Proposal: Add 15 Puzzle as an official event

[Petro Leum]

i don't even know what it is. did i miss something or are you maybe wrong about it's popularity?

 

[kcl]

I see both arguments, but I don't have an issue with it becoming official. While it may not be a Rubik's puzzle or be especially interesting to watch, I'm not gonna lie, it's pretty boring to watch clock Imo. This would be no different.

 

[AvGalen]

Not for me because of 9a as others have said.
If you go down that road, there are lots of other puzzles which aren't twisty that might be fun to speedsolve; they just don't seem to have much to do with the WCA imo

Refering to 9a doesn't make much sense. 9b prevents any new event. When skewb was added 9b had to be adjusted. If 15 puzzle would be added both 9b and 9a have to be adjusted

 

[TMOY]

I agree, it's juste another case of circular reasoning: "rules must be that way because rules are that way". Refering to 9a is fine, but only if you explain why you think 9a should stay as it is.

 

[SolveThatCube]

It's not a twisty puzzle, shouldn't be added.

 

[stoic]

9a is fine by me; it's consistent with the WCA's mission.
(And if that's circular reasoning, I demand speed crossword puzzling at WCA events and request amendment of all regulations that prevent it)

 

[tseitsei]

Yeah basically this thread is somewhat like saying: I and many other people like football so WCA should start holding football as official event.

Refering to 9a doesn't make much sense. 9b prevents any new event. When skewb was added 9b had to be adjusted. If 15 puzzle would be added both 9b and 9a have to be adjusted

I find 9a to be kind of the definition of whole WCA. So changing that would be like changing the whole thing that WCA is trying to do. And if we do that we could as well add anything as a WCA event...

 

[Antonie faz fan]

I don't agree with it being added. Because the WCA is about Rubik's Cubes. I really don't want Clock to be an official event either.

However, it would be cool if this were to get added. Maybe add the 8 puzzle to.

A problem with this is that an 8 puzzle needs a computer to run, and if they use a physical puzzle it's harder, but it will work.

Overall, I don't think, and hope it won't get added, but if it does, half of me is happy, no need to cry

Wca is about twisty puzzles not rubiks cubes, if it where than only 3x3 would be a official event.

 

[cubizh]

No.

Practicality

SCRAMBLING:

When scrambling, a set "state" should be set out on the program to be "solved", considering the cube to be scrambled.

No reference regarding notation?

Consistency

The 15 puzzle is obviously consistent with the theme, spirit, goal, and mission of the WCA.

--It is stated that the mission does govern all puzzles labeled "twisty", but the Rubik's Clock doesn't fit that criteria. [With the exception of it being labeled as a Rubik's Puzzle.]

It's not consistent with the theme at all.
The only thing in common is you can scramble it and then the challange is to put it back in the original solved state as fast as possible.
But the same would apply to sorting a deck of cards, or my sock drawer.
Even the clock *is* a twisty puzzle, by the definition of 'twisty' that applies to puzzles: "to alter in shape, as by turning the ends in opposite directions, so that parts previously in the same straight line and plane are located in a spiral curve".

Fun to watch

Considering the count on some of Ben's videos, they look really fun to watch and it is pretty cool to see most of the solutions.

I don't understand this.
Is the purpose of this proposal to have a computer based 15 puzzle?
I have looked at all Ben's videos, and he only seems to be solving virtual 15 puzzles.
Even though these may be cool to watch, it lacks some of the physical idea of the actual process of moving a piece.
I'm not so sure someone physically solving a 15 puzzle is appealing. You can't really see anything but the back of the puzzle if it's not laying on the table, or if you're behind the competitor.

Brand of puzzles

There are two types of 15 puzzles, plastic, and metal, and both are really good after some wear in time.

Sorry, but this is simply not true.
Physical versions of the 15 puzzle exist since the 19th century, and I think one of the most widespread puzzle materials was actually wood.
The only one I currently have is actually made of it:

Spoiler

and there's a lot more types of 15 puzzles out there, in what materials is concerned.
Personally, aside from the plastic, metal and wood, I have seen 15 puzzles made with stranger materials like ivory, and with something that is similar to wax.

But there are more issues.

What exactly *is* and *is not* a 15 puzzle? How do you define it?
What do you consider to be an acceptable puzzle in a supposed competition?
Do the pieces have to be numered? Can it be roman numerals? Letters? Pictures?

Spoiler: What about this?

Spoiler: Would this be a valid solution to it?

Spoiler: How about this one?

How would you go in terms of writing proper regulations for establishing a valid 15 puzzle?
It's not that simple, and I only presented a few examples.

As you see, there are problems that would need to be addressed for this to become a remotely serious proposal.

On a closing remark, I have to say that I like the 15 puzzle.
It's a nice and fast puzzle, that is interesting and straightforward to understand and solve, but I don't think it fits into the WCA set of events at all.

 

[Randomno]

It's a fun puzzle, wouldn't care if it got added to WCA or not.

 

[~Adam~]

I think there are few people who actually want 15 puzzle added but if it was then lots of people would compete in it because it's easy to solve and many people have the attitude of 'If I can solve it I will in competition'.

If the event is added I suspect it will take up quite a lot of time in already hectic schedules.

Also, doesn't have enough in common with other events, not enjoyable to watch because the puzzle is obscured by the competitors hands so much and even though I think the event list is good the way it is I would prefer 2x3x3 or 3x3x4 be added instead.

 

[sneze2r]

I love 15 puzzle but it should'nt be official WCA event. Reason is simple: this is flat puzzle.

Also i see no reason why rubik's clock should remain official(maybe because it contains "rubik's" in it's name?)

 

[MennoniteCuber1]

I say sure, it's fine with me. Except notation would be confusing.

 

[imvelox]

I say sure, it's fine with me. Except notation would be confusing.

Nah, you have only U,R,D,L
Maybe the scrambles should be divided into groups of like 5 moves, like: RULUU-URRUD-LURRD (which is much less confusing than RULUUURRUDLURRD)

 

[qqwref]

Honestly, as much as I have liked solving the puzzle on the sim, I don't really think it would be good for official solving. The puzzles I have played with move very poorly out of the box, it's so much slower than a good sim solve, and it's definitely not a twisty puzzle.

At least we can use random-state scrambling... handscrambles are notoriously awful for sliding puzzles.

 

[maps600]

I voted yes on the poll, but realize now that 15 puzzle wouldn't fit in. All WCA puzzles are 3 dimensional, while the 15 puzzle is 2d (You know what I mean). 15 puzzle isn't a twisty puzzle.

 

[samuelqwe]

I chose yes, i think it would be a nice puzzle to add. Imagine the Moyu 15 Puzzle and having to lubricate it.
But it definitely would be cool to see that.

 

[AlGoreRhythm]

I voted yes. I enjoy 15-puzzle, and really got into it when I had to take a break from cubing. It would also open up cubing to a whole new audience.

I dunno, I think it would be fun. Maybe instead of a stack mat display they could show video of the puzzle being solved.

 

[Kirjava]

At the end, two pieces are misaligned but can be fixed in one 'slide' and since he did not give a definition of a move in his Penalties section, it is slightly ambiguous as to whether this is a +2 or a DNF

Easy, just use one of the two obvious metrics.

 

[elrog]

I have not voted yet.

Personally, I like the 15 puzzle, but it is not a twisty puzzle. I would be fine with letting the WCA govern twisty and sliding puzzles, but then you run into the problem of where to draw the line. Also, I think 9a (Rubik's puzzles) should be gotten rid of. Why should the WCA favor one company over another?

If the 15 puzzle is added, I don't think it should be on a computer simulator. Also, I don't care about if it fun to watch or not, but I'm like that with everything. I like playing sports and cubing but, I don't care for watching either of them.

I voted yes on the poll, but realize now that 15 puzzle wouldn't fit in. All WCA puzzles are 3 dimensional, while the 15 puzzle is 2d (You know what I mean). 15 puzzle isn't a twisty puzzle.

Rather than a 15 puzzle, why not have something like the sliding cube? It isn't speed-able in the video, but if anything is added to the WCA, companies will make speed-able ones, so I can't see that as an argument against it.