ZZ Cubers

Basically, I look at it this way. There is a ZZF2L and Fridrich F2L. I don't care much about last layer since I use OLL+PLL for last layer no matter what method I use(except corner first and Roux). This way we can at least have a better comparison.

For me it takes me around 9-14(or more) seconds to do the F2L with ZZ but I do 5-11 seconds F2L with full Center+4 Slots. For me I think it's not worth it for me to use the ZZ method because the last layer I still use OLL+PLL when it is much more rewarding if you use CLL+EPLL due to the fact that the edges are already orientated thus giving you easier PLL algs(for those who do their edge perms fast). If not, you are wasting precious seconds during the edge orient. But at the same time, you gain it by not regripping even once.

Basically, what I'm saying is, ZZ is a nice method with some flaws if you are not a master in it(like me). Fridrich though is more of a beginner friendly method since you don't have to understand things like "How to confirm that an edge is orientated". That allows people(including me) to get great times even though you're not that great at cubing. Like me I still can't seem to consistently sub-1:10 on 4x4 even though I'm quite fast on 3x3 while some people can get sub-1 on 4x4 when they are a second slower than me.

In conclusion, ZZ is great if you are willing to spend a whole lot of time.
 
True, but still, using cross OLL+PLL is similar to using four look LL for Fridrich. It's fine to make comparisons with it, but the only complete comparison will come with comparing the most attainable advanced method of each.
 
True, but still, using cross OLL+PLL is similar to using four look LL for Fridrich. It's fine to make comparisons with it, but the only complete comparison will come with comparing the most attainable advanced method of each.

I don't think OCLL+PLL is slow at all, maybe a fraction of a second slower than COLL+EPLL, unless you're extremely fast at all the edge permutations and extremely slow at all the other ones. If anything it's like three look LL for Fridrich (two-look OLL + PLL) or maybe CLL+ELL...
 
Well, I want to learn it
But...I can't find a page with "intact" ZZ method
I mean all about it
I don't want to learn half of it....
 
And I think it might faster than Fridrich method as well.
now I want to do is study it more.....
 
Wtv it is, ZZF2L will be kick-ass when blah finishes his LL algs and stuff.

I personally think that edge phasing will end up faster than corner control. Also it means that LL recognition will be faster.

Then it would be just learning CLL algs for LL.

Not if you use CLL you also need an ELL, because phasing is just permuting two opposite edges. You need CLL algs for if you permute all 4 but also the ZZLL algs.
 
Wtv it is, ZZF2L will be kick-ass when blah finishes his LL algs and stuff.

I personally think that edge phasing will end up faster than corner control. Also it means that LL recognition will be faster.

Then it would be just learning CLL algs for LL.

Not if you use CLL you also need an ELL, because phasing is just permuting two opposite edges. You need CLL algs for if you permute all 4 but also the ZZLL algs.

I see. But I gotta agree that edge phasing is easier than corner control. It would take me a lot of time to do corner control.
 
Wtv it is, ZZF2L will be kick-ass when blah finishes his LL algs and stuff.

I personally think that edge phasing will end up faster than corner control. Also it means that LL recognition will be faster.

Then it would be just learning CLL algs for LL.

Not if you use CLL you also need an ELL, because phasing is just permuting two opposite edges. You need CLL algs for if you permute all 4 but also the ZZLL algs.

I see. But I gotta agree that edge phasing is easier than corner control. It would take me a lot of time to do corner control.

Also, edge phasing is far more intuitive than corner control, and easier to recognise, since you are only looking at 2 pieces. But for edge control, theres lots of cases, just look at the winter variation, and reverse it.
 
Ah, this is the thread I'm looking for. Any advice for a new ZZ'er? You know things that will help (like when people start out CFOP, if you tell them to do the cross on the bottom, they do better cause it helps in the long run)
 
Pick a color scheme and stick with it. By color scheme, I don't just mean a bottom face, but a front face as well—since you're looking for misoriented edges, it will be easier to get used to certain colors in certain places as wrong.

I, along with a few others, use blue in front / yellow on top. ZZ himself uses red in front / yellow on top. It's arbitrary, though, so use what you like.

I currently average slightly sub20 with ZZ, and I still only partially preinspect for the edges; I just do orientation. This is probably a bad idea, and I am trying to switch, but it's worked for me so far.

Also, start slowly learning COLL, if that's the variant you choose. I use COLL for everything but the Sune/Antisune cases.
 
Okay This is the method I'm going to use, tell me if its worth it:

EOLine - Average of 7 moves (Intuitive, but hoping for some algs)

ZZF2L w/ Block building -minus one CE pair- Average of 20? moves (not sure how many algs there are)

3-4 moves to insert the last edge. (This is to set up for MGLS)

MGLS- Average of 14? moves, and since edges are always already oriented, I only need 75 algs.

Full PLL- I'll take that this is self explanatory.

Times (very rough guesstimates.):

EOLine: 6 seconds
3 ZZF2L pairs: 11 seconds
Permuting the last edge: 1.5 seconds
MGLS: 3 seconds
PLL: 2.5 seconds
Hopeful final time: 24 seconds

Is it worth it? Anything I messed up, or is missing?

Thanks in advance.
 
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