Move count for speedsolvin' 3x3

[Zane_C]

Hi,
I was wondering how many moves everyone here uses for a speedsolve. I usually range between 65-70 moves per speedsolve with cross, F2L, 2 step OLL and full PLL.
Should I try to drop my move count? or just turn fast and have little delays?
I would like to hear from some experienced cubers please.
Also, how are the number of moves worked out? Is it each 90° turn or does 180° count as 1 turn?

Just of curiosity, does anyone know how much Erik Akkersdijk used in his 7.08 second solve?

Thanks.

 

[amostay2004]

I get anywhere between 45 to 60 moves on normal solves with full Fridrich. No you should not focus on move count at all but like you said, just turn fast and have little delays, which means more lookahead.

Any 90 or 180 degree turn counts as 1 turn.

I believe Erik used 42 or 43 moves for his 7.08 second solve, couldn't remember exactly. You can check out the reconstruction on Lucas Garron's page.

 

[thelurch1986]

I get about 48-58 using Petrus + 2 Look Last Layer (OLL/PLL). My F2L ranges from about 28-38 and OLL/PLL is about 20 moves on average.

 

[Zane_C]

Gee, I couldn't even get under 45 moves for a fewest moves challenge, let alone in 7.08 seconds!

 

[Johannes91]

Gee, I couldn't even get under 45 moves for a fewest moves challenge, let alone in 7.08 seconds!

If someone got an easy F2L and a LL-skip in a speedsolve, would you be super impressed because they got a really short and fast solve at the same time? Does not compute...

 

[hawkmp4]

Well, if you're looking at reducing your move count, ignore your last layer. Algorithms can't really be reduced, and besides, a sub-optimal algorithm may be much faster than an optimal one because it lends itself to triggers better.
Cross can ALWAYS be done in less than 8 moves.
I forget the guideline for F2L but if you're doing more than 10 moves for an F2L case you should look up an algorithm because it's likely that there's a shorter and faster way to solve it.

 

[miniGOINGS]

So I average like 57 with bad blockbuilding and 2 look CMLL, go me. Could get down to like 30-40 if I was good.

 

[Johannes91]

Cross can ALWAYS be done in at most 8 moves.

FTFY

 

[hawkmp4]

Ah, yes. My mistake. There are 102 cross cases that only can be solved in 8 moves IIRC.

 

[Escher]

A 35 or less move f2l is what you should be aiming for.

- Try becoming opposite cross colour neutral. That is, if you use white cross now, start using yellow cross too. Many of the fastest cubers use this (Erik Akkersdijk + Breandan Vallance certainly do), and you can mostly avoid bad crosses. I find that the fewer moves I have to do in a cross, the easier it is to look ahead into the first pair.

- Use tricks like Keyhole to save moves. (I hope you don't already know this...)
An example:
Set-up: D' L' U L D
Normally you would probably do U2 R U' R' U2 R U' R'
Instead, you can do:
D' L' U' L D
This is a useful trick for edges or corners that are already in their slot (the example solves both so you can look at either to see how it works).

- Know when you have 'good' or 'bad' f2l edges. A 'good' f2l edge is one that can be solved using any or all of <R, U, L> moves. A 'bad' one is one that requires an F face turn or a rotation to be solved.
Try this scramble: R2 U2 R U R U2 R U R U' R' U2 R U
What do you notice about the f2l edges?

Use http://mzrg.com/miniSites/scramblers/qqtimer.html
and select '3x3 subsets' and '<R, U, L> scrambles' to practice doing the f2l with no rotations.
You'll have to be able to solve slots from different angles to do this, if you haven't already learnt how to do that.

In fact, you only ever need one rotation while solving f2l pairs. Why is this?

- Do plenty of slow + smooth solves, and try and solve each pair as optimally as possible, keeping in mind the next pair you'll need to solve.

- sites like:
http://www.cubeloop.com/php/cube/advanced.php?chapter=f2l
http://pagesperso-orange.fr/absolutemind/ms-angl.html
http://www.opticubes.com/cubing/f2l/

and these vids/threads:
http://www.speedsolving.com/forum/showthread.php?t=14345
http://www.speedsolving.com/forum/showthread.php?t=15050

will help you to get a more advanced f2l.

- Just solve lots! You'll find out your own tricks and things as you go along.

 

[Weston]

I just did a solve, and it was 54 moves.
It was a 6 move cross,
6 move 1st F2L pair
6 move 2nd pair (same case lol)
8 move 3rd pair
8 move 4th pair (it could have been 6 moves, but I did edge control to have all LL edges oriented)
Sune- 7 moves
R perm- 13 moves

EDIT: plus 1 move for AUF
DOUBLE EDIT: In a normal solve, it probably would be higher because of the LL. I would have done COLL (longer alg) and probably a U or Z perm.

 

[miniGOINGS]

Let's see:

Step A: 4 move block and 1 move insertion = 5 moves
Step B: 8 move block and 1 move insertion = 9 moves
Step C: 5 move block and 3 move insertion = 8 moves
Step D: 3 move block and 2 move insertion = 5 moves
Corner Orientation: 1 move AUF and 7 move algorithm = 8 moves
Corner Permutation: 17 move algorithm = 17 moves
Edge Orientation: 7 moves = 7 moves
Left and Right: 3 moves = 3 moves
Middle: 3 moves = 3 moves

First Block: 14 moves
Second Block: 13 moves
Corners: 25 moves
Edges: 13 moves

Total: 65 moves

Comment: Stupid Y Perm

 

[Weston]

Let's see:

Step A: 4 move block and 1 move insertion = 5 moves
Step B: 8 move block and 1 move insertion = 9 moves
Step C: 5 move block and 3 move insertion = 8 moves
Step D: 3 move block and 2 move insertion = 5 moves
Corner Orientation: 1 move AUF and 7 move algorithm = 8 moves
Corner Permutation: 17 move algorithm = 17 moves
Edge Orientation: 7 moves = 7 moves
Left and Right: 3 moves = 3 moves
Middle: 3 moves = 3 moves

First Block: 14 moves
Second Block: 13 moves
Corners: 25 moves
Edges: 13 moves

Total: 65 moves

Comment: Stupid Y Perm

May I suggest to you the Y perm that I use? Its very fast for both 2H and OH.

R2 U' R' U R U' y' x' L' U' R U' R' U' L U

Is 14 moves.

 

[miniGOINGS]

May I suggest to you the Y perm that I use? Its very fast for both 2H and OH.

R2 U' R' U R U' y' x' L' U' R U' R' U' L U

Is 14 moves.

Sorry, it won't work, I have to have the cube ready for LSE.

 

[Weston]

May I suggest to you the Y perm that I use? Its very fast for both 2H and OH.

R2 U' R' U R U' y' x' L' U' R U' R' U' L U

Is 14 moves.

Sorry, it won't work, I have to have the cube ready for LSE.

Oh yeah you use petrus. My mistake.

 

[miniGOINGS]

May I suggest to you the Y perm that I use? Its very fast for both 2H and OH.

R2 U' R' U R U' y' x' L' U' R U' R' U' L U

Is 14 moves.

Sorry, it won't work, I have to have the cube ready for LSE.

Oh yeah you use petrus. My mistake.

Roux actually.

To anyone who might have good algs... Thanks.

 

[4Chan]

I get around 50 moves.

 

[Edward]

Im always around 80 moves :fp.

 

[Weston]

May I suggest to you the Y perm that I use? Its very fast for both 2H and OH.

R2 U' R' U R U' y' x' L' U' R U' R' U' L U

Is 14 moves.

Sorry, it won't work, I have to have the cube ready for LSE.

Oh yeah you use petrus. My mistake.

Roux actually.

To anyone who might have good algs... Thanks.

Double Phail on my part.

 

[Zane_C]

I'm off topic a bit, but I love the sune, it's so damn fast!