What am I doing wrong?

[speedcuber50]

I use a lot of fingertricks, but they're only marginally faster than so-called "wrist turns", even after I've been doing them non-stop since I got the Zhacnhi.

My Cross+F2L time is between 13 and 15 seconds on an average solve, with OLL and PLL each taking between 2 and 4 seconds (OLL is usually slightly longer than PLL, espesscially if I get a 2-look case).

The "Decent Lookahead" means that I can turn as fast as possible (remember that that's a bit too slow) and not have to pause more than once during F2L, and not for more than half a second.

Also, I get this strange thing where half my times are like 17 seconds, and half are like 32 seconds. Why?

 

[Spaxxy]

I use a lot of fingertricks, but they're only marginally faster than so-called "wrist turns", even after I've been doing them non-stop since I got the Zhacnhi.

My Cross+F2L time is between 13 and 15 seconds on an average solve, with OLL and PLL each taking between 2 and 4 seconds (OLL is usually slightly longer than PLL, espesscially if I get a 2-look case).

The "Decent Lookahead" means that I can turn as fast as possible (remember that that's a bit too slow) and not have to pause more than once during F2L, and not for more than half a second.

Also, I get this strange thing where half my times are like 17 seconds, and half are like 32 seconds. Why?

Film yourself solving. That way, you can really find out what is going wrong. I thought I had good lookahead a month ago (I was around 26 seconds), but then I filmed myself and was able to see that my lookahead was horrible. So I fixed it, and now I'm almost sub 20.

 

[sneaklyfox]

I use a lot of fingertricks, but they're only marginally faster than so-called "wrist turns", even after I've been doing them non-stop since I got the Zhacnhi.

My Cross+F2L time is between 13 and 15 seconds on an average solve, with OLL and PLL each taking between 2 and 4 seconds (OLL is usually slightly longer than PLL, espesscially if I get a 2-look case).

The "Decent Lookahead" means that I can turn as fast as possible (remember that that's a bit too slow) and not have to pause more than once during F2L, and not for more than half a second.

Also, I get this strange thing where half my times are like 17 seconds, and half are like 32 seconds. Why?

Either you do turn really slow or you are very inefficient or you are lying about how good your look ahead is. Do you have a video?

 

[jayefbe]

I use a lot of fingertricks, but they're only marginally faster than so-called "wrist turns", even after I've been doing them non-stop since I got the Zhacnhi.

My Cross+F2L time is between 13 and 15 seconds on an average solve, with OLL and PLL each taking between 2 and 4 seconds (OLL is usually slightly longer than PLL, espesscially if I get a 2-look case).

The "Decent Lookahead" means that I can turn as fast as possible (remember that that's a bit too slow) and not have to pause more than once during F2L, and not for more than half a second.

Also, I get this strange thing where half my times are like 17 seconds, and half are like 32 seconds. Why?

My guess, like everyone else, you're pausing a lot more than you think you are. I think we all pause a lot more than we think we do during the actual solve. That's why taping yourself, or at the very least, honestly evaluating your abilities is important.

As far as your turning, I have no idea how finger turning could ever be as slow as wrist turns. Either your lookahead is slow, so your slow turning can keep up with your eyes, or your turning style needs a lot of work.

As far as half of your solves being 17s and the other half 32s, you're probably only remembering the really good and the really bad solves. Use something like qqtimer to keep track of your practice sessions. Everyone's solves will vary over a session, but not that significantly. I personally like being consistent in my solve times. I'm much happier about a new ao100 pb than stringing together a few flukey solves and getting a new pb ao5.

I thought I had good lookahead a month ago (I was around 26 seconds), but then I filmed myself and was able to see that my lookahead was horrible. So I fixed it, and now I'm almost sub 20.

I'm sub-20, I'd call my lookahead ok. It's not awful, definitely not good. I believe lookahead is something one constantly works on and gets incrementally better at. I wouldn't ever say lookahead can be fixed.

 

[speedcuber50]

I've tried filming, but I don't have a decent camera. It can only manage about 2 fps, which is not enough to film cubing.

@jayefbe I'm not just remembering half my times; most solves are either 15 to 19 seconds or 25 to 32 seconds. About one in five is somewhere in between. I'm not consistent in my times. Also, my wrist turns were quite fast (about 2.5 tps), and my fingertricks are about the same. I don't usually exceed 3 tps as a rough guide.

 

[jayefbe]

@jayefbe I'm not just remembering half my times; most solves are either 15 to 19 seconds or 25 to 32 seconds. About one in five is somewhere in between. I'm not consistent in my times. Also, my wrist turns were quite fast (about 2.5 tps), and my fingertricks are about the same. I don't usually exceed 3 tps as a rough guide.

Do an average of ~50 and post your times. A bimodal distribution would be very unusual. I still think the distribution is much more even then you think. Our minds look for patterns, even when they aren't there. As you're solving you put your times in "good" and "bad" categories, and now you think there's a bimodal distribution when there isn't one.

3tps is really slow. Is this the best you can do for a fast PLL? How fast can you do a T-perm or a J-perm? If these are taking you ~4 seconds then your turning style/finger tricks need a lot of work.

If by 3tps you're talking about a full solve, then what's holding you back is your look ahead. If someone is averaging a minute, then it doesn't matter how they turn because their head and eyes can't keep up with their turns.

Wait, I just did the math, a 15 second CFOP solve is >3tps. So where are your figures coming from?

I really want to see a video of your solves, a lot of what you're saying contradicts itself.

 

[speedcuber50]

"Where are your figures coming from?" My timer LOL!

T-perm is my fastest, and it takes me between 2 and 3 seconds.

EDIT: Will post an average of 50 over the next few days!

 

[jayefbe]

"Where are your figures coming from?" My timer LOL!

T-perm is my fastest, and it takes me between 2 and 3 seconds.

EDIT: Will post an average of 50 over the next few days!

Your timer gives you tps? If so, that's a timer I need to get.

My point is, you say you turn at rarely over 3tps. Yet, you are capable of getting 15 second solves. Which is >3tps for the whole solve. Plus, I'm assuming your LL tps is much faster than your F2L tps. So either you're not getting 15 second solves or you're capable of much faster tps than you're saying.

With that said, 2-3 sec for a T-perm is on the slow to very slow side. A video would be helpful in trying to determine why. Without that, all you can do is compare your turning style to fast solvers. There's plenty of PLL videos on YouTube.

 

[pipkiksass]

Your timer gives you tps? If so, that's a timer I need to get.

My point is, you say you turn at rarely over 3tps. Yet, you are capable of getting 15 second solves. Which is >3tps for the whole solve. Plus, I'm assuming your LL tps is much faster than your F2L tps. So either you're not getting 15 second solves or you're capable of much faster tps than you're saying.

With that said, 2-3 sec for a T-perm is on the slow to very slow side. A video would be helpful in trying to determine why. Without that, all you can do is compare your turning style to fast solvers. There's plenty of PLL videos on YouTube.

Have to agree with much of this - if your fastest PLL is 2-3 seconds, and you're getting solves in the 15-19 second region, that means on those solves CFO are <=12 seconds. More likely less than 12, unless you're getting T perms on every one of these solves. On an 'average', pretty efficient CFOP solve, CFO would be about 45 moves, so that's nearly 4tps (3.75 to be exact).

COMPLETELY agree about the bimodal distribution. If you're capable of cross + F2L + OLL in <12s then 32 seconds means a 20 second PLL!?!? Normal distribution is FAR more likely, that's why all timers that produce stats provide you with standard deviation, because normal distribution is assumed.

Post a video of a decent average, at least Ao12, and post the stats from an Ao50. That's the only way people will be able to give you genuine advice, and stop just ripping apart the highly dubious breakdowns provided.

 

[speedcuber50]

3 tps is not an accurate figure; it's just an estimate from what it feels like during a solve.

I rarely get 15 second solves, and usually it's a T-perm or another of my fastest PLLs. On 15 seconds solves my CFO is exceptionally quick for me, sometimes being as little as 10 to 12 seconds (it's usually a rather easy F2L with mostly 2-gen cases or R'UR-type insertions).

I don't turn any faster during LL than during F2L simply because I can't figure out how to do so.

 

[TDM]

3 tps is not an accurate figure; it's just an estimate from what it feels like during a solve.

I feel like I have a TPS over 3, but if I average about 60 moves and average 24s, that's only 2.5. What it feels like is not always similar to the actual value. Watch videos of yourself: I only saw how slow I was when looking at myself.

I don't turn any faster during LL than during F2L simply because I can't figure out how to do so.

Practise algorithms. You shouldn't have to turn slower and think during LL in the way you do with F2L.

 

[speedcuber50]

I did a few split times earlier this morning; I'm not sure when I'll have time for the ao50, but I will do it ASAP. Should it all be done in one sitting?

Anyway, here are the split times:

Spoiler: times

[table="width: 500, class: grid, align: center"]
[tr]
[td][/td]
[td]Cross[/td]
[td]F2L (without Cross)[/td]
[td]LL (OLL + PLL)[/td]
[/tr]
[tr]
[td]Solve 1:[/td]
[td]6[/td]
[td]10[/td]
[td]8[/td]
[/tr]
[tr]
[td]Sovle 2:[/td]
[td]2[/td]
[td]18[/td]
[td]10[/td]
[/tr]
[tr]
[td]Solve 3:[/td]
[td]2[/td]
[td]13[/td]
[td]7[/td]
[/tr]
[tr]
[td]Solve 4:[/td]
[td]4[/td]
[td]11[/td]
[td]9[/td]
[/tr]
[tr]
[td]Solve 5:[/td]
[td]5[/td]
[td]12[/td]
[td]11[/td]
[/tr]
[tr]
[td]Solve 6:[/td]
[td]3[/td]
[td]12[/td]
[td]7[/td]
[/tr]
[/table]

 

[rj]

Do an average of ~50 and post your times. A bimodal distribution would be very unusual. I still think the distribution is much more even then you think. Our minds look for patterns, even when they aren't there. As you're solving you put your times in "good" and "bad" categories, and now you think there's a bimodal distribution when there isn't one.

3tps is really slow. Is this the best you can do for a fast PLL? How fast can you do a T-perm or a J-perm? If these are taking you ~4 seconds then your turning style/finger tricks need a lot of work.

If by 3tps you're talking about a full solve, then what's holding you back is your look ahead. If someone is averaging a minute, then it doesn't matter how they turn because their head and eyes can't keep up with their turns.

Wait, I just did the math, a 15 second CFOP solve is >3tps. So where are your figures coming from?

I really want to see a video of your solves, a lot of what you're saying contradicts itself.

duh, He's ineffecient. I do 5 tps, and get ~35 second avgs.

 

[pipkiksass]

most solves are either 15 to 19 seconds or 25 to 32 seconds. About one in five is somewhere in between.

I did a few split times earlier this morning:

Spoiler: times

[table="width: 500, class: grid, align: center"]
[tr]
[td][/td]
[td]Cross[/td]
[td]F2L (without Cross)[/td]
[td]LL (OLL + PLL)[/td]
[/tr]
[tr]
[td]Solve 1:[/td]
[td]6[/td]
[td]10[/td]
[td]8[/td]
[/tr]
[tr]
[td]Sovle 2:[/td]
[td]2[/td]
[td]18[/td]
[td]10[/td]
[/tr]
[tr]
[td]Solve 3:[/td]
[td]2[/td]
[td]13[/td]
[td]7[/td]
[/tr]
[tr]
[td]Solve 4:[/td]
[td]4[/td]
[td]11[/td]
[td]9[/td]
[/tr]
[tr]
[td]Solve 5:[/td]
[td]5[/td]
[td]12[/td]
[td]11[/td]
[/tr]
[tr]
[td]Solve 6:[/td]
[td]3[/td]
[td]12[/td]
[td]7[/td]
[/tr]
[/table]

Even this small 6 solve sample disproves your bimodal distribution theory: 24, 30, 22, 24, 28, 22... you said only 1 in 5 was between 19 and 25 seconds... I make that 4/6 or 75% falling into this group, which is entirely suggestive of a normal distribution.

 

[1LastSolve]

Does that help?
Yeah, you just need more practice. Try and get used to fingertricks because they help.
This is what I watch when I need inspiration to practice and get better at cubing.

 

[immortalchaos29]

duh, He's ineffecient. I do 5 tps, and get ~35 second avgs.

So you do over 150 turns per solve?

I average 16 seconds and I don't think I've ever gotten 5 TPS except for in prepared solves. 5 TPS is really fast for a complete solve.

 

[speedcuber50]

This is what I watch when I need inspiration to practice and get better at cubing.

I prefer to watch one of the Feliks Zemdegs videos.

 

[ianliu64]

duh, He's ineffecient. I do 5 tps, and get ~35 second avgs.

How do you expect to look ahead with 5 tps...

 

[YddEd]

duh, He's ineffecient. I do 5 tps, and get ~35 second avgs.

5 tps? 35 second averages? REALLY?
I got a 18.15 solve with 2.6 tps .__.

 

[Noahaha]

5 tps? 35 second averages? REALLY?
I got a 18.15 solve with 2.6 tps .__.

I think he means that he can turn at 5 TPS, but pauses a lot.