IRNjuggle28
Veteran
I'm currently in the beginning stages of learning the Roux method. I'll likely continue with it and use it instead of my current main method, which is CFOP. After searching the forum, I found multiple threads on whether or not to switch methods, but none on the progress of switching. Switching methods is difficult and time consuming enough to merit its own support group, and after seeing many people saying that they wish they'd switched earlier, or are planning to switch, hopefully having a thread dedicated to switching can make doing so a bit less daunting.
This thread will hopefully serve as:
Choosing a method: http://www.speedsolving.com/forum/showthread.php?43471-Beginner-s-Guide-to-Choosing-a-Method
Speedsolving help that is NOT specific to switching methods: http://www.speedsolving.com/forum/forumdisplay.php?8-Speedcubing-Help-Questions
Posting fairly frequent updates about your progression with new methods could be very useful. Data on how long it takes to reach the speed you were on your previous method, as well as the correlation of that to how fast you were before switching, and which method you switched to, could be invaluable for cubers in the future. There's a pretty big lack of information to help answer questions like "how fast is too fast to switch" and "does learning a new method complement or hinder times with your original method." Information on the learning curves of the different methods could also be helpful, as it could give good advice on which method to learn first, and which ones are easier or harder to switch to. Many solvers theorize about these questions, and it would be great to have results from people actually trying these things to help find the answers.
In my opinion, substeps fit in this thread as well. Data on the feasibility of things like full ZBLL, Yau on 5x5 and up, CFCE vs CFOP, etc. is just as important to have.
I'll start with my beginning impressions of Roux. First, a little background: I've been cubing for about 4.5 months; since September 2013. With CFOP, I'm at about 26 seconds, and I don't use full OLL or PLL; I use a pretty bad/weird adaptation of 4 look last layer. I didn't worry too much about it since I'm planning to learn full PLL, which I'm nearly done doing. Since it's probably more important for comparing Roux with CFOP, I usually finish F2L at about 16 seconds.
My first full day with Roux was... interesting. My times got better reasonably quickly, but not insanely quickly considering that it was my first day with it and my learning curve should be pretty steep. Earlier in the day, I was ranging from 1:10 to 1:50. After my first full day with Roux, I'm right around a minute.
I would have thought that F2B would be pretty easy to adapt to since I use F2L decently well, but it's not. The first problem is that I don't know my color scheme well enough. I know my opposites, sure, but without the M layer being in place I have to figure out where things should go. It doesn't take me long to figure out. Probably a second or two, usually. But that adds up fast. I'd just started learning to look ahead during F2L. Even if I can't predict the case most of the time, I can usually figure out where the two pieces of my next pair will approximately end up while solving the previous one, so I don't have to spend any time looking for pieces. I just have to recognize the case. But not intuitively knowing where things should go made that pretty impossible to do with F2B; hence, I was much slower with F2B than F2L despite the fact that F2L involves solving more pieces. I didn't think to time my F2B, but I think it was probably 30-35 seconds on average.
With CFOP, I'm x2 neutral. White or yellow is always on U or D. I decided to stick with that for Roux. Being X2,y neutral with Roux is actually pretty hard compared to doing it with CFOP. I'm sure it'll get easier over time, but my CFOP color filter doesn't work great. It throws me off having to think about which pieces *not* to solve, and unlike with F2L, which only has 2 different possible sets of F2l pieces (depending on whether white or yellow is on D) Roux has 8; those two sets x 4 for each possible y placement. It's awfully tempting to ditch any form of color neutrality for Roux, but I'll stick with it. I'm sure I'll at least get used to it somewhat.
Inspection was very different as well. With CFOP, I can 1 look the cross given 15 seconds of inspection time probably 85% of the time. With Roux, I was trying to plan a solution for a 1X2X2 block, and when I could, finding approximately where the last pair of the first block would end up. I've heard that Roux solvers usually find their entire first block during inspection, which I can't come even close to doing. Maybe once I get better at lookahead. My Roux was still pretty CFOPPY. I didn't come even close to doing it without rotations like you're supposed to, and I didn't use the M layer to creats F2B pairs very much. That'll come with practice, though. I'm a lot less worried about that than I am the color neutrality.
The only part of Roux that I still need to look at a cheat sheet for is L6E orientation. I memorized a few of the cases, and I'll probably do the same with the rest of them soon, as the algs are pretty finger trick friendly and should be relatively easy to commit to muscle memory. I can figure the orientation cases out intuitively, but it takes me long enough to remove any semblance of speed from my solving, so I don't usually. L4C was OK. I can do them all intuitively now. The "dot" and "half a dot" were easy, but at first, I had an awful time differentiating the clockwise and the counterclockwise 3 cycles. (the FUUUU cases.) Later, I figured it out, but it still takes me a few seconds to recognize. I don't have a sophisticated method for recognizing those two cases, and I need to figure one out or learn how other Roux solvers do it. Nothing is automatic about Roux. Not yet.
I don't know COLL or CMLL. My solves went F2B, OCLL, CPLL, L6EO, UL/UR Permutation, L4C.
I think that's it for now. I'll continue documenting my progress fairly often. Despite not being fast with Roux instantly, the method is appealing. Even if I can't ever manage to reach my CFOP times, I'll probably still enjoy the occasional Roux solve. I find it unlikely that I'll settle for that, though.
To all others in the process of switching methods, good luck to you.
I'd love to hear about your journey with a new method as well.
This thread will hopefully serve as:
- An accomplishment thread specifically for achievements related to switching
- A help thread for issues encountered due to switching
- A thread to discuss and get personalized advice upon whether or not to switch, and what method to switch to
Choosing a method: http://www.speedsolving.com/forum/showthread.php?43471-Beginner-s-Guide-to-Choosing-a-Method
Speedsolving help that is NOT specific to switching methods: http://www.speedsolving.com/forum/forumdisplay.php?8-Speedcubing-Help-Questions
Posting fairly frequent updates about your progression with new methods could be very useful. Data on how long it takes to reach the speed you were on your previous method, as well as the correlation of that to how fast you were before switching, and which method you switched to, could be invaluable for cubers in the future. There's a pretty big lack of information to help answer questions like "how fast is too fast to switch" and "does learning a new method complement or hinder times with your original method." Information on the learning curves of the different methods could also be helpful, as it could give good advice on which method to learn first, and which ones are easier or harder to switch to. Many solvers theorize about these questions, and it would be great to have results from people actually trying these things to help find the answers.
In my opinion, substeps fit in this thread as well. Data on the feasibility of things like full ZBLL, Yau on 5x5 and up, CFCE vs CFOP, etc. is just as important to have.
I'll start with my beginning impressions of Roux. First, a little background: I've been cubing for about 4.5 months; since September 2013. With CFOP, I'm at about 26 seconds, and I don't use full OLL or PLL; I use a pretty bad/weird adaptation of 4 look last layer. I didn't worry too much about it since I'm planning to learn full PLL, which I'm nearly done doing. Since it's probably more important for comparing Roux with CFOP, I usually finish F2L at about 16 seconds.
My first full day with Roux was... interesting. My times got better reasonably quickly, but not insanely quickly considering that it was my first day with it and my learning curve should be pretty steep. Earlier in the day, I was ranging from 1:10 to 1:50. After my first full day with Roux, I'm right around a minute.
I would have thought that F2B would be pretty easy to adapt to since I use F2L decently well, but it's not. The first problem is that I don't know my color scheme well enough. I know my opposites, sure, but without the M layer being in place I have to figure out where things should go. It doesn't take me long to figure out. Probably a second or two, usually. But that adds up fast. I'd just started learning to look ahead during F2L. Even if I can't predict the case most of the time, I can usually figure out where the two pieces of my next pair will approximately end up while solving the previous one, so I don't have to spend any time looking for pieces. I just have to recognize the case. But not intuitively knowing where things should go made that pretty impossible to do with F2B; hence, I was much slower with F2B than F2L despite the fact that F2L involves solving more pieces. I didn't think to time my F2B, but I think it was probably 30-35 seconds on average.
With CFOP, I'm x2 neutral. White or yellow is always on U or D. I decided to stick with that for Roux. Being X2,y neutral with Roux is actually pretty hard compared to doing it with CFOP. I'm sure it'll get easier over time, but my CFOP color filter doesn't work great. It throws me off having to think about which pieces *not* to solve, and unlike with F2L, which only has 2 different possible sets of F2l pieces (depending on whether white or yellow is on D) Roux has 8; those two sets x 4 for each possible y placement. It's awfully tempting to ditch any form of color neutrality for Roux, but I'll stick with it. I'm sure I'll at least get used to it somewhat.
Inspection was very different as well. With CFOP, I can 1 look the cross given 15 seconds of inspection time probably 85% of the time. With Roux, I was trying to plan a solution for a 1X2X2 block, and when I could, finding approximately where the last pair of the first block would end up. I've heard that Roux solvers usually find their entire first block during inspection, which I can't come even close to doing. Maybe once I get better at lookahead. My Roux was still pretty CFOPPY. I didn't come even close to doing it without rotations like you're supposed to, and I didn't use the M layer to creats F2B pairs very much. That'll come with practice, though. I'm a lot less worried about that than I am the color neutrality.
The only part of Roux that I still need to look at a cheat sheet for is L6E orientation. I memorized a few of the cases, and I'll probably do the same with the rest of them soon, as the algs are pretty finger trick friendly and should be relatively easy to commit to muscle memory. I can figure the orientation cases out intuitively, but it takes me long enough to remove any semblance of speed from my solving, so I don't usually. L4C was OK. I can do them all intuitively now. The "dot" and "half a dot" were easy, but at first, I had an awful time differentiating the clockwise and the counterclockwise 3 cycles. (the FUUUU cases.) Later, I figured it out, but it still takes me a few seconds to recognize. I don't have a sophisticated method for recognizing those two cases, and I need to figure one out or learn how other Roux solvers do it. Nothing is automatic about Roux. Not yet.
I don't know COLL or CMLL. My solves went F2B, OCLL, CPLL, L6EO, UL/UR Permutation, L4C.
I think that's it for now. I'll continue documenting my progress fairly often. Despite not being fast with Roux instantly, the method is appealing. Even if I can't ever manage to reach my CFOP times, I'll probably still enjoy the occasional Roux solve. I find it unlikely that I'll settle for that, though.
To all others in the process of switching methods, good luck to you.
I'd love to hear about your journey with a new method as well.
