ravenguild08
Member
//instant edit
I hope some of my questions won't come off as inane. I did use the search bar liberally. I have good algs for my finger tricks, practice them a ton, do my F2L reasonably slowly, try to do the cross blindfolded, and do by best to avoid the common pitfalls. My point with mentioning my good OH is that I feel I _should_ be faster than I am now but am growing increasingly frustrated from not knowing why. kthx
//edit
Following advice, I'm starting a thread here regarding myself. It's sort of a generic how-to-get better thread, but I feel I'm sort of an exceptional case. I'm nearly sub20 with two hands. However, my OH average is currently 25.1x (of ~1000 solves). Really! Even though I have tried to push down my two-handed time, I can't figure out why I can't improve.
Thus, I'm looking for some advice. Troubleshooting, so to speak. Where can my problems come from if they only manifest themselves in TH? (Of course TH isn't really a term, but I'll use it liberally here.) And, equivalently, what should I look to improve? Any feedback would be greatly appreciated. A list of facts about my cubing and speculation on where I'm going wrong follows:
I started cubing/speedcubing in 2007 when I taught myself intuitive F2L (back when I didn't know what it was) and compiled my own list of sort of crappy OLL and PLL algs (when speedy lists were uncommon) and learned them all. In 2008, I was at 20.xx TH and 31.xx OH, but after coming to college, I stopped for two years. Recently, I have resumed and, realizing that I favored OH so much more, I focused on it.
I do OH with my right hand. I am right-handed, so I do the normal left-holding scheme in TH. This is mostly because my right hand is absurdly stronger than my left. I can OH with my left, but I just can't do the triggers and pushes as well. Lots of drops happen as well.
It follows that, yes, I have mirrored all of my algorithms. Actually, I know a lot exclusively for OH that I have relative difficulty executing efficiently in TH. I know a lot of algs: the primarily OH ones, reflected everythings, and unreflected everythings too. It's maybe like 35 PLLs and 95 OLLs counting significantly different executions of algs separately.
I believe my splits for OH end up around C: 3.5; F: 11, O: 5; P: 6. My std is relatively small, mostly contingent on easy/difficult crosses and locks in the LL; solves over 30 are uncommon.
My splits for TH might be C+F: 11; O: 4; P: 5. Bad solves are really, really common when I screw up the cross or F2L.
I do white/yellow cross, intuitive F2L with a few special algs, 2-look LL.
I learned everything on a 2007 Rubik's DIY, recently have been using a Maru DIY, and recently obtained a GuHong. I can solve big cubes, do 3x3 BLD, have tried the Petrus method (Fridrich works better for me), and am proficient with cube theory and thus can teach beginners fairly well.
So where might I be going wrong?
Firstly, which part of my TH split looks the worst? LL or F2L? What splits should I be aiming for?
Lack of finger tricks: I have few. Mostly all my left hand does is hang out and do U' when needed. In fact, most of my finger tricks were index finger combos... (As an aside, I vaguely remember that this is Hardwick's influence.)
I see my left hand thumb is at about the 7 o'clock position on the front face. Is that okay, or should I aim for like 8:30? I have a feeling that this is bad posture. I've sort of tried changing it to enable D with a ring-finger.
I've had trouble doing ambidextrous F2L, so I fill in left side pairs by doing z then inserting. (Note how this is standard procedure in OH) That is inadvisable, right?
How much should I try using right index pushes for counter-clockwise turns? Heck, what finger tricks are possible that I should aim to incorporate?
Cross: Because OH is limited to so few turn executions, I'm accustomed to forming my cross on top. Additionally, I'm not really sure why, but I have a stupidly high failure rate in forming the cross; lots of the time I switch two opposite edges. I also have (what I think is) a bad habit of keeping track of the edges as they move around the cube, thus making looking ahead hard. I also have trouble tracking the centers to line up in the end. That all being said, I can usually see the <8turn solution with ease. Now I'm working on solving it with the cross on D, but ring finger D/D' triggers and u/u' triggers are not coming easily.
How do I improve the cross? Practice resolving it with eyes closed? Or just focus on the looking ahead via corner-tracking or something?
F2L: I can look ahead okay, but once I try to up my turn speed, I can't anymore. (Note how this doesn't come into play in OH where turn speed is the limiting factor.) How do you move faster while still managing to look ahead? Talent?
LL: I know my algs and I'm relearning new ones now, but how do you make them faster? Sure, practice, but that can't be it. Try as I might, I can't even get Uperms under like 2.5. The worst ones, F and E (not the Hessler E) I can't get under 4.5. WHYYYYYY.
Is it a matter of turn speed? How do you up your turn speed, anyway? Turn your wrist faster and push with more ferocity? I just lock when I try that.
I'm under the impression that I memorize algs by their turn compositions instead of strictly hand movements, i.e. I do the first three moves for those two Gperms on L or R, do Jperms from two directions. Bad?
If bad, how do you account for AUF? Several of my algs (Y, 2 Gs, E, 2 Ns, 1 R) don't end up with U on top anymore. Also, I rely a lot on lining up the significant blocks for faster recognition, so most of the time I just do y, y', or y2 for AUF. How in the world do those of you with color-neutral solves do it?!
That is enough from me. Let me know if additional info would be helpful for suggestions. Even if advice isn't your thing, I hope my case was an interesting read. Yay, thanks.
//edit 11/19/10
For the curious, I've timed my PLLs (and recorded my current algs for good measure).
2H PLLs 11/19/10 averages of 12
OH PLLs 11/19/10 averages of 12
//edit
I hope some of my questions won't come off as inane. I did use the search bar liberally. I have good algs for my finger tricks, practice them a ton, do my F2L reasonably slowly, try to do the cross blindfolded, and do by best to avoid the common pitfalls. My point with mentioning my good OH is that I feel I _should_ be faster than I am now but am growing increasingly frustrated from not knowing why. kthx
//edit
Following advice, I'm starting a thread here regarding myself. It's sort of a generic how-to-get better thread, but I feel I'm sort of an exceptional case. I'm nearly sub20 with two hands. However, my OH average is currently 25.1x (of ~1000 solves). Really! Even though I have tried to push down my two-handed time, I can't figure out why I can't improve.
Thus, I'm looking for some advice. Troubleshooting, so to speak. Where can my problems come from if they only manifest themselves in TH? (Of course TH isn't really a term, but I'll use it liberally here.) And, equivalently, what should I look to improve? Any feedback would be greatly appreciated. A list of facts about my cubing and speculation on where I'm going wrong follows:
I started cubing/speedcubing in 2007 when I taught myself intuitive F2L (back when I didn't know what it was) and compiled my own list of sort of crappy OLL and PLL algs (when speedy lists were uncommon) and learned them all. In 2008, I was at 20.xx TH and 31.xx OH, but after coming to college, I stopped for two years. Recently, I have resumed and, realizing that I favored OH so much more, I focused on it.
I do OH with my right hand. I am right-handed, so I do the normal left-holding scheme in TH. This is mostly because my right hand is absurdly stronger than my left. I can OH with my left, but I just can't do the triggers and pushes as well. Lots of drops happen as well.
It follows that, yes, I have mirrored all of my algorithms. Actually, I know a lot exclusively for OH that I have relative difficulty executing efficiently in TH. I know a lot of algs: the primarily OH ones, reflected everythings, and unreflected everythings too. It's maybe like 35 PLLs and 95 OLLs counting significantly different executions of algs separately.
I believe my splits for OH end up around C: 3.5; F: 11, O: 5; P: 6. My std is relatively small, mostly contingent on easy/difficult crosses and locks in the LL; solves over 30 are uncommon.
My splits for TH might be C+F: 11; O: 4; P: 5. Bad solves are really, really common when I screw up the cross or F2L.
I do white/yellow cross, intuitive F2L with a few special algs, 2-look LL.
I learned everything on a 2007 Rubik's DIY, recently have been using a Maru DIY, and recently obtained a GuHong. I can solve big cubes, do 3x3 BLD, have tried the Petrus method (Fridrich works better for me), and am proficient with cube theory and thus can teach beginners fairly well.
So where might I be going wrong?
Firstly, which part of my TH split looks the worst? LL or F2L? What splits should I be aiming for?
Lack of finger tricks: I have few. Mostly all my left hand does is hang out and do U' when needed. In fact, most of my finger tricks were index finger combos... (As an aside, I vaguely remember that this is Hardwick's influence.)
I see my left hand thumb is at about the 7 o'clock position on the front face. Is that okay, or should I aim for like 8:30? I have a feeling that this is bad posture. I've sort of tried changing it to enable D with a ring-finger.
I've had trouble doing ambidextrous F2L, so I fill in left side pairs by doing z then inserting. (Note how this is standard procedure in OH) That is inadvisable, right?
How much should I try using right index pushes for counter-clockwise turns? Heck, what finger tricks are possible that I should aim to incorporate?
Cross: Because OH is limited to so few turn executions, I'm accustomed to forming my cross on top. Additionally, I'm not really sure why, but I have a stupidly high failure rate in forming the cross; lots of the time I switch two opposite edges. I also have (what I think is) a bad habit of keeping track of the edges as they move around the cube, thus making looking ahead hard. I also have trouble tracking the centers to line up in the end. That all being said, I can usually see the <8turn solution with ease. Now I'm working on solving it with the cross on D, but ring finger D/D' triggers and u/u' triggers are not coming easily.
How do I improve the cross? Practice resolving it with eyes closed? Or just focus on the looking ahead via corner-tracking or something?
F2L: I can look ahead okay, but once I try to up my turn speed, I can't anymore. (Note how this doesn't come into play in OH where turn speed is the limiting factor.) How do you move faster while still managing to look ahead? Talent?
LL: I know my algs and I'm relearning new ones now, but how do you make them faster? Sure, practice, but that can't be it. Try as I might, I can't even get Uperms under like 2.5. The worst ones, F and E (not the Hessler E) I can't get under 4.5. WHYYYYYY.
Is it a matter of turn speed? How do you up your turn speed, anyway? Turn your wrist faster and push with more ferocity? I just lock when I try that.
I'm under the impression that I memorize algs by their turn compositions instead of strictly hand movements, i.e. I do the first three moves for those two Gperms on L or R, do Jperms from two directions. Bad?
If bad, how do you account for AUF? Several of my algs (Y, 2 Gs, E, 2 Ns, 1 R) don't end up with U on top anymore. Also, I rely a lot on lining up the significant blocks for faster recognition, so most of the time I just do y, y', or y2 for AUF. How in the world do those of you with color-neutral solves do it?!
That is enough from me. Let me know if additional info would be helpful for suggestions. Even if advice isn't your thing, I hope my case was an interesting read. Yay, thanks.
//edit 11/19/10
For the curious, I've timed my PLLs (and recorded my current algs for good measure).
2H PLLs 11/19/10 averages of 12
starting with ideal hand positioning, no AUF, starting/stopping timer by dropping hands on keyboard,
parens breaks correspond to regrips of either hand, i.e. releasing of thumb+mid/ring grip
Ua: 2.30 (R2 U' R' U' R U R) (U R U' R) --
Ub: 2.20 (R' U R' U' R' U') (R' U R) (U R2) --
Z: 3.02 (R' U' R U' R) (U R U' R' U R) (U R2 U' R') --
H: 2.28 (M2' U' M2' U2 M2' U' M2') -- right ring+pinky trigger
Aa: 2.37 x (R' U R') (D2' R U' R' D2' R2) -- right ring+pinky trigger
Ab: 2.55 x (R2 D2' R U R' D2' R U' R) -- right ring+pinky trigger; left index push for U
E: 2.87 x (U R' U') (L U R U' r2' U' R U) (L U' R' U) -- old; right hand drag on final U
Ja: 2.30 (R U' r' F l') z (R2 U R' U') (R2 U) -- weird notation for ordinary alg
Jb: 2.49 x' (R' F r U' R) z (R2 U' R U R2 U') --
Na: 3.59 (R U' L U2 R') (U L') (R U' L U2 R') (U L') -- being replaced right now
Nb: 3.62 z (D' R U') (R2 D R' U D' R U') (R2 D R' U) -- new; ring triggers for D/D'
Ra: 3.05 (R U2' R' U2 R B') (R' U' R U R B R2') -- thumb push on B'
Rb: 2.99 (R' U2 R U2') (R' F R U R' U') (R' F' R2) -- thumb pull on F'
T: 2.29 (R U R' U' R' F R2 U' R' U' R) (U R' F') --
F: 3.45 (R' U2 R' U') y (R' F' R2 U' R' U R' F R U') F -- thumb pull on F'
Y: 2.42 (R2 U' R' U R U') x'z' (L' U' R U' R' U' r B) -- no right regrip at transition; thumb on that U'
V: 2.77 (R' U R' U') y (R' F' R2 U' R' U R' F) (R F) -- left thumb pull on last F
Ga: 2.62 (R2 u) (R' U R' U' R u' R2) y' (R' U R) --
Gb: 2.58 (R' U' R) y (R2 u R' U) (R U' R u' R2') -- right hand drag on U; thumb on U'
Gc: 2.87 (R2' u' R U' R U R') (u R2) y (R U' R') --
Gd: 3.05 (R U R') y' (R2 u') (R U' R' U R') (u R2) --
parens breaks correspond to regrips of either hand, i.e. releasing of thumb+mid/ring grip
Ua: 2.30 (R2 U' R' U' R U R) (U R U' R) --
Ub: 2.20 (R' U R' U' R' U') (R' U R) (U R2) --
Z: 3.02 (R' U' R U' R) (U R U' R' U R) (U R2 U' R') --
H: 2.28 (M2' U' M2' U2 M2' U' M2') -- right ring+pinky trigger
Aa: 2.37 x (R' U R') (D2' R U' R' D2' R2) -- right ring+pinky trigger
Ab: 2.55 x (R2 D2' R U R' D2' R U' R) -- right ring+pinky trigger; left index push for U
E: 2.87 x (U R' U') (L U R U' r2' U' R U) (L U' R' U) -- old; right hand drag on final U
Ja: 2.30 (R U' r' F l') z (R2 U R' U') (R2 U) -- weird notation for ordinary alg
Jb: 2.49 x' (R' F r U' R) z (R2 U' R U R2 U') --
Na: 3.59 (R U' L U2 R') (U L') (R U' L U2 R') (U L') -- being replaced right now
Nb: 3.62 z (D' R U') (R2 D R' U D' R U') (R2 D R' U) -- new; ring triggers for D/D'
Ra: 3.05 (R U2' R' U2 R B') (R' U' R U R B R2') -- thumb push on B'
Rb: 2.99 (R' U2 R U2') (R' F R U R' U') (R' F' R2) -- thumb pull on F'
T: 2.29 (R U R' U' R' F R2 U' R' U' R) (U R' F') --
F: 3.45 (R' U2 R' U') y (R' F' R2 U' R' U R' F R U') F -- thumb pull on F'
Y: 2.42 (R2 U' R' U R U') x'z' (L' U' R U' R' U' r B) -- no right regrip at transition; thumb on that U'
V: 2.77 (R' U R' U') y (R' F' R2 U' R' U R' F) (R F) -- left thumb pull on last F
Ga: 2.62 (R2 u) (R' U R' U' R u' R2) y' (R' U R) --
Gb: 2.58 (R' U' R) y (R2 u R' U) (R U' R u' R2') -- right hand drag on U; thumb on U'
Gc: 2.87 (R2' u' R U' R U R') (u R2) y (R U' R') --
Gd: 3.05 (R U R') y' (R2 u') (R U' R' U R') (u R2) --
OH PLLs 11/19/10 averages of 12
starting with cube in hand, no AUF, starting/stopping timer with other hand
parens indicate exceptions where U / L aren't being turned by index / ring/pinky respectively
UU indicate double index trigger. U2 indicates index+middle trigger
Ua: 2.44 z' U L' U L U L U L' U' L' U2 --
Ub: 2.47 L' U L' U' L' U' L' U L U L2' --
Z: 3.72 L U L' U L' U' L' U (L U') L' U' L2' U L --
H: 3.68 z' UU L2' U L2' UU L2' UU L2' U L2' U2 --
Aa: 3.01 x UU L2' z' L' (U' L) D2' L' U L' --
Ab: 3.13 x L2' UU z U (L U') R2 U L' U --
E: 4.57 x' U L' U L' z L' U l' xz L' U L' U' L' D' L U L' --
Ja: 2.81 z' (D L') (U' L) D' L2' U L' U' L2' U --
Jb: 2.98 z' (U' L) (D L') U L2' z L' U L U2 L' --
Na: 3.74 z' (D L') U L2' (D' L D') U' L' U L2' z L' U l' --
Nb: 3.99 z' (U' L) D' L2' U L' U' (D L D') L2' U L' u --
Ra: 4.15 z' U L' U' L' U L U (R U') L' U l' xz L' U2 L' --
Rb: 3.60 L' U L U L' U' L' (D' L) U L' u z'x' U L2' U --
T: 4.21 L' U' L U L2' (D' L) U L U L' U' z UU (L U') --
F: 4.78 z' (U' L) U L' U2 x'z L' U' L U x U (L U') L' U2 --
Y: 3.69 L2' U L U L' U x- U z U L' U L U R' U' --
V: 4.18 z' U L' U L x U z' (U' L) U L2 x' U L U' L' U' --
Ga: 3.45 L2' u L' U L' (U' L) D' x' UU l' U l --
Gb: 4.41 L' (U' L) z'x UU l (U' L) U L' U l' U2 --
Gc: 3.44 z' U2 l' U L' U (L U') R y' L2' u L' u' --
Gd: 3.90 L U L' y' L2' u' (L U') L' U L' u L2' --
Convert to right hand algs here if you'd like.
parens indicate exceptions where U / L aren't being turned by index / ring/pinky respectively
UU indicate double index trigger. U2 indicates index+middle trigger
Ua: 2.44 z' U L' U L U L U L' U' L' U2 --
Ub: 2.47 L' U L' U' L' U' L' U L U L2' --
Z: 3.72 L U L' U L' U' L' U (L U') L' U' L2' U L --
H: 3.68 z' UU L2' U L2' UU L2' UU L2' U L2' U2 --
Aa: 3.01 x UU L2' z' L' (U' L) D2' L' U L' --
Ab: 3.13 x L2' UU z U (L U') R2 U L' U --
E: 4.57 x' U L' U L' z L' U l' xz L' U L' U' L' D' L U L' --
Ja: 2.81 z' (D L') (U' L) D' L2' U L' U' L2' U --
Jb: 2.98 z' (U' L) (D L') U L2' z L' U L U2 L' --
Na: 3.74 z' (D L') U L2' (D' L D') U' L' U L2' z L' U l' --
Nb: 3.99 z' (U' L) D' L2' U L' U' (D L D') L2' U L' u --
Ra: 4.15 z' U L' U' L' U L U (R U') L' U l' xz L' U2 L' --
Rb: 3.60 L' U L U L' U' L' (D' L) U L' u z'x' U L2' U --
T: 4.21 L' U' L U L2' (D' L) U L U L' U' z UU (L U') --
F: 4.78 z' (U' L) U L' U2 x'z L' U' L U x U (L U') L' U2 --
Y: 3.69 L2' U L U L' U x- U z U L' U L U R' U' --
V: 4.18 z' U L' U L x U z' (U' L) U L2 x' U L U' L' U' --
Ga: 3.45 L2' u L' U L' (U' L) D' x' UU l' U l --
Gb: 4.41 L' (U' L) z'x UU l (U' L) U L' U l' U2 --
Gc: 3.44 z' U2 l' U L' U (L U') R y' L2' u L' u' --
Gd: 3.90 L U L' y' L2' u' (L U') L' U L' u L2' --
Convert to right hand algs here if you'd like.
//edit
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