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VHLS for OH?

Iamdrewbrees

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Joined
Jan 17, 2016
Messages
37
I know that for normal 2H solving, VHLS isn't always quite worth it because a bad VLHS > COLL > EPLL is usually slower than insert > OLL > PLL.

But do you think that using full VLHS is worth it for OH solving to always get an EPLL? And possibly later on using EOLS (ZBLS)? I've heard people say that EOLS isn't worth it cause it's a lot of algs though.

I'm trying to work on EO during F2L like feliks but my lookahead isn't quite good enough to do that fluidly, and it ends up decreasing my times.

Interested to hear your thoughts on this. Getting more into OH and am sub 20 now but LL is definitely my worst part of my solve despite knowing OH plls (or at least the ones that are worth it)
 

phreaker

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Mar 18, 2016
Messages
301
I know that for normal 2H solving, VHLS isn't always quite worth it because a bad VLHS > COLL > EPLL is usually slower than insert > OLL > PLL.

But do you think that using full VLHS is worth it for OH solving to always get an EPLL? And possibly later on using EOLS (ZBLS)? I've heard people say that EOLS isn't worth it cause it's a lot of algs though.

I'm trying to work on EO during F2L like feliks but my lookahead isn't quite good enough to do that fluidly, and it ends up decreasing my times.

Interested to hear your thoughts on this. Getting more into OH and am sub 20 now but LL is definitely my worst part of my solve despite knowing OH plls (or at least the ones that are worth it)

Can't all the PLLs be sub 2s? Or about 2.5s? At that point PLL + OLL should be ~4-5s?

I don't know how bad OLL is for a CFOPer, given that I solve with ZZ ;). OCLL is usually pretty darn quick, and I have OCLLs I need to replace, and I still think that.
 

sqAree

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From a CFOPer who is around 20 OH too:

I just began to learn VHLS to increase the probability of my ZBLLs. I'd say most of the cases are worth it if you know COLL and even more if you know some ZBLLs. There is a case that is just a cancelled sledge into fruruf but even cases like that might be worth it, considering that I saw Feliks doing fruruf separately on LL to get EO to use a ZBLL.

EOLS algs seem to be really bad for OH, I tried generating some OH friendly ones a while ago but wasn't satisfied.
 
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Hey I use ZZ, but I will tell you what I think I can.

Their are two things you could do.

1. Learn Sune OLL and OH PLL

2. Do VHLS, COLL, EPLL

I feel like ZBLS is not very good (at least for OH) when you could just to VHLS.

and Sune OLL is just sunes and fat sunes.
 

Iamdrewbrees

Member
Joined
Jan 17, 2016
Messages
37
Hey I use ZZ, but I will tell you what I think I can.

Their are two things you could do.

1. Learn Sune OLL and OH PLL

2. Do VHLS, COLL, EPLL

I feel like ZBLS is not very good (at least for OH) when you could just to VHLS.

and Sune OLL is just sunes and fat sunes.
Sune OLL? Interesting...
I already know full OLL so I think I'm good. I'm a little confused about what that is though.
 

Iamdrewbrees

Member
Joined
Jan 17, 2016
Messages
37
Cool, I didn't know about that one. At first glance the algs don't look too great. However, it can't be worse than building a pair and then using VHLS. :)

Not too sure it would be worth learning that before even knowing full ZBLL. But I'd like to hear other opinions.
Looking down the list a lot of those Algs actually look pretty good imo. I think that looking at it as learning a huge alg set is unfair though. Most of the Algs are just solving the pair in different ways which can help efficiency too.

A lot of Algs are the same except for something like finish with a sledge instead of an insert. It's definitely not worth it to learn every case (especially the weird ones) but I think it could be beneficial to go through each case and see how it affects EO, because I'm sure a lot of the cases are things you've used in F2L before and didn't use to affect EO.

And again knowing all those cases could help in normal F2L so you know different cases, and maybe could be used for multislotting later on.

TL;DR
It's definitely not a bad idea to learn them, and it would probably be smart to look over them because you might know a lot already and some could be useful in other contexts
 
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