements of the cube, you'll be able to get lookahead in no time. For me, the lookahead was what brought me the real breakthrough. No seriously, every average I got was 35-40 seconds-only lucky averages were sub-30. After I practiced lookahead for a while, it brought my average to 25-29 seconds. Whew! I was so glad.

So time yourself seperately and see which parts of your solve seems exceptional. Maybe a 12 second cross or a 18 second last layer? Work on it. A lot of pauses mid-solve? Work on that (recognition/lookahead).
Have fun

 

[Rubiksfreak]

So whaddya think? Is sub 30 possible for every member of the human race? Or does it take some special ability or spacial awareness?

I know I feel like sub 30 is impossible for me... Or am I just being pessimistic?

What are your thougts?

Of course it is, haven't you ever seen videos on youtube lol. Everything seems impossible when you just start cubing. I guarantee you when you get down to sub 30 youll think its slow. I average around 12 seconds and to me thats slow.

 

[Iggy]

It's actually kinda easy. All you have to do is practice a lot.

 

[DaveyCow]

It's actually kinda easy. All you have to do is practice a lot.

I think "easy" here is a very subjective term - I practice a ton (been cubing 11 months) and still only ave 45 sec. Whereas some people can make sub 30 in just a few months. I think it depends on (as people have said) *how* you practice. I think definitely the "how" is different for different people and different people have different "speed bumps" and "plateaus" they have to hurtle. I think sub30 comes much easier to some than others (me for example), so I think it's kinda unfair to say "its easy to get sub30" - it totally depends on the person. Sure maybe anyone can get there, but it may be more difficult for some than others. Just like math - I truely believe anyone can understand and be proficient at Calculus (say), but it's just harder for some than others - it may not be easy at all for a particular person, but still do-able.

Thoughts?

 

[Bapao]

30 seconds should be "easly" obtainable for any able bodied individual. Just depends on your dedication. Some people reach that speed after mere months albeigth with tons of practice. It took me 1.5 years. I've practiced a lot, but in measure. And then there's the fact that I'm a bit of a dunce...with far too many hobbies.

I've been practicing for so long for so little in terms of speed, that I guess I'm not really a good representation of a speed cuber. The game still captivates me though. Especially after building up as much experience as I have. The 3x3x3 as a whole is becoming more and more transparent by the day. Who's the b*tch now cube?! Me? Oh...

P.S. Thanks to my boss for letting me cube at work.

EDIT

Two spelling mistakes left to edit. After 3 edits. If I'm addicted to anything then it's correcting my own despicable grammar. Let it go Bapao...let it go...I just added another mistake by adding this edit didn't I?...sigh...

 

[ChaosWZ]

I've seen sub-30 beginners method. It's ridiculous. But yes, it's possible for any normal person. If you've got some brain deadness or something maybe not, but just about any normal person.

 

[DaveyCow]

Who's the b*tch now cube?! Me? Oh...

lol! I know the feeling!

EDIT

Two spelling mistakes left to edit. After 3 edits. If I'm addicted to anything then it's correcting my own despicable grammar. Let it go Bapao...let it go...I just added another mistake by adding this edit didn't I?...sigh...

rofl! but sadly, I can identify....

 

[Bapao]

Dave,

As long as something is interesting and it motivates you to continue practicing it, then just try to go with the flow. Have fun. Even if progress seems to stagnate at times, you'll only hurt yourself by making something you enjoy a potential chore.

I think many people come to a point where progress slows down and they start to feel like they aren't going anywhere. Even though I'm not very competitive, I have those phases a lot.

I've been playing guitar for about 2 years and I still get frustrated at how bad I think I am. It's not until you start to see things relatively that you notice that you are actually improving at what you practice. Maybe not as fast as you want, but don't deny progress.

Sure, I wish I could get better at playing the guitar faster. But at the end of the day, my eagerness and greed for success in that aspect is second only to my hope and desire of mastering what I practice. Be that music or solving a cubic puzzle as fast as I can.

I have days when I just feel like I want to pack-up and let it be. But if I give up, then I'll never know if I eventually could have reached my goals.

Giving up cubing would be far easier for me than giving up practicing music. I could give away all my cubes and forget about it and probably wouldn't be confronted with cubing very often in everyday life. But I love listening to music and I would feel the shame of my lack of dedication every time I hear a sweet guitar riff.

Just keep at it. If sh*t still feels like your getting something out of it, then you probably are.

 

[TheWitcher]

http://badmephisto.com/guide.php
http://www.youtube.com/user/badmephisto

Follow his guide, follow his youtube channel. Watch all the relevant tutorials he made, several times.

 

[JohnLaurain]

In my opinion, getting sub-30 is probably obtainable by anyone on earth that's both physically and mentally able, as long as they practice and are dedicated. I'm now getting ~25 averages with a pb of 15.43 after 2.5 months knowing only 4LLL and intuitive F2l. If I can achieve that with 4LLL then nearly anybody should be able to get sub 30 if they put enough time into it.