The Speedsolving.com community trains 5 year old prodigy [emoji3]

wallstreet777 said:
It took him about 2 weeks to master beginners method so I'm thinking about the same to get better with F2L (not master)?
Click to expand...

A couple weeks of just playing around with pairs should give a fair intuitive feel for how things work. If you watch closely using the layer by layer method, any time you insert a corner you're bringing an adjacent edge along with it, and when you insert an edge it brings an adjacent corner. Solving F2L pairs recycles some of those same insert moves you learned in LBL, just with the extra step of making an oriented pair first. That's what makes it such an easy transition and solving 4 pairs is a lot less work than filling 8 individual spots.

When you make it to a competition, I do hope you plan to register as well ;).
 
wallstreet777 said:
This is perfect, thanks!




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Click to expand...

Be careful with this though. For F2L, you really should try to figure it out on your own, or at least understand what and why the alg is doing. In the vast majority of cases, intuitive F2L (figuring it out on your own) is better then algorithmic F2L. Know that you and or your son will get slower when you start doing F2L. This is normal and expected, but will be one of the most operant things in the log run.
 
sqAree said:
I think the reason everyone loves this thread is because we wish we were into cubing as 5-year olds already. :)
Click to expand...

wallstreet777 said:
We are having a great time learning together and as a bonus, I can now solve a Rubik's Cube!
Click to expand...

The reason I find this thread so awesome is that not only do i wish I could've gotten into Cubing at 5, but I'm thrilled that someone's parent is actually involved in their son's Cubing hobby. Kids will come up to me all the time and show an interest in Cubing. I can only show them so much. When I talk to their father, they don't seem supportive. I show the guy where to go to train himself and his son on how to solve the cube, but they just give up and have absolutely no patience. I'm fed up with guys not supporting their kids who are interested in Cubing.

BRAVO ZULU, @wallstreet777 ! You're a good parent. I wish more parents were as involved with their kids' Cubing hobby. I admire you.

Also, I use this guide to CFOP. http://badmephisto.com Remember, the world record was broken with a CFOP-based method.
 
wallstreet777 said:
I will look further into Roux. Any reason why you prefer that method?
Click to expand...
It's more that I don't want him to only know one method.
I actually like the ZZ method more than Roux (and use it), but I think that the Roux method is easier to explain than ZZ, and I try and get people to learn that. The first step of ZZ is fairly complicated, and I don't even try to tell people what it is.

I don't like the CFOP method, or more specifically, people who only learn CFOP. Compared with Roux and ZZ, it has a high algorithm count (78[CFOP], 42[Roux], 46[ZZ]), isn't ergonomic, and has a high move count.

I think other methods should always be checked out, given time, and seen if they suit the solver better.

It sounds like he is figuring out a lot of F2L by himself, yes?
So, right now, he is getting faster by solving the F2L of the cube more efficiently, by pairing up a corner and edge. But I assume that his last layer hasn't changed? That portion of the cube is entirely algorithmic, and is pretty hard to improve on without learning more algorithm sets. It also happens to be a nontrivial percentage of a standard CFOP solve.

The Roux method has less algs and can be solved almost entirely intuitively. With less of the cube being solved by algorithms, you have to figure out more for yourself. This sounds like something he would enjoy.

This series is from 2011, so it is kinda outdated, but it still has a lot of relevant information.
Video 1
Video 2
Video 3 - This is pretty unnecessary, but I think he refers to it in other part of the series. It's just solving the corners.
Video 4
Video 5
*IF* he likes Roux, I would suggest he check this out, along with the methods thread.

DELToS said:
That's just my opinion, though, feel free to debate with me :)
Click to expand...
Gladly.
Though, not angrily, even if it comes off that way.

DELToS said:
I feel like Roux may be a bit complex for a 5-year-old
Click to expand...
Roux is a fairly simple method, no more complicated than figuring out F2L. F2B is actually easier than F2L since you have more freedom to solve with the M-slice.

DELToS said:
CFOP is generally considered the best method
Click to expand...
What...? No!
CFOP is the most popular, yes. But CFOP is the best, most definitely NO.
I think that "best" can really only be defined by the cuber using the method. And just because almost all cubers use CFOP, that doesn't mean it's the best for that cuber.
I think it is safe to say that a lot [not all] of cubers don't know much about other methods. (Yes, I have asked at comps)
If so, then how can you say something is the best if you only know one method? A method can't be "generally" considered to be anything if people "in general" aren't qualified to say whether or not they like one method over another.

I think if every cuber were brain-wiped and, in an unbiased [A lot of comparisons say EOL is harder than Cross, but never FB or a 2x2x2] presentation, shown CFOP, Roux, and ZZ with their respective advantages and disadvantages, not as many people would choose CFOP.

DELToS said:
I'm not saying you can't get fast with something like Roux or ZZ
Click to expand...
Good. hahaha

DELToS said:
it just may be easier for him and better in the long run.
Click to expand...
Normally, if something is easy now, it gets worse in the long run. That's what the saying is anyway:p.
I think switching to something like Roux or ZZ would be harder now, as it is a completely new concept, but be better in the long run.
Ima stop arguing now. It feels wrong in such a totally epic thread.
If you really want to pick up another roux vs cfop debate, message me, but not here.
 
GenTheThief said:
It's more that I don't want him to only know one method.
I actually like the ZZ method more than Roux (and use it), but I think that the Roux method is easier to explain than ZZ, and I try and get people to learn that. The first step of ZZ is fairly complicated, and I don't even try to tell people what it is.

I don't like the CFOP method, or more specifically, people who only learn CFOP. Compared with Roux and ZZ, it has a high algorithm count (78[CFOP], 42[Roux], 46[ZZ]), isn't ergonomic, and has a high move count.

I think other methods should always be checked out, given time, and seen if they suit the solver better.

It sounds like he is figuring out a lot of F2L by himself, yes?
So, right now, he is getting faster by solving the F2L of the cube more efficiently, by pairing up a corner and edge. But I assume that his last layer hasn't changed? That portion of the cube is entirely algorithmic, and is pretty hard to improve on without learning more algorithm sets. It also happens to be a nontrivial percentage of a standard CFOP solve.

The Roux method has less algs and can be solved almost entirely intuitively. With less of the cube being solved by algorithms, you have to figure out more for yourself. This sounds like something he would enjoy.

This series is from 2011, so it is kinda outdated, but it still has a lot of relevant information.
Video 1
Video 2
Video 3 - This is pretty unnecessary, but I think he refers to it in other part of the series. It's just solving the corners.
Video 4
Video 5
*IF* he likes Roux, I would suggest he check this out, along with the methods thread.

Gladly.
Though, not angrily, even if it comes off that way.


Roux is a fairly simple method, no more complicated than figuring out F2L. F2B is actually easier than F2L since you have more freedom to solve with the M-slice.


What...? No!
CFOP is the most popular, yes. But CFOP is the best, most definitely NO.
I think that "best" can really only be defined by the cuber using the method. And just because almost all cubers use CFOP, that doesn't mean it's the best for that cuber.
I think it is safe to say that a lot [not all] of cubers don't know much about other methods. (Yes, I have asked at comps)
If so, then how can you say something is the best if you only know one method? A method can't be "generally" considered to be anything if people "in general" aren't qualified to say whether or not they like one method over another.

I think if every cuber were brain-wiped and, in an unbiased [A lot of comparisons say EOL is harder than Cross, but never FB or a 2x2x2] presentation, shown CFOP, Roux, and ZZ with their respective advantages and disadvantages, not as many people would choose CFOP.


Good. hahaha


Normally, if something is easy now, it gets worse in the long run. That's what the saying is anyway:p.
I think switching to something like Roux or ZZ would be harder now, as it is a completely new concept, but be better in the long run.
Ima stop arguing now. It feels wrong in such a totally epic thread.
If you really want to pick up another roux vs cfop debate, message me, but not here.
Click to expand...
(I'm not igniting a Roux-CFOP debate. This reply is specific to the context here.)
I feel that it is probably in the child's best interest to stick with CFOP. This is because CFOP is by far the most common method, and there is a pretty straightforward route for improvement. Although Roux is gaining popularity, learning Roux might confuse the child because it requires some form of understanding of rather abstract concepts (at least to a 5 year old). Also, his hands might not be large enough to turn the M slice quickly.

Edit: In addition, I'd like to add that Roux being more intuitive might not be all that beneficial to him. For a child his age, figuring stuff out himself might be more of a hindrance, even if he does not realise it.
 
Dom said:
The reason I find this thread so awesome is that not only do i wish I could've gotten into Cubing at 5, but I'm thrilled that someone's parent is actually involved in their son's Cubing hobby. Kids will come up to me all the time and show an interest in Cubing. I can only show them so much. When I talk to their father, they don't seem supportive. I show the guy where to go to train himself and his son on how to solve the cube, but they just give up and have absolutely no patience. I'm fed up with guys not supporting their kids who are interested in Cubing.

BRAVO ZULU, @wallstreet777 ! You're a good parent. I wish more parents were as involved with their kids' Cubing hobby. I admire you.

Also, I use this guide to CFOP. http://badmephisto.com Remember, the world record was broken with a CFOP-based method.
Click to expand...

Thanks, Dom!

I have 2 boys (5 & 3) who I push to try new things and not always stay in your comfort zone. As a parent, I believe it's my responsibility to help give them the tools necessary to be successful in whatever they are into. That's why I've spent the time learning how to solve something I never thought I would!

Spending time together working on a Rubik's cube has been surprisingly awesome. From what I gather from this forum, the community is a tight, small group of people that are helpful, supportive and truly want people to enjoy it.

It's amazing that you all of taken interest in my sons "speedcube" success.

Thank you to each and every one of you!


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 
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My two cents: don't just learn CFOP; learn as many different methods as you can. Other than ZZ and Roux, which are also excellent speedsolving methods, there are many other "unorthodox" methods to solving the cube. Most of them won't be as fast as CFOP/ZZ/Roux, but learning them may provide a better understanding of how twisty puzzles in general work (i.e. not just the Rubik's Cube, but also megaminx, pyraminx, skewb, etc.), which I think would be a more fruitful endeavour.

Also, if he does decide to stick with learning only CFOP, being colour neutral is also cool and you should try that.

Personal anecdote: I feel like I spent too much of my early cubing career (2007 to 2010-ish) caring too much about speed, and I burnt out when all of my classmates were way faster than me and I just wasn't improving, then I pretty much quit cubing for a few years. I returned to the hobby last year, stopped trying to compare my speed to others' so much, learnt a bunch of methods, won a local competition (for FMC), and here I am, offering (hopefully useful) advice to a newcomer. Don't burn yourself out by focusing too much on becoming fast. The most important thing is to have fun.
 
Last edited:
xyzzy said:
My two cents: don't just learn CFOP; learn as many different methods as you can. Other than ZZ and Roux, which are also excellent speedsolving methods, there are many other "unorthodox" methods to solving the cube. Most of them won't be as fast as CFOP/ZZ/Roux, but learning them may provide a better understanding of how twisty puzzles in general work (i.e. not just the Rubik's Cube, but also megaminx, pyraminx, skewb, etc.), which I think would be a more fruitful endeavour.

Also, if he does decide to stick with learning only CFOP, being colour neutral is also cool and you should try that.

Personal anecdote: I feel like I spent too much of my early cubing career (2007 to 2010-ish) caring too much about speed, and I burnt out when all of my classmates were way faster than me and I just wasn't improving, then I pretty much quit cubing for a few years. I returned to the hobby last year, stopped trying to compare my speed to others' so much, learnt a bunch of methods, won a local competition (for FMC), and here I am, offering (hopefully useful) advice to a newcomer. Don't burn yourself out by focusing too much on becoming fast. The most important thing is to have fun.
Click to expand...

Great post xyzzy, and thank you for that input I may take that learning new methods into consideration, one method I thought was really cool was Petrus. A pretty underrated and underused method, and if your talking about learning how the cube works, and understanding how they move around the cube, then Petrus is definetly the best way to go!

However for such a young age, just let him do what he wants, he seems to like CFOP and him learning f2l is a key component in pretty much most speedcubing methods.

~Rennur
 
Anyone know what he averages?
Also, if you really wanna challenge him, have him learn ZZ. It's not that hard, but the EO part takes a bit to get used to.
 
I'll try to stay out of the method debate except to say that CFOP is not a dead-end and has a very high ceiling as a speedsolving method, as evidenced by the fastest people that use it. At his age he could be a veteran with CFOP by the age of 8 if he keeps the passion and nothing else shinier catches his fancy. There's plenty of time to explore other methods.

One habit he should work on breaking is cutting out cube rotations to look around. You can tilt the cube forward to look for hidden pieces in the back. I'm not very fast myself and still catch myself doing rotations where I shouldn't. Rotations are quite slow, relatively, and ideally you want to limit them to a few per solve and only in judicious spots... never to find pieces you're looking for. A simple thing that will pay dividends in the long run without leaning anything new.
 
DGCubes said:
This is kind of off-topic, but I've been wondering. @wallstreet777, what does "HTPRI" mean at the end of the video?
Click to expand...

Great question and we have no idea. My wife and I asked him but he said he doesn't know [emoji3]

It's either something him and his school friends have made up or it was just a random thing that popped into his head at the end of the video.


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