What Layers do you store 4x4 Edges?

[Kian]

4x4 reduction method question.

Do you store your paired edges on the U/D layers, or L/R layers? I was wondering, because I store them on U/D layers, and I've seen Robert Yau on hi-games do L and R layers (I think, he turns so fast it's hard to tell).

don't worry about storing anything anywhere.

 

[DavidWoner]

Yet neither of you solve cross on left. *smacks Ellis and pokey with a large trout*

lol. How do you know I don't solve with cross on Left? Well, I don't but I don't think there's any reason that you would know that. But the reason for that is because it makes my head hurt. More than getting slapped with a large trout.

http://www.speedsolving.com/forum/showpost.php?p=133004&postcount=8

 

[Sa967St]

Yet neither of you solve cross on left. *smacks Ellis and pokey with a large trout*

that wasn't very nice and where did you get that trout from?
actually I do solve cross on left sometime, like here
*throws a fridge at valut312*

 

[Ellis]

Yet neither of you solve cross on left. *smacks Ellis and pokey with a large trout*

lol. How do you know I don't solve with cross on Left? Well, I don't but I don't think there's any reason that you would know that. But the reason for that is because it makes my head hurt. More than getting slapped with a large trout.

http://www.speedsolving.com/forum/showpost.php?p=133004&postcount=8

I was actually expecting to get this link as a response: http://www.speedsolving.com/forum/poll.php?do=showresults&pollid=268

Did you go through all my posts to find something about me saying I did cross on bottom?
:rolleyes:

 

[byu]

I'm totally lost... like seriously.

Assuming that I use M instead of E, If I have an edge at UFl (sorry, I don't know the correct notation) and the one to be paired at UBr, then I would do:

r' U' R' U r

and then look for the next one. Is this a bad way to do it? In this case I am "storing" in the R layer

 

[DavidWoner]

Yet neither of you solve cross on left. *smacks Ellis and pokey with a large trout*

that wasn't very nice and where did you get that trout from?
actually I do solve cross on left sometime, like here
*throws a fridge at valut312*

onoes! poor valut! I will miss him.

also, one pair doesn't count, especially if its your first.

Yet neither of you solve cross on left. *smacks Ellis and pokey with a large trout*

lol. How do you know I don't solve with cross on Left? Well, I don't but I don't think there's any reason that you would know that. But the reason for that is because it makes my head hurt. More than getting slapped with a large trout.

http://www.speedsolving.com/forum/showpost.php?p=133004&postcount=8

I was actually expecting to get this link as a response: http://www.speedsolving.com/forum/poll.php?do=showresults&pollid=268

Did you go through all my posts to find something about me saying I did cross on bottom?
:rolleyes:

http://www.speedsolving.com/forum/search.php?searchid=338841

 

[Ellis]

I'm totally lost... like seriously.

Assuming that I use M instead of E, If I have an edge at UFl (sorry, I don't know the correct notation) and the one to be paired at UBr, then I would do:

r' U' R' U r

and then look for the next one. Is this a bad way to do it? In this case I am "storing" in the R layer

Yes. First of all, that is single edge pairing.. No one does that, it would be silly. Also, don't use UBr (or UFl for that matter) for the buffer, that is also silly. My main problem with calling it storing is that unlike.... say freeslice 5x5 edge pairing, you generally don't care about what is in the slice, unless you are purposely keeping them filled. The only edges I would really care about keeping filled are on the U and D layer, but you would say that I store in the R and L layers. I get what your point is, I just don't know if I would call it that. It isn't the same as what you would do with freeslice 5x5 pairing. If you question was worded something like "which layers do you use to insert unsolved edges from", it would have made a little more sense to me. 4x4 edge pairing is usually much more free and solved edges can generally be "stored" anywhere no matter which slice you use for pairing.

And Vault.... okay okay...
You're still sneaky.

 

[byu]

I'm totally lost... like seriously.

Assuming that I use M instead of E, If I have an edge at UFl (sorry, I don't know the correct notation) and the one to be paired at UBr, then I would do:

r' U' R' U r

and then look for the next one. Is this a bad way to do it? In this case I am "storing" in the R layer

Yes. First of all, that is single edge pairing.. No one does that, it would be silly. Also, don't use UBr (or UFl for that matter) for the buffer, that is also silly. My main problem with calling it storing is that unlike.... say freeslice 5x5 edge pairing, you generally don't care about what is in the slice, unless you are purposely keeping them filled. The only edges I would really care about keeping filled are on the U and D layer, but you would say that I store in the R and L layers. I get what your point is, I just don't know if I would call it that. It isn't the same as what you would do with freeslice 5x5 pairing. If you question was worded something like "which layers do you use to insert unsolved edges from", it would have made a little more sense to me. 4x4 edge pairing is usually much more free and solved edges can generally be "stored" anywhere no matter which slice you use for pairing.

And Vault.... okay okay...
You're still sneaky.

Weird, that made it more confusing...

So is what I do called "storing" because if it's not, how should I do it? If I were to do the 6-2-2-2 method, when I make the first three edges, I have to store them somewhere in order to slice back to get the others, right?

 

[Ellis]

If I were to do the 6-2-2-2 method, when I make the first three edges, I have to store them somewhere in order to slice back to get the others, right?

Thats exactly why I use 6-2-2-2, they are already stored exactly where I want them to be, in the M slice. Those would be the only edges I care about storing, but you would say I store in the R/L layers. I understand what you are saying, I just don't think it's the proper way to state it because 4x4 edges can be stored anywhere no matter which slice you are using to pair. I just don't think it is the same thing as storing 5x5 edges if you use freeslice. I use vertical AVG on 5x5 but I don't consider it storing my edges in the R/L layers because they could literally be anywhere besides the two edge groups I use to pair.

Edit: Yes, what you are doing is storing, but edges are not stored solely in either R/L or U/D layers. I'm saying that it can be beneficial to store edges on the back of your slice which will not be where all your other solved edges are kept.

 

[Sa967St]

also, one pair doesn't count, especially if its your first.

you said neither Ellis or me solve cross on left but I do sometimes solve cross on left. I almost never do F2L pairs on left, but thats only because I learned to solve F2L on D and got used to it. I like solving f2l pairs on left, I'm just not fast at it.

On Topic: I taught myself edge pairing (except for the last 2 pairs) and chose to use M slices and x rotations over E slices and y rotations (for 5x5x5). If I learned edge pairing from somewhere I might have learned to store edge pairs on U and D, but instead I just do it the way I prefer.

 

[DavidWoner]

also, one pair doesn't count, especially if its your first.

you said neither Ellis or me solve cross on left but I do sometimes solve cross on left. I almost never do F2L pairs on left, but thats only because I learned to solve F2L on D and got used to it. I like solving f2l pairs on left, I'm just not fast at it.

well here is our misunderstanding. I meant solve cross on left, as in solve the f2l while having your cross on the left.

Also, why was I the only person to vote "other" in this poll while numerous people said that they do not store edges?

 

[Ellis]

I said L/R only because I thought what he was really getting at was whether the edge pairing was done with the E or M slice. If I could, I would take it back and put other because it makes more sense.

 

[JLarsen]

Although that's very true, I find that for U/D, I can see all 4 tredges (or whatever they turn out to be depending on the puzzle) clearly, and I can generally remember which pieces are on top. I can normally track edge pieces (if one can call them as such) easier due to solving F2L on D and therefore my continuity is better.

And I just can't do F inserts. I'm not sure why; my tps goes uber-slow, and lookahead vanishes for the next .5s after doing it (which ruins rhythm, which destroys solve).

Ok well, if you have a really good memory as to what's on top, then I guess that the look ahead wouldn't be terrible, but I still think D moves are rather annoying to be looking for and setting up edges... of course thats just opinion.

As for F insertions, I think I may have misunderstood what you said originally. But don't you still use F insertions with E slice pairing? I remember coming to the conclusion when debating whether to use M or E slice that there was generally no difference in the amount of F face insertions between the two methods.

Yeah the D moves are annoying, but those F insertions would annoy me more. Actually, I think they're equally annoying, and I could do either. =]

 

[TMOY]

I don't use reduction, but I store my paired edges in the U/D layers anyway
(the U/D or L/R question applies to the CF-based versions of cage as well)

 

[fanwuq]

Yet neither of you solve cross on left. *smacks Ellis and pokey with a large trout*

lol. How do you know I don't solve with cross on Left? Well, I don't but I don't think there's any reason that you would know that. But the reason for that is because it makes my head hurt. More than getting slapped with a large trout.

http://www.speedsolving.com/forum/showpost.php?p=133004&postcount=8

I was actually expecting to get this link as a response: http://www.speedsolving.com/forum/poll.php?do=showresults&pollid=268


Did you go through all my posts to find something about me saying I did cross on bottom?
:rolleyes:

That thread doesn't work as a good example. I build my cross on F or R, but use cross on D F2L.

Also, why was I the only person to vote "other" in this poll while numerous people said that they do not store edges?

I don't think of it as storing, but the edges do get "stored" through displacement.

 

[Ellis]

Also, why was I the only person to vote "other" in this poll while numerous people said that they do not store edges?

I don't think of it as storing, but the edges do get "stored" through displacement.

But do those edges solely get stored in the L/R or U/D layers? The point I was trying to make is that they get stored anywhere as long as they aren't in the only 2 edge groups you are working with. Imagine you are doing 2 at a time from with the M slice and you see an easy insertion of the URf edge just with the move U, if there was a solved dedge at UL, then now its stored in the slice which isn't L/R. I think of the question re-worded as "when you are solving a 4x4, which layers are all your solved edges located?" I would say "other" to that question.

 

[Paul Wagner]

i used to use E and i've been converting to e its hard though to change

 

[rachmaninovian]

I don't use reduction, but I store my paired edges in the U/D layers anyway
(the U/D or L/R question applies to the CF-based versions of cage as well)

nah, R and L layers rocks xD better fingertricks....

 

[EmersonHerrmann]

Ellis said earlier that there was F insertions when using E slice. Yeah, you can either rotate and solve the edge, or you can do, say, F R' F' R.

 

[Sg.Speedcuber]

I don't store edges.I just continue to the next one.