How I should continue?

[JLarsen]

@Sn3kyPandaMan, there is no such cycle as (1 2 4 5 6 7 5 6 7 5 6 7 ...).
Your recognition is faulty if you loop back into the middle of the cycle. Why? In the given example, if the piece in position 4 belongs in position 5, then how can the piece in position 7 also belong in position 5? Look more carefully. Maybe you didn't distinguish white from yellow on a piece? For example, my position 4 is just above position 8; if I confuse top/bottom colors, I might go to the wrong one. The sample memos given at cubefreak.net might help. If I didn't answer your question, can you rephrase it?

Oh I figured it all out by myself at about 12:30 in my room. I'm still amazed at the fact that none of you could answer that, because now that I know, allow me to explain it. If you at any time encounter a number already contained within your cycle, you now have the buffer piece, begin a new cycle. If at any time you get your buffer piece, being a new cycle. And as far as parity goes, you need to swap the 2 edges that you swap during corner perm, and make sure that the 2 corners you swap during edge perm are contained within that alg, for me, its the Ra perm because my buffer piece is UBL, and my buffer piece is UR. This is only neccesary when you have an odd number of corner swaps, because you're edges are still left swapped, and never had a chance to return to their positions. Now see if what I was asking makes sense. Perhaps my explanation was off, and no, everything i just said was not asked in my question, because i figured it out myself prior to that. But nobody could explain piece by piece corner cycles, and that, is my summary of them.

 

[Cyber]

Anyway today was a good day...
3rd day after learning blind solve and I get sub 8min solve with no paper(4min memo, 4min solve)

you've passed me already, nice one.

and in my experience BLD solving is more impressive that speed solving. Some people just can't believe it can be done.

Nice, how do you improve so fast, well done you.

Oh this is all that I can mention which helps me: TOP 10
1.Im devout cuber(practicing a lot)...
2.Im addicted...
3.Im logical person(it may help me)...
4.Im kinda talented(I solved cube in 1 hour after I get it. without guide)...
5.Im kinda problem solver...
6.I dont give up until I reach my goals...
7.Ambitious...
8.I want to do thing in my own way always!!!
9.Good visual memo in everything...
10.Maybe some luck...

 

[rjohnson_8ball]

@Sn3kyPandaMan, actually the issue is that a sequence containing an odd number of items can be solved completely by 3-cycles. If you have a sequence with an even number of items, then the 3-cycles will reduce it down to a pair. For example, (1 2 3 4 5 6) reduces down to (1 6) after you do the 3-cycles.
To resolve that corner swap you need to either combine it with another corner swap or with an edge swap.

 

[JLarsen]

@Sn3kyPandaMan, actually the issue is that a sequence containing an odd number of items can be solved completely by 3-cycles. If you have a sequence with an even number of items, then the 3-cycles will reduce it down to a pair. For example, (1 2 3 4 5 6) reduces down to (1 6) after you do the 3-cycles.
To resolve that corner swap you need to either combine it with another corner swap or with an edge swap.

VERY IMPORTANT TO REALIZE; I DONT use cycles, I solve my corners using piece by piece, like old pochmann, but i preorient them. Odd yes?

 

[rjohnson_8ball]

ok, now i understand. I don't do pochmann yet, so I will learn and experience that "break into new cycle" thing later.

 

[JLarsen]

ok, now i understand. I don't do pochmann yet, so I will learn and experience that "break into new cycle" thing later.

What would you learn before pochman?? Oh and I don't recomend learning it in its pure form, unless you think you can memo all the edges and corners + their orientations AS WELL. =] I orient my edges and corners first, it takes like 10 seconds.

 

[rjohnson_8ball]

ok, now i understand. I don't do pochmann yet, so I will learn and experience that "break into new cycle" thing later.

What would you learn before pochman?? Oh and I don't recomend learning it in its pure form, unless you think you can memo all the edges and corners + their orientations AS WELL. =] I orient my edges and corners first, it takes like 10 seconds.

I only do the full 3OP method described at cubefreak.net. It solves two pieces at a time, assuming they have been oriented correctly beforehand. Pochmann permutes and orients one piece at a time. Unlike in 3OP where a buffer position can be anywhere, in Pochmann the buffer position remains constant so "breaking into a new cycle" is needed. I think with Pochmann, double edge pairs or double corner pairs get treated more easily. Both handle edge/corner parity swaps.

I cannot say which you should learn first. I learned 3OP because I liked that I could learn and practice each of the 4 stages separately. I didn't feel ready for a story method for remembering things like Red/White versus White/Red stickers.

 

[Cyber]

Same with me! And Im using visual look as memo... no stories
Also I dont break never a new cycle! xD

 

[EmersonHerrmann]

I know M2 is fast, but I never real got into it...go 3 cycle (and some old pochmann for corners)

 

[Cyber]

I know M2 is fast, but I never real got into it...go 3 cycle (and some old pochmann for corners)

U think that U2 M2 is faster than OP3??? Is it in real?

 

[ManuK]

@Cyber,
You solved the cube without guide in 1 hour..That's amazing.
How did u solve the cube?
Like start as in a Layer-by-Layer approach.
Or solving the two opposite sides?
Or were u aware of the strategies to be employed(not the algorithms)?

So,M2 with 3-cycles edge,and classic pochmann with 3-cycles corner would be the fastest?

 

[cookingfat]

I'm considering M2 for edges, I watched EricLimeback's video last night and it looks a lot faster than the classic pochmann. I get the whole 'set up move, M2 undo setup' part, the only thing that's putting me off is the wierd algorithms you need to learn for parity and also when your next edge is already in the M slice.

 

[Cyber]

You solved the cube without guide in 1 hour..That's amazing.

Yeah I think so too...my fastest improve

How did u solve the cube?
Like start as in a Layer-by-Layer approach.
Or solving the two opposite sides?

I heard somewhere that cross need to be solved first.
I got cross pretty fast and also first layer corners(It is just logical).
Then I noticed how to put middle layer edges.
I noticed that it is much faster to put both at the same time.
During this I was able to solve one of the friedrich methods F2L situations.
Still I couldn´t even realize how to solve all cases puting both at the same time...only 1 or 2 situations.
Then I was wondering again: "the cross".
After some experimentations I noticed how to get the edges up!
Then edges to right place...I tried, no way, I get the start situation back...
I dont know actually, I was just doing the sune and i noticed how it works.
When i was playing with one F2L pair around the cube i realized it
Corners swap was just a one logical stuff...3D perceive was good for it.
then was the hard part...HOW **** I CAN SPIN CORNERS!?!?!?
I just mess up...re do layers, mess up, mess up, mess up, over and over again...
Then I just did some random turns(u know R' D' R D) and I see that corner spins!
That was discovery!!! I did it for one corner then another... as u know...
2 mess ups more... first time just normal try and thinking: "maybe I did it wrong"
another try... ok I did it right... but this is wrong thing...
Then i saw that the alg which spins corner mess up pieces in 1 F2L slot.
That´s why I bring another corner above to it and do it again...
And i saw how how it fix them. I was amazed and then I got my first solve!

Or were u aware of the strategies to be employed(not the algorithms)?

So kinda YES! but I was doing everything in same way...

So,M2 with 3-cycles edge,and classic pochmann with 3-cycles corner would be the fastest?

I dont know... Im doing like Ville Seppänen did...
Using now just OP3 until I go for free style...
Anyway Im happy now cause I can do blind solve!

Ps. Sry, bad explanation!

 

[ManuK]

Ps. Sry, bad explanation!

You explained it pretty well.When I saw "Pursuit of Happyness"(Movie), I had thought that solving the cube (the first time you see it) in 30 mins was pretty much impossible. Now, I realise that it just might be possible,though it is(was) way beyond my capabilities.

When I bought the cube, I had thought that the strategy would be to solve the first side,then 2nd,then 3rd,then 4th and then finally to solve the 5th. Then, I thought of solving the opposite two sides and then somehow correcting all the others.Somehow, never got into layer by layer method.So,I solved the first side,then redid the corners until the opposite side's cubies were in the last layer.Then, I somehow managed to orient the corners.So,could get 2 (so 2nd side only when corner already present)or even 3 sides,depending on luck.

I must have spent at least 70-90 mins on that cube and the solution seemed nowhere near.So,after three weeks (am not persistent,so cubed only abt 5 mins max a day),gave up. I think the way I tried to do it, resembled the corners-first-method,where u almost solve 1 side ( leave one edge) and then do the opposite?.Maybe, I should have persisted and after many more hours of cubing, could have found a way to solve the cube.

I understand that if using LBL approach, doing F2L is not such a big problem(for a beginner). It is usually in the top layer, a starter would get stuck?(At least that is the case with my friend, who is trying to figure out a way by himself).

I dont know... Im doing like Ville Seppänen did...
Using now just OP3 until I go for free style...
Anyway Im happy now cause I can do blind solve!

PS:Good Luck with your BLD's..So,how much time do you practice BLD now?Seeing that even you could not do first BLD solve sub-10 minutes,I have pretty much given all hopes of achieving sub-10 the first time...(Have read somewhere that Tyson Mao did his first BLD in 6.4 mins or so).

 

[Cyber]

Ps. Sry, bad explanation!

You explained it pretty well.When I saw "Pursuit of Happyness"(Movie), I had thought that solving the cube (the first time you see it) in 30 mins was pretty much impossible. Now, I realise that it just might be possible,though it is(was) way beyond my capabilities.

When I bought the cube, I had thought that the strategy would be to solve the first side,then 2nd,then 3rd,then 4th and then finally to solve the 5th. Then, I thought of solving the opposite two sides and then somehow correcting all the others.Somehow, never got into layer by layer method.So,I solved the first side,then redid the corners until the opposite side's cubies were in the last layer.Then, I somehow managed to orient the corners.So,could get 2 (so 2nd side only when corner already present)or even 3 sides,depending on luck.

I must have spent at least 70-90 mins on that cube and the solution seemed nowhere near.So,after three weeks (am not persistent,so cubed only abt 5 mins max a day),gave up. I think the way I tried to do it, resembled the corners-first-method,where u almost solve 1 side ( leave one corner) and then do the opposite?.Maybe, I should have persisted and after many more hours of cubing, could have found a way to solve the cube.

My first solving style was kinda clear...and I get it fast...Im happy for it...

I understand that if using LBL approach, doing F2L is not such a big problem(for a beginner). It is usually in the top layer, a starter would get stuck?(At least that is the case with my friend, who is trying to figure out a way by himself).

Last layer is the biggest problem for beginner! so long algs, they are scared of messing all up again and other stuff... Especially if they get cross...and they got just corner swap left

I dont know... Im doing like Ville Seppänen did...
Using now just OP3 until I go for free style...
Anyway Im happy now cause I can do blind solve!

PS:Good Luck with your BLD's..So,how much time do you practice BLD now?Seeing that even you could not do first BLD solve sub-10 minutes,I have pretty much given all hopes of achieving sub-10 the first time...(Have read somewhere that Tyson Mao did his first BLD in 6.4 mins or so).

Godly timed first solve wasn´t my goal...ppl can do sub 4min first solve also if the just want to...they just practice until they are sure about it and then it is time for first solve!!!

My goal was fast first solve! It was in 5hours after I started BLD training

Now Im practicing just 2-3blind solves in a day... reasons for it can be found in this forum: school, "talent", exam week, my brother, and so on...
When next week turns I will train just BLD solve 4h+ in a day...It will be my only way to get sub 3min in 3 weeks...

How about u? Are u BLD solver?

 

[ManuK]

No.Have put it on wait.I had watched Badmephisto's video, understood a lot from it,after learning the PLL's.But,found the corners memo a bit confusing.(maybe time consuming is a better word). Thinking of going with either numbers or letters for edges. Will probably do M2 + Classis Pochmann for corners.Yet to study the M2..

Why did u take so long(5 hrs) to learn the BLD? .Is 3OP that hard? So,would M2 be harder? I had thought that I'll be able to learn M2 in like 1hr max.

PS:By visual memo,does it mean that one doesn't use any memorising system(like mnemonics,letter representation,numbers) and is just able to visually remember and execute?. Is that the way to achieve sub-20s memo, or is it possible using the alternative methods(of memorising)?

 

[Cyber]

Why did u take so long(5 hrs) to learn the BLD? .Is 3OP that hard? So,would M2 be harder? I had thought that I'll be able to learn M2 in like 1hr max.

Maye I learned the style in 30min but some exact stuff need to be learned still...
I wanted to do some "eyes open solves" before starting blind and also It takes me while get used to for numbers. In 3 days I let those numbers... It is not hard at all... ^^ I was just thinking: "It is hard", and that´s why I wanted to practice 4hours before first solve. It was waist of time xD

PS:By visual memo,does it mean that one doesn't use any memorising system(like mnemonics,letter representation,numbers) and is just able to visually remember and execute?. Is that the way to achieve sub-20s memo, or is it possible using the alternative methods(of memorising)?

Yeah that´s right! No numbers, stories, letters or anything else. Mostly just remembering the position of each piece! It is the my thing!
Sub 20 memo is possible to reach using any memo method u like...not only visual memo!

 

[AvarageCuber]

I just readed first page first time and I saw this...

I'm not there yet, but I think going from 36 seconds to 26 seconds in a month is pretty unrealistic...

Unrealistic?
Yeah

Too hard for Cyber?
No

Just a little notice... xD

 

[Cyber]

I just readed first page first time and I saw this...

I'm not there yet, but I think going from 36 seconds to 26 seconds in a month is pretty unrealistic...

Unrealistic?
Yeah

Too hard for Cyber?
No

Just a little notice... xD

That was something over appreciate!
Im only sub 14min BLD solve without paper!
Just wait for next week...

 

[brunson]

Oh this is all that I can mention which helps me: TOP 10
1.Im devout cuber(practicing a lot)...
2.Im addicted...
3.Im logical person(it may help me)...
4.Im kinda talented(I solved cube in 1 hour after I get it. without guide)...
5.Im kinda problem solver...
6.I dont give up until I reach my goals...
7.Ambitious...
8.I want to do thing in my own way always!!!
9.Good visual memo in everything...
10.Maybe some luck...

You should invest 1/100th the amount of effort into spelling, grammar and punctuation. People may take you more seriously outside the cubing world if you do.