Petrus-like speedsolving

[Sharkretriver]

Hey everybody, I'm just wondering whether my time will stay the same or even slightly increase with this half-2 gen method. I don't care about fewest moves.
1. Start with cross or 3 adjacent cross pieces
2. do 2 f2l slots, you should have a 2x2X3 block now
3. :confused: I'm not sure about here, do an algorithm to make good edges? you'll know what I mean when you only scramble the cube using R and U faces, the f2l only needs R and U faces to complete
4. do the rest of the cube with R and U faces I'm not sure whether the PLL would work, as it isn't really 2 gen.

so yeah. I demo'd step 4 to my parents, and I thought it was pretty fast.

edit: I'm not good at blockbuilding, this is just another thing that i do. Normally i use CFOP.
another thing--i just noticed this method is way too related to petrus, so whatever i'll check petrus out.

 

[Anthony]

Yes.

 

[Kirjava]

1. Start with cross or 3 adjacent cross pieces
2. do 2 f2l slots, you should have a 2x2X3 block now

ಠ_ಠ

 

[Cyrus C.]

Boo.

 

[Edward]

Hey everybody, I'm just wondering whether my time will stay the same or even slightly increase with this half-2 gen method. I don't care about fewest moves.
1. Start with cross or 3 adjacent cross pieces
2. do 2 f2l slots, you should have a 2x2X3 block now
3. :confused: I'm not sure about here, do an algorithm to make good edges? you'll know what I mean when you only scramble the cube using R and U faces, the f2l only needs R and U faces to complete
4. do the rest of the cube with R and U faces I'm not sure whether the PLL would work, as it isn't really 2 gen.

so yeah. I demo'd step 4 to my parents, and I thought it was pretty fast.

Try blockbuilding instead.

 

[Sharkretriver]

Hey everybody, I'm just wondering whether my time will stay the same or even slightly increase with this half-2 gen method. I don't care about fewest moves.
1. Start with cross or 3 adjacent cross pieces
2. do 2 f2l slots, you should have a 2x2X3 block now
3. :confused: I'm not sure about here, do an algorithm to make good edges? you'll know what I mean when you only scramble the cube using R and U faces, the f2l only needs R and U faces to complete
4. do the rest of the cube with R and U faces I'm not sure whether the PLL would work, as it isn't really 2 gen.

so yeah. I demo'd step 4 to my parents, and I thought it was pretty fast.

Try blockbuilding instead.

I suck at blockbuilding! ;-( that's why I do cross+f2l. Oh yeah and how fast can blockbuilding go? I don't think petrus was meant for speedsolving, or was it?

 

[EnterPseudonym]

Hey everybody, I'm just wondering whether my time will stay the same or even slightly increase with this half-2 gen method. I don't care about fewest moves.
1. Start with cross or 3 adjacent cross pieces
2. do 2 f2l slots, you should have a 2x2X3 block now
3. :confused: I'm not sure about here, do an algorithm to make good edges? you'll know what I mean when you only scramble the cube using R and U faces, the f2l only needs R and U faces to complete
4. do the rest of the cube with R and U faces I'm not sure whether the PLL would work, as it isn't really 2 gen.

so yeah. I demo'd step 4 to my parents, and I thought it was pretty fast.

Try blockbuilding instead.

I suck at blockbuilding! ;-( that's why I do cross+f2l. Oh yeah and how fast can blockbuilding go? I don't think petrus was meant for speedsolving, or was it?

>.<

biggreen, kirjava, waffle.
nuff said (aimed at block building, not petrus)

 

[Samania]

Blockbuilding just uses less moves. Its intuitive.
Yeah if you practice petrus.. then you can use it in speedsolving.. :/

 

[joey]

Blockbuilding just uses less moves. Its intuitive.
Yeah if you practice petrus.. then you can use it in speedsolving.. :/

You know that Fridrich F2L is intuitive, right?

 

[Samania]

Blockbuilding just uses less moves. Its intuitive.
Yeah if you practice petrus.. then you can use it in speedsolving.. :/

You know that Fridrich F2L is intuitive, right?

yes. Now i dont know why i added in the "intuitive" part.
Blockbuilding just has more possibilities.

 

[ottothedog]

i am thininking about learning something simmilar to this using basicaly what you said, but using winter variation for an oll skip. what do you guys think?

 

[Sharkretriver]

i am thininking about learning something simmilar to this using basicaly what you said, but using winter variation for an oll skip. what do you guys think?

Ok, that's cool. I just looked at a site about petrus, and think the part where you have to orient the bad edges, the recognition wouldn't be so good.
And why use WV when you can use ZBLL! LOL XD im kidding! I think that's a good idea. I heard that WV can be 2-gen but I don't know where you can find those algs.
Lastly, you have to mirror algs. omg!

 

[ottothedog]

i have been practicing bad edges for a while and can do them in a few seconds, recognition isn't that bad once you get used to it. I would learn zb and skip that step alltogether but too complicated, this will probably be just about as effective (because of recognition time)

 

[AngeL]

If you're going to start the solve off that way, why not just do full fridrich? The big advantage of Petrus is its move efficiency, and that requires block-building.

Yes, Blocks can be just as fast as F2L, it just takes a LOT of practice. Everyone sucks with them at first. First time I ever timed a Roux solve (and this was AFTER a week of practice) I think my time was, like, 1:45. It's a very complicated way to solve the cube.

BUT, once you get it down, it greatly reduces your number of moves needed because you're not having to waste moves repairing what you've already set up. A good Petrus solve uses something like 20 fewer moves than a Fridrich solve. So, why throw away the advantage Petrus gives you?

 

[Stini]

I'm a Fridrich solver, but I have practiced block building quite a lot and I start with a 2x2x2-block about 50% of my solves. A good approach is to first look if you have any CE-pairs during inspection. If you find one, then try to make it into a 1x2x2-block then finally put the last edge piece in place and adjust the 1x2x2-block to form a 2x2x2-block. It's a bit more difficult when you don't have a CE-pair, then you could for example look for edges that are already next to a corresponding center piece (oriented correctly of course) to find an efficient block. In this case you should try to build a CE-pair and put it next to the edge to form the 1x2x2-block. Quite often I just rather start with a cross in the latter case, especially if the cross is easy. And of course you shouldn't always do it like this, but this approach works quite well most of the time. Sometimes it is better to first solve the "last edge" and then build the 1x2x2-block or something completely different. You just have to practice this yourself to become good at it. On average it should take about 5-6 moves to build a 2x2x2-block, so it's just a waste of moves to do it Fridrich style.

Extending the block to 2x2x3 is what most Petrus solvers seem to have problems with (to do it fast, that is). This requires a lot of practice to be able to do it fast with almost no delays! Most of the time I just solve the last two cross edges and do a normal Fridrich solve, but sometimes I notice an easy 2x2x3 and then I take the advantage of that. Usually this means that there is a CE-pair, then all I have to do is to match it with the last edge to make it into a 1x2x2. Usually I find it more efficient to build a CE-pair first instead of solving the 3rd cross piece and complete the block in Fridrich style. I think this is what most Petrus solvers do if they don't immediately see a nice way to build a 2x2x3-block, they just pick a corner and look where the corresponding edges are, then just build a CE-pair, make it into a 1x2x2 and adjust it to complete the whole 2x2x3.

 

[ottothedog]

If you're going to start the solve off that way, why not just do full fridrich? The big advantage of Petrus is its move efficiency, and that requires block-building.

Yes, Blocks can be just as fast as F2L, it just takes a LOT of practice. Everyone sucks with them at first. First time I ever timed a Roux solve (and this was AFTER a week of practice) I think my time was, like, 1:45. It's a very complicated way to solve the cube.

BUT, once you get it down, it greatly reduces your number of moves needed because you're not having to waste moves repairing what you've already set up. A good Petrus solve uses something like 20 fewer moves than a Fridrich solve. So, why throw away the advantage Petrus gives you?

I figured i would start with fridrich (cause i am used to it and find petrus style to time consuming) I have found it pretty simple to get 2x2x2 block fridric style and expand, or just get 3 cross pieces and f2l pairs. My intentions though are to eventualy switch over to petrus if this method works out, i figured this would just make the transition easier at first.

 

[miniGOINGS]

I figured i would start with fridrich (cause i am used to it and find petrus style to time consuming) I have found it pretty simple to get 2x2x2 block fridric style and expand, or just get 3 cross pieces and f2l pairs. My intentions though are to eventualy switch over to petrus if this method works out, i figured this would just make the transition easier at first.

But you might as well start doing 2x2x2 right now. You're never going to transition into Petrus if you just practice Fridrich, because you're going to be faster at Fridrich and not want to finish the transition. Just start doing Petrus now.

 

[Rpotts]

I figured i would start with fridrich (cause i am used to it and find petrus style to time consuming) I have found it pretty simple to get 2x2x2 block fridric style and expand, or just get 3 cross pieces and f2l pairs. My intentions though are to eventualy switch over to petrus if this method works out, i figured this would just make the transition easier at first.

I think that'll make the transition harder, as you'll still be practicing fridrich just with a slightly different order. Oh and about recognizing bad edges - it's really easy, just look at the stickers of the two faces your dealing with. Say you have yellow on top and green on front. If there is a yellow edge sticker on the yellow side facing up - it's good. If the yellow sticker is on the side of the U layer - it's bad. If you have a green sticker facing up on the yellow layer- it's bad and vice versa.

I think Petrus' page is good for learning his method, and his explanation of bad edges was good enough to learn me up good when I was a noob.

To the OP: You should use Niklas to permute corners (as petrus does/suggests in his tutorial) after finishing f2l. Once you have completed that, the rest of the solve can be 2-gen. Although you may prefer MU algs for H/Z perm, but w/e

 

[Sharkretriver]

ok...so which pair should I do first for http://lar5.com/cube/fas4.html ? left or right one :confused: or are any of them as first ok

 

[Edward]

If you're going to start the solve off that way, why not just do full fridrich? The big advantage of Petrus is its move efficiency, and that requires block-building.

Yes, Blocks can be just as fast as F2L, it just takes a LOT of practice. Everyone sucks with them at first. First time I ever timed a Roux solve (and this was AFTER a week of practice) I think my time was, like, 1:45. It's a very complicated way to solve the cube.

BUT, once you get it down, it greatly reduces your number of moves needed because you're not having to waste moves repairing what you've already set up. A good Petrus solve uses something like 20 fewer moves than a Fridrich solve. So, why throw away the advantage Petrus gives you?

I figured i would start with fridrich (cause i am used to it and find petrus style to time consuming) I have found it pretty simple to get 2x2x2 block fridric style and expand, or just get 3 cross pieces and f2l pairs. My intentions though are to eventualy switch over to petrus if this method works out, i figured this would just make the transition easier at first.

Blockbuilding is not for everyone.
Make the switch now.
If you do it like this, you'll end up going totally fridrich. If you're going to switch to petrus, at least try to block-build.

This is coming from someone who tried to switch to Roux, failed, and went back to fridrich for similar reasons.