Klaudiusz Szyprocinski
Member
- Joined
- Dec 12, 2018
- Messages
- 73
Hi there today I was wondering which method has lower God's Number for 3x3? CFOP or roux?
Probably CFOP, because even though Roux has a slightly lower movecount, it has tons of slice moves for LSE, and using HTM they would count as two moves, so it would be more than CFOP.Hi there today I was wondering which method has lower God's Number for 3x3? CFOP or roux?
no offence but i don't think that question makes sense. you can just use extremely long pairs or extremely long lse for roux, so they both have infinite.
then probably roux if you count slice turns as 1 moveMaximum optimal number of moves to solve any random position with roux or cfop (full cn)
yeah, but I'm more interested in HTMthen probably roux if you count slice turns as 1 move
Again, HTM would probably be CFOP because Roux has too many slice moves.yeah, but I'm more interested in HTM
This is not how roux works. LSE is done in 3 steps, EOLRa, insert ULUR edges, 4c. Your high end estates are way off.Roux is only a six-step method:
1. First block
2. Second block
3. CMLL
4. EOLR setup (either set up to arrow or solve 4a)
5. EOLR
6. 4c
On one hand, you're right, I misremembered what EOLR is like. Consider my post to be with an EOLR variant rather than standard EOLR, then.This is not how roux works. LSE is done in 3 steps, EOLRa, insert ULUR edges, 4c. Your high end estates are way off.
FB 9
SB 17
CMLL 13
EOLRa 9
Insert ULUR 3
L4E: 5
This is worst case scenario for roux
The difference is that you are trying to do it is HTM while godcubing is doing his numbers in STM. Also, the case you gave should have either the white or yellow center on top, since otherwise you have to do an unneccesary extra move to orient centers.On one hand, you're right, I misremembered what EOLR is like. Consider my post to be with an EOLR variant rather than standard EOLR, then.
On the other hand, this does not materially affect my argument. Your numbers are also wildly inaccurate. I know for a fact that CMLL is 11 optimal because I checked it as I wrote my above post; L4E's worst case (dots) also needs 8 moves. Inserting ULUR needs 4 moves (AUF, M2, AUF) and at most one move at the end can cancel with L4E. And how would you do EOLRa for this case in only 9 moves?
(Also, my numbers all never accounted for cancellations to begin with, because cancellations make this substantially more complicated. Where do you draw the line between using a longer alg that cancels more moves versus just combining the steps?)
1. CMLL is on average like 11.5 but you wanted worst case and my longest CMLL is 13 moves it's also symmetrical so no pre auf is necessary.Your numbers are also wildly inaccurate. I know for a fact that CMLL is 11 optimal because I checked it as I wrote my above post; L4E's worst case (dots) also needs 8 moves. Inserting ULUR needs 4 moves (AUF, M2, AUF) and at most one move at the end can cancel with L4E. And how would you do EOLRa for this case in only 9 moves?
The difference is that you are trying to do it is HTM while godcubing is doing his numbers in STM. Also, the case you gave should have either the white or yellow center on top, since otherwise you have to do an unneccesary extra move to orient centers.
I said that I'd be using FTM right at the very start of my post, and so did the OP of this thread (albeit not in the top post). It's not my fault if GodCubing can't read and decides they want to answer a question different from the one asked by the OP.I don't mean any hate, but when I feel obligated to spread truth. If you are doing this in HTM I disrespectfully disagree with that metric for movecount evaluation.
Your longest CMLL is not using a move-optimal alg for it then. We're not discussing move count of speed-optimal algs here (that would be silly; you should just measure execution time instead); we're discussing move count of move-optimal algs.1. CMLL is on average like 11.5 but you wanted worst case and my longest CMLL is 13 moves it's also symmetrical so no pre auf is necessary.
Sheeesh. You're out here taking heads.CLL preserving F2L (i.e. not just F2B) has been known since before you were born to need at most 11 moves.
Same with roux - you could solve a super efficient F2B with Psedo or NM and then do an ACMLL that forces an LSE skip...This depends on how you define CFOP and Roux.
For example, for CFOP, this moves might go down significantly if you use
xxxcross, pseudoslotting, ZBLL, EO etc.