Guys we're screwed

Eric4112

Eric4112

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This 8 year old almost got the first sub 4 average.
He's called Xuanyi Geng, and this is his times for second round in a comp:
3.89 3.90 5.17 4.02 5.03
If he got a better final solve he would have beaten Yiheng and possibly gotten the first sub 4 average. The reason he messed up the 11.03 is he did a really wierd alg which gave him a bad oll and a terrible ZBLL (yes he does ZBLL all 500 algs). But if he did a better alg, he would've gotten a oll skip and would get one of the easiest ZBLL's.
Needless to say we are screwed. I never in a million years thought Yiheng would have competition.
By the way the comp was Hangzhou Open 2024
 
Eric4112 said:
If he got a better final solve
Click to expand...
But he did not.

Eric4112 said:
But if he did a better alg, he would've gotten a oll skip and would get one of the easiest ZBLL's.
Click to expand...
1. But he did not.
2. I can't even figure out what "better alg" you're referring to here. These are all the OLS algs up to 12 moves and they all seem to be worse than the ZBLS that Xuanyi actually used:
Searching depth 10

R U' B U2 B' L U' R' U L' (10f*)
Searching depth 11

U' R B U2 B2 R' U' R U B R' (11f)
U' F' U F' B L F L' B' U F (11f)
R U L' B R B R' B' L U R' (11f)
R U' R' U L F' R' F R F L' (11f)
R U' B U2 B' L U' R' U L' U (11f)
R U' B U2 B' L U' R' U L' U2 (11f)
R U' B U2 B' L U' R' U L' U' (11f)
Searching depth 12

U F2 U' F2 L F2 L' F2 U F U' F (12f)
U F' U' L2 B L B2 U B U L F (12f)
U' R U' R2 F' L' F R F' L U' F (12f)
U' R U' R' U2 B U' F' U B' U F (12f)
U' R B U2 B2 R' U' R U B R' U (12f)
U' R B U2 B2 R' U' R U B R' U2 (12f)
U' R B U2 B2 R' U' R U B R' U' (12f)
U' F' U F' B L F L' B' U F U (12f)
U' F' U F' B L F L' B' U F U2 (12f)
U' F' U F' B L F L' B' U F U' (12f)
U' F' U2 R U' F' L F L' U R' F (12f)
U' F' U2 R L' U B' U' B R' L F (12f)
U' F' U2 F U R U2 B U' B' U' R' (12f)
R U L' B R B R' B' L U R' U (12f)
R U L' B R B R' B' L U R' U2 (12f)
R U L' B R B R' B' L U R' U' (12f)
R U' R' U L F' R' F R F L' U (12f)
R U' R' U L F' R' F R F L' U2 (12f)
R U' R' U L F' R' F R F L' U' (12f)
R U' R' F R' F' L D' F2 D R L' (12f)
R U' B U2 B2 U2 B U B' U B R' (12f)
R B2 U2 R B R' U2 B' U B' U R' (12f)
R2 D L' B' L D' R' B U' B' U' R' (12f)
F U R U' R' F B D' L' D F2 B' (12f)
3. T ZBLL is good on average so "bad OLL and a terrible ZBLL" is an insane take. It turned out that this was one of the garbo T ZBLLs, but I feel like it's not very realistic at this point to plan multiple ZBF2L solutions in inspection to pick the one that gives the nicest ZBLL.
 
xyzzy said:
But he did not.


1. But he did not.
2. I can't even figure out what "better alg" you're referring to here. These are all the OLS algs up to 12 moves and they all seem to be worse than the ZBLS that Xuanyi actually used:
Searching depth 10

R U' B U2 B' L U' R' U L' (10f*)
Searching depth 11

U' R B U2 B2 R' U' R U B R' (11f)
U' F' U F' B L F L' B' U F (11f)
R U L' B R B R' B' L U R' (11f)
R U' R' U L F' R' F R F L' (11f)
R U' B U2 B' L U' R' U L' U (11f)
R U' B U2 B' L U' R' U L' U2 (11f)
R U' B U2 B' L U' R' U L' U' (11f)
Searching depth 12

U F2 U' F2 L F2 L' F2 U F U' F (12f)
U F' U' L2 B L B2 U B U L F (12f)
U' R U' R2 F' L' F R F' L U' F (12f)
U' R U' R' U2 B U' F' U B' U F (12f)
U' R B U2 B2 R' U' R U B R' U (12f)
U' R B U2 B2 R' U' R U B R' U2 (12f)
U' R B U2 B2 R' U' R U B R' U' (12f)
U' F' U F' B L F L' B' U F U (12f)
U' F' U F' B L F L' B' U F U2 (12f)
U' F' U F' B L F L' B' U F U' (12f)
U' F' U2 R U' F' L F L' U R' F (12f)
U' F' U2 R L' U B' U' B R' L F (12f)
U' F' U2 F U R U2 B U' B' U' R' (12f)
R U L' B R B R' B' L U R' U (12f)
R U L' B R B R' B' L U R' U2 (12f)
R U L' B R B R' B' L U R' U' (12f)
R U' R' U L F' R' F R F L' U (12f)
R U' R' U L F' R' F R F L' U2 (12f)
R U' R' U L F' R' F R F L' U' (12f)
R U' R' F R' F' L D' F2 D R L' (12f)
R U' B U2 B2 U2 B U B' U B R' (12f)
R B2 U2 R B R' U2 B' U B' U R' (12f)
R2 D L' B' L D' R' B U' B' U' R' (12f)
F U R U' R' F B D' L' D F2 B' (12f)
3. T ZBLL is good on average so "bad OLL and a terrible ZBLL" is an insane take. It turned out that this was one of the garbo T ZBLLs, but I feel like it's not very realistic at this point to plan multiple ZBF2L solutions in inspection to pick the one that gives the nicest ZBLL.
Click to expand...
@xyzzy
The "bad alg" I'm taliking about is when he does the last pair and also simultaneousley does cross on top to get oll and ZBLL, and the "better alg" is Good alg: R U' R' U r U' R' U R U r'(oll skip jb)
Bad alg: R U' R' F R' F' R U2 R U R' (gives 17 move ZBLL)
 
Last edited:
Eric4112 said:
@xyzzy
The "bad alg" I'm taliking about is when he does the last pair and also simultaneousley does cross on top to get oll and ZBLL, and the "better alg" is Good alg: R U' R' U r U' R' U R U r' (gives 17 move ZBLL)
Bad alg: R U' R' F R' F' R U2 R U R' (oll skip jb)
Click to expand...
It's supposed to be the other way around? The good alg is the one that gives oll skip

Eric4112 said:
wait really?
Click to expand...
yep
 
Eric4112 said:
The "bad alg" I'm taliking about is when he does the last pair and also simultaneousley does cross on top to get oll and ZBLL, and the "better alg" is Good alg: R U' R' U r U' R' U R U r'(oll skip jb)
Bad alg: R U' R' F R' F' R U2 R U R' (gives 17 move ZBLL)
Click to expand...
Meanwhile, in an alternate universe where the last layer edges were permuted differently (all else equal), it could have been a 8/9-move ZBLL versus an R perm, and in yet another alternate universe where the last layer corners were also oriented differently, it could have been a J perm versus this bad T case.

You need to look at the method as a whole, not by nitpicking individual solves. In some situations, method A is better, and in some other situations, method B is better, so the real question is: when you cannot easily distinguish whether you're in the former type of situation or the latter type, which method is better on average? Or if you're at the frontier and hunting for records (as opposed to just trying to do well), which method will give you better chances of breaking a record?

I don't think it's set in stone that the RrU alg you wrote is definitively better than the hedge-based alg that Xuanyi used (but also I was clearly not awake enough to notice it in the Cube Explorer output – clearly I have not genned algs in a while). RrU forces a grip shift that the hedge-based alg doesn't need.
 
xyzzy said:
Meanwhile, in an alternate universe where the last layer edges were permuted differently (all else equal), it could have been a 8/9-move ZBLL versus an R perm, and in yet another alternate universe where the last layer corners were also oriented differently, it could have been a J perm versus this bad T case.

You need to look at the method as a whole, not by nitpicking individual solves. In some situations, method A is better, and in some other situations, method B is better, so the real question is: when you cannot easily distinguish whether you're in the former type of situation or the latter type, which method is better on average? Or if you're at the frontier and hunting for records (as opposed to just trying to do well), which method will give you better chances of breaking a record?

I don't think it's set in stone that the RrU alg you wrote is definitively better than the hedge-based alg that Xuanyi used (but also I was clearly not awake enough to notice it in the Cube Explorer output – clearly I have not genned algs in a while). RrU forces a grip shift that the hedge-based alg doesn't need.
Click to expand...
I mean bad alg for this solve and this case
 
Last edited:
Eric4112 said:
This 8 year old almost got the first sub 4 average.
He's called Xuanyi Geng, and this is his times for second round in a comp:
3.89 3.90 5.17 4.02 5.03
If he got a better final solve he would have beaten Yiheng and possibly gotten the first sub 4 average. The reason he messed up the 11.03 is he did a really wierd alg which gave him a bad oll and a terrible ZBLL (yes he does ZBLL all 500 algs). But if he did a better alg, he would've gotten a oll skip and would get one of the easiest ZBLL's.
Needless to say we are screwed. I never in a million years thought Yiheng would have competition.
By the way the comp was Hangzhou Open 2024
Click to expand...
we already have multiple threads for this topic, you can check those out and post this in there without clogging up the home page with more threads that have already been talked about. great points though
 
Eric4112 said:
This 8 year old almost got the first sub 4 average.
He's called Xuanyi Geng, and this is his times for second round in a comp:
3.89 3.90 5.17 4.02 5.03
If he got a better final solve he would have beaten Yiheng and possibly gotten the first sub 4 average. The reason he messed up the 11.03 is he did a really wierd alg which gave him a bad oll and a terrible ZBLL (yes he does ZBLL all 500 algs). But if he did a better alg, he would've gotten a oll skip and would get one of the easiest ZBLL's.
Needless to say we are screwed. I never in a million years thought Yiheng would have competition.
By the way the comp was Hangzhou Open 2024
Click to expand...
I have seen Xuanyi Geng upclose.

It is a matter of time before he becomes the undisputed world record holder for a very long time!
 
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