[Help Thread] FTO Discussion and Help

[stoic]

The new Diansheng looks really great, and it seems pretty reasonably priced. I'll almost certainly get one.
With all the momentum behind FTO (whatever happened to CTO by the way?!), I've been inspired to dig out my old Lanlan. It's still a nice puzzle, but it definitely turns like a 10-year old model!
I solve FTO like I solve pyra and skewb. That is to say, I've no real interest in being fast so I know maybe two algs (+ mirrors/inverses) for them both and that does me. For FTO I know literally one. Having said that, I've watched the walkthroughs above a couple of times - thanks @Chris Choi! - and if someone posted a decent up-to-date tutorial I would watch it with interest as there's clearly some solid method development going on.
Anyway, for what it's worth here's how I slowsolve FTO with one alg:

1. Solve corners intuitively.
2. Solve centres (triangles) with setup to (R U R' U)2. I tend to hold the puzzle with a vertex at bottom so with Ben's notation per above this alg would equate to (R B R' B)2 and it rotates three centres and three edges clockwise on B (=my U).
3. Solve edges with the same alg. No setups as they dislodge centres!

 

[Chris Choi]

I just became a silver solver as of yesterday

To be silver means you have achieved a top 25% of the bronze results in every time format, sub 16 for single, sub 20.5 for ao5, sub 21 for ao12, and sub 23.5 for ao100. It took me 25 days of grinding since I got the diansheng, but damn was it a lot more work than i thought. crazy how people got these same times so long ago without the diansheng or even rextos. very proud of my results

 

[Cubist-Guitar]

What is the best way to lube the Diansheng FTO? I’ve heard Dignitas and Gravitas used a lot, as well as other heavy lubes, but I don’t know if I’m missing something

 

[PapaSmurf]

With lubing puzzles generally, just use whatever you find best as long as the base is silicone. I use Traxxas 50k (the same bottle I got about 7 years ago, although admittedly I haven't lubed a lot of puzzles in the past 4 years) because it works. Whatever you do, it should probably be OK if you like it.

 

[erictom333]

(which leaves 1 remaining, the icosahedron)

Hopefully someone can make a Radiolarian that actually turns.

 

[Puzzle Maniac]

 

[Cubist-Guitar]

I am having a problem with the color scheme of the Diansheng. Rn, I can past the first two triples pretty easily, and after that the second center (I do orange) but after that, I am unsure of what color centers to start doing, since Ben’s guide has a color scheme I am unused to, and the written guide is even worse when it comes to color. I’m stuck, and don’t know what to do now

 

[Enirolf]

I am having a problem with the color scheme of the Diansheng. Rn, I can past the first two triples pretty easily, and after that the second center (I do orange) but after that, I am unsure of what color centers to start doing, since Ben’s guide has a color scheme I am unused to, and the written guide is even worse when it comes to color. I’m stuck, and don’t know what to do now

I started learning fto on the diansheng too, with the same tutorial. I also did orange for second center and then did green, which also formed the grey center

 

[Cubist-Guitar]

I started learning fto on the diansheng too, with the same tutorial. I also did orange for second center and then did green, which also formed the grey center

Thank you! I’ll watch the tutorial again with that mindset of what to do, and I’ll definitely know what to do now!

 

[xyzzy]

I am having a problem with the color scheme of the Diansheng. Rn, I can past the first two triples pretty easily, and after that the second center (I do orange) but after that, I am unsure of what color centers to start doing, since Ben’s guide has a color scheme I am unused to, and the written guide is even worse when it comes to color. I’m stuck, and don’t know what to do now

Twizzle (currently) defaults to the Diansheng colour scheme (it used to be Lanlan), so you can use that as a reference if necessary.

 Twizzle link 

 

[fes_77]

Twizzle (currently) defaults to the Diansheng colour scheme (it used to be Lanlan), so you can use that as a reference if necessary.

 Twizzle link 

Is it jst me or is this the lanlan scheme

 

[xyzzy]

Is it jst me or is this the lanlan scheme
View attachment 33101

I am now confused. That is indeed Lanlan.

If I load it on the Twizzle Editor website, it's the Diansheng scheme for the 3D view and Lanlan scheme for the 2D view (… why).

I think when I first posted it here, the embed used Diansheng, but now I'm seeing Lanlan on the embed too.

 

[CaptainK]

I am having a problem with the color scheme of the Diansheng. Rn, I can past the first two triples pretty easily, and after that the second center (I do orange) but after that, I am unsure of what color centers to start doing, since Ben’s guide has a color scheme I am unused to, and the written guide is even worse when it comes to color. I’m stuck, and don’t know what to do now

Think about which colors mix together. If you started with the white face, then the centers to build (after inserting two triples) are the colors that mix with white.

I believe only red and green are swapped between the LanLan and Diansheng FTOs. So Ben's beginner tutorial does orange grey red centers on the Lanlan, but should be orange grey green on the Diansheng.

 

[Puzzle Maniac]

I am now confused. That is indeed Lanlan.

If I load it on the Twizzle Editor website, it's the Diansheng scheme for the 3D view and Lanlan scheme for the 2D view (… why).

I think when I first posted it here, the embed used Diansheng, but now I'm seeing Lanlan on the embed too.

Twizzle dev(s) are probably trying to find which colour scheme works best. Although I don't know why they would update it rather than trying the colour schemes without updating the website

 

[Lucas Garron]

I am now confused. That is indeed Lanlan.

If I load it on the Twizzle Editor website, it's the Diansheng scheme for the 3D view and Lanlan scheme for the 2D view (… why).

I think when I first posted it here, the embed used Diansheng, but now I'm seeing Lanlan on the embed too.

I updated the color scheme to match the FTO Discord vote a few weeks back, but that didn't automatically update the 2D view or the code on speedsolving.com. I've updated both now, thanks for noticing!

 

[Bingus Ringus McDingus]

As someone who is getting the Dianshwng FTO soon, would it be wise to swap the caps for red and green? It may make tutorials easier.

 

[Cubist-Guitar]

As someone who is getting the Dianshwng FTO soon, would it be wise to swap the caps for red and green? It may make tutorials easier.

Not really. Basically all FTO content from here on out will be on the unloaded Diansheng, and the only really good tutorial for FTO not made by @Chris Choi with the Diansheng has a completely different color scheme from the typical LanLan scheme

 

[CaptainK]

As someone who is getting the Dianshwng FTO soon, would it be wise to swap the caps for red and green? It may make tutorials easier.

In the short term it may be easier, but in the long term I think Diansheng's color scheme will become the new standard as Cubist-Guitar suggested.

I also think the Diansheng color scheme makes more sense than the LanLan. On the Diansheng FTO, yellow is opposite white, blue is opposite green, red is opposite orange, and purple is opposite grey.

If you hold the white face in your left hand and rotate x', the sequence of centers is Blue - Orange - Purple - Green - Red - Grey. It's like the standard 3x3 color scheme with purple and grey added.

It will probably take time getting used to the color scheme, just like when learning 4x4. But there's a very important property of FTO that simplifies things. There's two separate groups of colors:

• White Green Orange Grey mix together
• Yellow Blue Red Purple mix together

I like to think of them as the light group and dark group, though the pieces don't actually contrast like half-bright stickers would. But it means the sequence of centers above is dark - light - dark - light - dark - light.

That's how I've memorized the color scheme, it may not completely make sense, but I hope it helps!

 

[ppugliesi]

What do you all think are the merits of color neutrality in FTO? I premise this post by stating that I'm an almost complete beginner to FTO (averaging 80 seconds).

I usually start with white, coming from my experience with 3x3, but, being dual color neutral with yellow, I find that solving the yellow center first (Bencisco method) is usually not a direct translation to dual color neutrality in other events. That is, of course, because white and yellow are in different orbits. As such, I've experimented and found that a more direct equivalent to color neutrality is being able to start solving with any of the colours in a given orbit (on the Diansheng FTO, this means being able to start either with white, green, orange or grey/brown, or with yellow, blue, purple or red).

Given that, what is the current stance on color neutrality? Is it necessary or even desirable? Or is starting with any of the four colours of a given orbit enough? Or even starting a single, fixed colour as first center?

 

[PapaSmurf]

I'm fully CN. It's good because it allows you to have many options for a good start. Often I can see first centre plus a triple quite easily, when on white it's not obvious/there is no good solution. The only thing I have to remember which colour is on D for LBT, but that is a skill issue. I don't see why not. It's easier than CN on 3x3 for sure.