[Help Thread] Hoya Discussion

[TDM]

So far, no one besides Jong-Ho and Oscar has taken initiative on naming stuff, so I'm glad you brought this up. I'm not really familiar with cubing naming conventions (obv). So what you're saying is... Hoya5 simply be synonymous with Hodder?

Yes, or at least something where one name can't mean two methods.
In my opinion, Hoya5 shouldn't be called Hodder, as to me that looks as if Odder used part of the word Hoya and part of his name to name a method he didn't invent first. Hoya5 is a much more logical name.

 

[Carrot]

Yes, or at least something where one name can't mean two methods.
In my opinion, Hoya5 shouldn't be called Hodder, as to me that looks as if Odder used part of the word Hoya and part of his name to name a method he didn't invent first. Hoya5 is a much more logical name.

oh god my name, can someone just leave the name Hodder out of the discussion. It's a danish joke, nothing more than that, I never even posted it here...

 

[Chree]

oh god my name, can someone just leave the name Hodder out of the discussion. It's a danish joke, nothing more than that, I never even posted it here...

Well there you have it. Now I'm hungry for a danish (the pastry).

PB is down to 2:08 on 5x5 now. I will get this sub2. Very happy.

I'm finding a lot of the tricks we've found on 4x4 Hoya Cross don't translate so well to 5x5. Others just need a little tweaking and then they work great. Thank you, triple wide turns. I may compile a few for Dave's site.

 

[ChickenWrap]

Questions- what are hoya5 and hodder? I just learned hoya yesterday and now average about 1:15 for 4x4 so I would like to try it on bigger cubes!

 

[ilikecubing]

PB is down to 2:08 on 5x5 now. I will get this sub2. Very happy.

I'm finding a lot of the tricks we've found on 4x4 Hoya Cross don't translate so well to 5x5. Others just need a little tweaking and then they work great. Thank you, triple wide turns. I may compile a few for Dave's site.

Yay, looking forward to the tricks

I started using Hoya on 5x5 not long back and my PB is nearly same as your PB. I don't solve BL and BR, I just simply complete the cross like on 4x4, solve 4 edges using freeslice. Restore centers and do the last 4 edges as I would do when using redux.
I hate how my cube is stopping me from getting faster, I have an ss 5x5 which pops If I let the tensions loose, and its a pain to turn it on tight tensions, and to add to it, at times when I turn the outer layer during a speedsolve, it slightly turns the inner slice layer along with it too I wonder what fast people do to their ss, ofcourse modding makes a difference but unfortunately I don't have the time and patience to mod a 5x5 :/
I don't like how there is no better 5x5 than the ss.

 

[Chree]

Questions- what are hoya5 and hodder? I just learned hoya yesterday and now average about 1:15 for 4x4 so I would like to try it on bigger cubes!

Hehe... the definitions to these have only recently been discussed. Read the last couple weeks of posts to see more details, but here's how I think we're summing it up so far:

-Hoya on 5x5 is just using Hoya on 5x5. The same as on 4x4. Simple as that. F4C, Cross Edges, L2C, L8E, 3x3.

-Hoya5 is TDM's analogue of Yau5: F4C, then only 3 cross edges (Leave the Front cross tredges unsolved). Then build the 2 Back F2L tredges using the Hoya Cross method and solve them with their F2L Corners. Then do L2C and finally finish the Last Cross edge using normal pairing. L6E, 3x3. It's meant to help L6E lookahead since all the remaining tredges will be in U and F. (TDM, please let me know if I've messed this up)

-Hodder and Hoya5 are the same thing. Just thought of independently by TDM and Oscar Roth Anderson around the same time. I think the term Hoya5 will stick, but I still slip into saying Hodder from time to time when talking with other cubers.

I just use Hoya because I had trouble with Hoya5, I find it switches gears a bit too frequently for me to keep track of. There's still a lot to learn, though.

 

[Chree]

Yay, looking forward to the tricks

I started using Hoya on 5x5 not long back and my PB is nearly same as your PB. I don't solve BL and BR, I just simply complete the cross like on 4x4, solve 4 edges using freeslice. Restore centers and do the last 4 edges as I would do when using redux.
I hate how my cube is stopping me from getting faster, I have an ss 5x5 which pops If I let the tensions loose, and its a pain to turn it on tight tensions, and to add to it, at times when I turn the outer layer during a speedsolve, it slightly turns the inner slice layer along with it too I wonder what fast people do to their ss, ofcourse modding makes a difference but unfortunately I don't have the time and patience to mod a 5x5 :/
I don't like how there is no better 5x5 than the ss.

My SS5 was garbage as well, but last week I tightened it and put a ton of 25ct shock oil in. Now it works great. Still has the occasional epic lockup, but as my turning style improves, that becomes less of an issue.

Tighten it. Lube the crap out of it with medium to low viscosity lube. See what happens.

 

[TDM]

F4C, then only 3 cross edges (Leave the Front cross tredges unsolved). Then build the 2 Back F2L tredges using the Hoya Cross method and solve them with their F2L Corners. Then do L2C and finally finish the Last Cross edge using normal pairing. L6E, 3x3. It's meant to help L6E lookahead since all the remaining tredges will be in U and F. (TDM, please let me know if I've messed this up)

Yep, that's right. It wasn't originally intended to be anything to with Hoya or Yau at all... but eventually it became something similar to Hoya and Yau5. I only realised that when I actually attempted to do it on a cube.

 

[Carrot]

-Hoya5 is TDM's analogue of Yau5: F4C, then only 3 cross edges (Leave the Front cross tredges unsolved). Then build the 2 Back F2L tredges using the Hoya Cross method and solve them with their F2L Corners. Then do L2C and finally finish the Last Cross edge using normal pairing. L6E, 3x3. It's meant to help L6E lookahead since all the remaining tredges will be in U and F. (TDM, please let me know if I've messed this up)

I do it slightly different, but I may change it even more in the near future.

F4Ce -> 3 cross edges -> 2 back F2L pairs -> last cross piece -> L2Ce -> last edges -> 3x3x3

 

[Joey VOV]

JoeyVOV was the first one to use "Hoya5" a couple months ago. I thought it was a way to quickly distinguish which puzzle we were talking about. But I can see how that'd be confusing given the distinction between Yau and Yau5.

I'm sorry If I did cause confusion, I just wanted to Identify the puzzle I was talking about, which was 5x5, So I just said hoya5.

 

[Chree]

I'm sorry If I did cause confusion, I just wanted to Identify the puzzle I was talking about, which was 5x5, So I just said hoya5.

That's exactly what I thought you meant. No biggy.

 

[Chree]

Finally got a sub2 on 5x5 with Hoya! 1:54.70.

Had some real nice L8E. I think F4C is still one of my biggest weaknesses... but the Hoya cross is coming along quite nicely, and my lead into L2C is getting cleaner every day. I finally feel like I'm halfway decent at 5x5.

 

[Nilsibert]

Finally got a sub2 on 5x5 with Hoya! 1:54.70.

Had some real nice L8E. I think F4C is still one of my biggest weaknesses... but the Hoya cross is coming along quite nicely, and my lead into L2C is getting cleaner every day. I finally feel like I'm halfway decent at 5x5.

Congrats, that's awesome! Would you be willing to make kind of a walktrough/tips video? I suck at 5x5 and never practise, but I hope when the moyu 5x5 comes out I'll be more motivated to get better at it. I'm barely sub 4 I think.

 

[Chree]

Congrats, that's awesome! Would you be willing to make kind of a walktrough/tips video? I suck at 5x5 and never practise, but I hope when the moyu 5x5 comes out I'll be more motivated to get better at it. I'm barely sub 4 I think.

Definitely. My goal was to get this sub2 first. Now I feel like I'm adequately familiar with Hoya on 5x5 to pick out some tips. I'm probably going to work on it this weekend.

 

[ilikecubing]

Finally got a sub2 on 5x5 with Hoya! 1:54.70.

Had some real nice L8E. I think F4C is still one of my biggest weaknesses... but the Hoya cross is coming along quite nicely, and my lead into L2C is getting cleaner every day. I finally feel like I'm halfway decent at 5x5.

Congrats

 

[Joey VOV]

Finally got a sub2 on 5x5 with Hoya! 1:54.70.

Had some real nice L8E. I think F4C is still one of my biggest weaknesses... but the Hoya cross is coming along quite nicely, and my lead into L2C is getting cleaner every day. I finally feel like I'm halfway decent at 5x5.

Nice! one you get one, they will start coming more often.
Nice to see more people picking up hoya for 5x5, maybe I should make some example solves for it since more people are getting into it.

 

[sk8erman41]

I'm probably going to work on it this weekend.

Nice to see more people picking up hoya for 5x5, maybe I should make some example solves for it since more people are getting into it.

Looking forward to both your videos. I am still using reduction for 5x5 but love Hoya for 4x4. I am HORRIBLE at 5x5 so I may switch with some more practice and walkthrough/example solves. Looking forward to it and thank you both for what you have already contributed to this thread and spreading the Hoya way

 

[Carrot]

Nice! one you get one, they will start coming more often.
Nice to see more people picking up hoya for 5x5, maybe I should make some example solves for it since more people are getting into it.

I just noticed: we are almost same speed with this hoya thingy going on I have a faster single and you have a faster average ^_^ (officially speaking)

 

[Chree]

Finally put together a 5x5 video...

Side note: Towards the end I talk a lot about handling two pieces at once. I meant to talk about how I barely ever do that, and in the heat of a solve I usually only do one piece at a time. But I definitely think it's important to take an extra second to find out where all the pieces for each Cross Edge are before beginning to solve it, just for the chance that you can easily set up a faster case.

 

[sk8erman41]

Finally put together a 5x5 video...

Awesome job, once again thank you and can't wait for your walkthroughs also. I think that this will open a door to tons more 5x5 discoveries. I feel like there are many ways to link the two pieces for a multiple insert like you spoke about that we haven't looked into yet. Not sure that it will exactly lend to the most efficient style, but who knows. If nothing else, this has made Hoya super fun for me to play around with and try to figure stuff out. I am looking forward to more people doing example solves with Hoya. I really enjoy watching how other cubers minds work as they solve and always find things I can blend into my own style. I'm still focusing on 4x4 but like to tinker with 5x5 every once in awhile. Once I get my 4x4 times more consistently in the range I want then I am sure I will spend more time on 5x5 and this vid is very motivational.