WV, COLL, and such

[DaveyCow]

So I have been researching LL and F2LL methods (here by F2LL I'm referring to methods that influence LL during F2L, not just WV) and am having a hard time figuring out if any are worth it or have any advantages. I'm not fast at all and definitely need to work on other things if I'm looking for speed, but I want to learn a LL/F2LL method just for the fun and knowledge of the cube. What do you think is a good/efficient/"easy to learn" LL/F2LL system? COLL is great but has 42 cases where as WV only has 27 and a good chance of a LL skip, but what is the probability of encountering a WV case say, compared to a COLL case? And is Edge control/VH more effective/higher probability of encountering? and....

So there are many factors involved - efficiency of alg, probability of encountering the case, ability to combine with other LL/F2LL substeps, etc... I'm interested in understanding all these "intertwinings" (for lack of better words). Again, I'm not asking all this for the sake of me getting faster i (coz I have a ton of other things to work on to help me get faster and only *eventually* all this would get me faster), but for the sake of knowledge and interest.

Thx for reading my nooby post

 

[NaeosPsy]

COLL is good for OH, WV isn't so bad(I can get good times when I get it), but you should choose one of them, because they don't work together. WV should come up as much as COLL. VH is pretty bad and unnefective, you don't need anything more than partial edge control.
You should check out MGLS too.

 

[DaveyCow]

COLL is good for OH, WV isn't so bad(I can get good times when I get it), but you should choose one of them, because they don't work together. WV should come up as much as COLL. VH is pretty bad and unnefective, you don't need anything more than partial edge control.
You should check out MGLS too.

Thx! this is great advice!

 

[CubezUBR]

If you do vh and know all colls its something like one in 6 chance of a pll skip, but vh is inpractical for cases where you cant just sledgehammer etc. you should lear many things and tricks because you might have a case and it can speed up the solve.

Not that you should listen to me, im 18 seconds slow

 

[Ranzha]

Dave!

If you'd like an F2LL method, I'd suggest EOLS+WV. It's basically full edge control, pairing up the fourth pair, and then doing WV. I'm pretty sure you know how to orient edges (and if you don't, fb msg me), and pairing up the fourth pair 2-gen is very intuitive. From there, WV can be rather nice or rather horrible depending on the case.

Also, there's WVhax, where you recognise the WV case and solve using a "2-look" solution, similar to the idea "compound OLL". One look, two algs back-to-back. For example, set up: L' U2 R U' R' U2 L. Two-look solution: (R U' R') (R' U2 R U (R' U' R U)2 R' U R).

WV + MW =

 

[spyr0th3dr4g0n]

I would suggest leaning towards COLL, even if you only learn a few algs you can still have a fairly good recognition of when you are going to get a PLL with all the corners correct, which can be pretty useful, especially on bigger cubes.

 

[brian724080]

WV, or Summer Variation

I've been wondering lately about last layer options. Is it better to learn WV (Winter Variation), Summer Variation (SV?), or both of them? Is it really that useful if I only learn one set and not the other? Furthermore, I'm not sure which one comes up more often, and awkward F2L cases may come up, so that it may be inconvenient to perform the algorithms.

P.S. I use ZZ, therefore all the edges are pre-oriented, so please do not take that into consideration.

 

[Ranzha]

I've been wondering lately about last layer options. Is it better to learn WV (Winter Variation), Summer Variation (SV?), or both of them? Is it really that useful if I only learn one set and not the other? Furthermore, I'm not sure which one comes up more often, and awkward F2L cases may come up, so that it may be inconvenient to perform the algorithms.

P.S. I use ZZ, therefore all the edges are pre-oriented, so please do not take that into consideration.

Either, both, whatever floats your boat. Just know that in some cases it is easier and more efficient to solve "straight" as opposed to with additional non-method-specific subsets.

 

[TDM]

I've been wondering lately about last layer options. Is it better to learn WV (Winter Variation), Summer Variation (SV?), or both of them? Is it really that useful if I only learn one set and not the other? Furthermore, I'm not sure which one comes up more often, and awkward F2L cases may come up, so that it may be inconvenient to perform the algorithms.

If you're going to use WV, then remember it'll only work when the pieces are paired. You'll have to pair them if you have a SV case. Personally, I'd learn both sets (that's actually what I'm doing right now. But I only know the WV cases with 0-1 corners misoriented), but you have to remember that that'll only work if the last pair is FR. The way I do ZZ, it is most of the time (left half first (blockbuilding using the right half) then right half, doing the back pair first unless there's a really easy FR pair case), but for others it isn't. Something like COLL is less algs, and will work in every solve. You do what you want; I think some of the easy WV cases are quite useful to learn anyway, so I'd just learn WV, and some of COLL. But COLL would be better to learn than WV/SV.

 

[brian724080]

I think some of the easy WV cases are quite useful to learn anyway, so I'd just learn WV, and some of COLL. But COLL would be better to learn than WV/SV.

I guess I'll go with the easy cases and use it when the time comes, although it probably won't come up that often. Also, is it possible to get COLL and CLL mixed up?