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The Gan Debate Thread

ProStar

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Except for the fact that this exists:
Also, where can I find this newsletter?
That just makes it worse lol. You can sign up on the website
 

Sub1Hour

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Except for the fact that this exists:
Also, where can I find this newsletter?
This is a different set than the one that comes with the 354 "Explorer". The "Explorer Set" comes with blue instead of purple so if you want blue you are kind of screwed unless you want to pay an extra 40 dollars for the same exact cube for 1 set of nuts.
 

Sub1Hour

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It seems like Cyoubx shares many of the same veiws as I do regarding GAN as a company.
All GAN fanboys, watch this video and then maybe you should find a new company to follow.

Also here is a graph/chart that he made to display how rediculous GAN is as a company with their post SM cubes.

1592328375088.png


HOW DO YOU JUSTIFY MAKING 6 CUBES FOR INSANE PRICES WITH ONLY 2 DIFFERENT MODELS?
 
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pi³

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GAN is high quality but you can get similar quality cubes for much cheaper prices from Moyu or Qiyi. Plus, it seems like almost every new release is very similar to the last one except for a few small changes. Also, look at the first section in my signature :) GAN also seems very stubborn as they only make megaminxes and NxNs.
 

ProStar

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GAN is high quality but you can get similar quality cubes for much cheaper prices from Moyu or Qiyi. Plus, it seems like almost every new release is very similar to the last one except for a few small changes. Also, look at the first section in my signature :) GAN also seems very stubborn as they only make megaminxes and NxNs.
They've made one megaminx and one 4x4, so really they only make 3x3s. Although it's been confirmed that we'll get some side events sometime
 

kubesolver

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All GAN fanboys, watch this video and then maybe you should find a new company to follow.
Hate on GAN is just silly. There is absolutely nothing shady or unethical going on.

Their cubes are almost perfect, and a lot of people don't believe that a major improvement in 3x3x3 area is possible nor it is necessary. Instead of making something stupid like trying to be creative and ruining a perfect product they make slight variations of the same thing. What a crime!?

Also complaining that they try to make money is also silly. Not only someone who makes a product people want to buy deserves to make money, but also you have no clue how much time and money they wasted in the labs for the products that didn't work. They work on products other than 3x3x3, but somehow can't release it. How many prototypes have went to trash? How many people are working on it? Where should the money for this come from?

Research and production is gambling. You invest a lot of money into product and often lost everything if you fail or lose a lot if the product turns out to be unpopular. If you spawn a popular product you deserve to collect a jackpot.
 

Sub1Hour

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Hate on GAN is just silly. There is absolutely nothing shady or unethical going on.
Well, I consider lying to your customers to be shady. That is a bit of a stretch though, but they have not said anything about the RS, M, or X v2 to have the same exact mechanism as the X. They also did the same thing by advertising the Air M as a completely new puzzle even though it's just an XS. I have a few problems with their 3x3's after the XS just being rehashes with no changes aside from the core and magnets, but I do have a problem when they don't tell you that its the same cube. Their marketing makes it look like they are all brand new and different puzzles and that's at least a little shady. I would be fine if they actually came out and said "Hey, The M is just the X, if you have one, you don't need the other one." instead of basically lying to their customers.
Their cubes are almost perfect, and a lot of people don't believe that a major improvement in 3x3x3 area is possible nor it is necessary. Instead of making something stupid like trying to be creative and ruining a perfect product they make slight variations of the same thing. What a crime!?
I doubt that their cubes are almost perfect. In fact, their performance hasn't gotten any better since 2016 when the Air came out. In fact, I think that the SM was their peak. Every cube afterwards has the same locking issues the original Air series had but without the stability. The only reason why their cubes are useable is that you are able to use the yellow GES and they are too weak for a cube as flexible as the gan cubes. Have you ever tried a post SM cube with purple GES? Its basically like trying to cube with a block of jello. I would also love to see them make something "stupid" that may or may not be good because that at least shows that they care enough to make something different. Also by slight variation do you mean a core swap? Thats the only difference aside from magnets between modern gan cubes since they are all either X or XS cubes with a different core.
Also complaining that they try to make money is also silly. Not only someone who makes a product people want to buy deserves to make money, but also you have no clue how much time and money they wasted in the labs for the products that didn't work. They work on products other than 3x3x3, but somehow can't release it. How many prototypes have went to trash? How many people are working on it? Where should the money for this come from?
Here, ill give an example of a rehash that was done CORRECTLY. The WRm is what a rehash should look like. Many people had a problem with the ridges on the GTS3, so they made a model without them since people were actually asking for it. Not only did they do that, but they also made the Dual Adjustmen system finer and included another set of springs for more customizability. If you went up to someone and said: "Hey, do you like your iPhone? Cool, buy this other one that has a different charging cable and no differences at all but we market it like its an entirely new product!" do you really think they would want that product? I think that the money should come from new innovations, something that gan hasn't been good at since the 356 Air and something they haven't done at all since the X.

Research and production is gambling. You invest a lot of money into product and often lost everything if you fail or lose a lot if the product turns out to be unpopular. If you spawn a popular product you deserve to collect a jackpot.
I'm fine with them collecting the 3 jackpots they got from the original 354, X, and XS, but collecting 6 extra jackpots from the R, RS, M, Air M, Explorer 354, and X v2 is an issue. And I'm not sure how much money you have to invest to mix and match cores and hardware, I could do that for free, I'll just get an XS and put the core from the M in and boom, new gan cube!

TLDR; most of your points have some truth to them, but you need to see behind the facade that GAN has put in front of their products to realize they haven't done anything new since the XS and don't deserve to be seen as the most innovative company anymore, I honestly think that ShengShou is doing a good job at innovating right now than Gan.
 

I'm A Cuber

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Well, I consider lying to your customers to be shady. That is a bit of a stretch though, but they have not said anything about the RS, M, or X v2 to have the same exact mechanism as the X. They also did the same thing by advertising the Air M as a completely new puzzle even though it's just an XS. I have a few problems with their 3x3's after the XS just being rehashes with no changes aside from the core and magnets, but I do have a problem when they don't tell you that its the same cube. Their marketing makes it look like they are all brand new and different puzzles and that's at least a little shady. I would be fine if they actually came out and said "Hey, The M is just the X, if you have one, you don't need the other one." instead of basically lying to their customers.

I doubt that their cubes are almost perfect. In fact, their performance hasn't gotten any better since 2016 when the Air came out. In fact, I think that the SM was their peak. Every cube afterwards has the same locking issues the original Air series had but without the stability. The only reason why their cubes are useable is that you are able to use the yellow GES and they are too weak for a cube as flexible as the gan cubes. Have you ever tried a post SM cube with purple GES? Its basically like trying to cube with a block of jello. I would also love to see them make something "stupid" that may or may not be good because that at least shows that they care enough to make something different. Also by slight variation do you mean a core swap? Thats the only difference aside from magnets between modern gan cubes since they are all either X or XS cubes with a different core.

Here, ill give an example of a rehash that was done CORRECTLY. The WRm is what a rehash should look like. Many people had a problem with the ridges on the GTS3, so they made a model without them since people were actually asking for it. Not only did they do that, but they also made the Dual Adjustmen system finer and included another set of springs for more customizability. If you went up to someone and said: "Hey, do you like your iPhone? Cool, buy this other one that has a different charging cable and no differences at all but we market it like its an entirely new product!" do you really think they would want that product? I think that the money should come from new innovations, something that gan hasn't been good at since the 356 Air and something they haven't done at all since the X.


I'm fine with them collecting the 3 jackpots they got from the original 354, X, and XS, but collecting 6 extra jackpots from the R, RS, M, Air M, Explorer 354, and X v2 is an issue. And I'm not sure how much money you have to invest to mix and match cores and hardware, I could do that for free, I'll just get an XS and put the core from the M in and boom, new gan cube!

TLDR; most of your points have some truth to them, but you need to see behind the facade that GAN has put in front of their products to realize they haven't done anything new since the XS and don't deserve to be seen as the most innovative company anymore, I honestly think that ShengShou is doing a good job at innovating right now than Gan.
You don’t need to buy them all. They are doing a good job of giving people who want to buy a Gan cube lots of options. If their business model takes advantage of the consumer, then that is the consumer’s fault. Don’t blame Gan for the lack of research by the consumer
 

Sub1Hour

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Don’t blame Gan for the lack of research by the consumer
You know what, I will. They are doing the worst job out of any cube company on making clear what products are what. When MoYu came out with the WRm it was clear that it was just a GTS3 without ridges and with some small variations. When QiYi came out with their valk power it was clear that it was a mere alternative to the original valk. When companies like Qiyi, YJ, Moyu, and Yuxin are as clear as they are about what puzzles are different from which it's inexcusable for GAN to keep tricking their customers into buying "New" puzzles for prices that are hard to justify for the product you are receiving. For me, and many others, the Air M was the last straw. Not only was it advertising itself as a new cube in the Air series, but it was also literally just an XS with capsule magnets instead of the adjustable ones. I'll stop blaming gan for a lack of research when they either actually inform their customers instead of selling them the same thing over and over again, or if they actually make a new puzzle that isn't a core swap of existing puzzles.

Also, by options do you mean 4 different cubes that are actually the same exact thing? Yeah, I love pseudo options.
 

SnowyDay

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Dec 5, 2016
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Robot & 356i concepts are awesome. There is a lot of tough hardware, firmware, and cloud engineering to combine. This was an expensive and risky bet that can payoff big once the system is finalised. Gan is on V2 of both so the system is maturing.

I hope Gan the very best at getting these out of beta. They are very close.
 

EngiNerdBrian

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Research and production is gambling. You invest a lot of money into product and often lost everything if you fail or lose a lot if the product turns out to be unpopular. If you spawn a popular product you deserve to collect a jackpot.
To an extent. GAN has pushed the envelope a bit too far on justifying high prices for their "premium" features. Alot of their business strategy just feels like a cash grab at this point. It seems similar to new phones coming out that really don't offer the consumer any drastically noticeable benefits even though the sticker price is considerably higher than market average.

You know what, I will. They are doing the worst job out of any cube company on making clear what products are what. When MoYu came out with the WRm it was clear that it was just a GTS3 without ridges and with some small variations. When QiYi came out with their valk power it was clear that it was a mere alternative to the original valk. When companies like Qiyi, YJ, Moyu, and Yuxin are as clear as they are about what puzzles are different from which it's inexcusable for GAN to keep tricking their customers into buying "New" puzzles for prices that are hard to justify for the product you are receiving. For me, and many others, the Air M was the last straw. Not only was it advertising itself as a new cube in the Air series, but it was also literally just an XS with capsule magnets instead of the adjustable ones. I'll stop blaming gan for a lack of research when they either actually inform their customers instead of selling them the same thing over and over again, or if they actually make a new puzzle that isn't a core swap of existing puzzles.

Also, by options do you mean 4 different cubes that are actually the same exact thing? Yeah, I love pseudo options.
I generally agree with this. Given the transparency displayed by other cube manufactures it definitely doesn't make you feel like GAN is trying to truly benefit the general cubing population but just collect a higher price from those arrogant enough to need "THE BEST" hardware because they have the cash and the power of brand recognition and marketing has convinced them GAN is objectively the best when in fact it's still a subjective subject. Then there's those who genuinely want to purchase something high end and premium but don't have all the details and comparisons made, this group often feels dooped or underwhelmed given the $$$ they spent when the cube arrives. I definitely fall into the second category.

Lets face it shopping for anything in the digital age is hard with so many options; it is nice as @Sub1Hour said that some manufactures are clear about their upgrades or differences between products and disappointing that GAN is not.
 

Sion

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Gan has a really good cube model admittedly. I have a gan X i use on and off as a main at many points.

My issue with them comes from the fact that it's all the same product over and over again. There's nothing new. They act like every release is going to be something new and special, but it's really just a rehash of a design they've used since 2015. I understand it, and the fact they use the same mechanism over and over again is likely why they're recommended over and over again. However, a lot of the stuff they promote is just cool-looking add-ons, gadgets and gizmos onto the same puzzle.


If you want my honest opinion, if you want a GAN, only get one. Practically every cube in the lineup has the exact same feeling, same corner cutting, and even the same catches (not meant to be facetious). Getting every new GAN product is honestly a waste of money if you're doing it for purposes other than collection.
 
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