Fridrich with early edges orientation

[Kirjava]

You're forgetting that after EO the movecount of F2L is increased.

 

[Pyjam]

I'm not. But speed is supposed to be increased.

 

[cyoubx]

Maybe...
1. EO may not be a lot of moves, but it's not necessarily fast for beginners with pseudo-finger tricks
2. F2L is definitely faster without a three-gen stipulation.

 

[Kirjava]

So you're getting higher movecount and restrictions on moves you can perform?

If speed was your aim you are doing it wrong.

 

[Pyjam]

Since the beginning I understand why it would not work for everyone, but it would for people who struggle with the F2L and want to practice the easier cases. If you do your F2L in 5 seconds, obviously you don't need that.

OH, I already gained almost 1 minute! You see my level…

 

[Godmil]

I think learning a temporary extra step (which involves more algs that aren't used if you drop this approach) is a bad plan.
However, learning to quickly identify the orientation of edges during the F2L could be really useful in the long run (for cutting down on cube rotations).
So it has good and bad points.

 

[Kirjava]

Since the beginning I understand why it would not work for everyone, but it would for people who struggle with the F2L

I don't think people who struggle with F2L would be very good at EO.

 

[Anonymous]

I don't think people who struggle with F2L would be very good at EO.

I guess you're kind of right. Someone who has experience with F2L but is bad at it will likely not find adding EO into the equation to help them.

On the other hand, the skills needed for each are, obviously, very different, and I for one am reasonably good at EO but horrible at Fridrich F2L. I think it all depends on the person. Not that this addresses the other problems with what's been suggested.

 

[oll+phase+sync]

there are never more than 6 edges to orient

That's not true, there can still be 8 misoriented edges, regardless of cuberotation. (eg pureflip )

But whats about, plannig your cross in a way that just the 4 F2L edges become oriented. That still gives you rotationless F2L and an easier lookahead for partial edge control.

 

[Pyjam]

That's not true, there can still be 8 misoriented edges, regardless of cuberotation. (eg pureflip )

Exact. I saw it yesterday: 8 bad edges: (R2 U R' U' M2' D L' D' r2) y (9 moves)

But whats about, plannig your cross in a way that just the 4 F2L edges become oriented. That still gives you rotationless F2L and an easier lookahead for partial edge control.

It's seems more complicated for only a partial result. I appreciate the first-look OLL skip every time.

You know, most of the time, I see some of the bad edges while finishing the cross, there are often 2 bad edges on a side and 2 on top, I do R2 U R' U' R2 (y) and it's done.

It's really not as hard and slow as some who maybe have never tried are saying, at least for cubers SUP-30.

 

[Cyragia]

Edge Orientation + Fridrich

Hello,
First I'd like to say I've only been cubing for about 2 months, so i'm not that good yet (~40s average).
But while looking through some tutorials I came up with an idea, it's very likely somebody else already came up with it, but I couldn't find anything.
My idea is to orient all edges like in the ZZ method before doing the cross (or during the cross), then you can do F2L without F and B turns and less/no cuberotations.
The OLL is also massively simplified as the cross is already finished so you only need to know 7 out of the 57 OLL algorithms. (the ones used in 2-look OLL)
Is this an improvement over the standard Fridrich method ?
Would it be worth it to put my time into properly learning how to orient all the edges, or would i be better off learning the full 57 OLL algorithms and practice F2L a bit more ?

 

[Username]

This would simply be ZZ with EOCrosses, which are harder to plan than EOLines

 

[etshy]

It's callled ZBLS
lots of algs , You should definitely work on your F2l and Plls and Olls before even considering this

 

[TheNextFeliks]

No eo cross. Zz or not.

 

[kcl]

It's callled ZBLS
lots of algs , You should definitely work on your F2l and Plls and Olls before even considering this

Nono VHF2L all the way.

 

[mark49152]

It's callled ZBLS
lots of algs , You should definitely work on your F2l and Plls and Olls before even considering this

That's something different.

 

[etshy]

That's something different.

could you mention the difference between them ?

as far as i know they are the same except vhf2l has less algs because the pair is already matched

 

[Cyragia]

Afaik this isn't the same as ZBLS.
I'm 'my' method you do EO -> Cross (without messing up edge orientation) -> Fridrich slot based F2L (only LRU turns) -> OLL (which is automatically reduced to 1-look / 7 algs) -> PLL (which doesn't change)
So it's completely the same apart from the EO part and the simplified F2L and OLL.

If your averaging sub 40 I would not bother wasting your time learning full oll and pll algs, 4 look is good enough for now. Although it is a good idea I would not worry about F and B moves in your f2l, and just a tip - Don't use B Moves!! They are slow, a rotation is even faster than them (in f2l) practice your fingertricks and try using a thing called Look Ahead.

I wasn't planning on learning 2-look LL yet, I'm just thinking about how things could be simplified/improved. And don't worry, I don't use B moves, but I do use F moves (which are slow for me because I almost always have to do a cube rotation)

This would simply be ZZ with EOCrosses, which are harder to plan than EOLines

Kinda, It also uses Fridrich slot-based F2L instead of block building. and If you're doing EO then Cross it's not that hard.

 

[jayefbe]

Afaik this isn't the same as ZBLS.
I'm 'my' method you do EO -> Cross (without messing up edge orientation) -> Fridrich slot based F2L (only LRU turns) -> OLL (which is automatically reduced to 1-look / 7 algs) -> PLL (which doesn't change)
So it's completely the same apart from the EO part and the simplified F2L and OLL.



I wasn't planning on learning 2-look LL yet, I'm just thinking about how things could be simplified/improved. And don't worry, I don't use B moves, but I do use F moves (which are slow for me because I almost always have to do a cube rotation)


Kinda, It also uses Fridrich slot-based F2L instead of block building. and If you're doing EO then Cross it's not that hard.

The problem with your method (which really is just eocross instead of eoline) is that you're losing a large part of the major benefits that come from using ZZ. Blockbuilding is way more efficient than using an F2L style of edge-corner pairing and insertion (F2L really is just a simplified and highly constrained "blockbuilding"). If you're going to go to all the trouble of orienting your edges, why negate some of that advantage by using an inefficient blockbuilding system?

 

[Noahaha]

This is not a new thing, just a worse version of an old thing. Feel free to defend it as much as you want, but don't try to pass it off as a new method or your own method. Kinda reminds me of the guy who made "his own method" which was just CFOP with beginner's method LL. This is obviously not as bad though.