Older cubers discussions

[jayefbe]

Hi, Marcel from Holland here

I started with reduction and got to about ~2:10 avg with a pb around 1:50. When I switched to Yau it took a few days to catch up, and my progress accelerated from there. I'm not sure if I would be faster now if I had started out with Yau. There is so much similarity between Yau and reduction, that I don't think it really matters when you switch.

The last four centers definitely took the longest for me to get used to. I solve with the cross/buffer edge on the right face. I like this because I'm right dominant and most of my center pairing is done with my right hand. It's difficult because you have to identify how to pair the center pieces, while simultaneously remembering to move the buffer edge to the right face before you start turning. It's incredibly awkward, but over time it feels like an automatic subconscious problem.

Pairing the cross edges can feel awkward as well. The first three cross edges have the benefit of not being restricted by centers, so unnecessary turns meant to repair centers aren't necessary. However, it's important to remember where the already made cross dedges are. I've paired up a cross dedge only to find I've broken up a previously made pair many times.

 

[sneaklyfox]

One of these days I'm going to have to get into 4x4. I've done some, but not too seriously and right now I have no good 4x4 to play with. I keep reading this thread and all this talk about 4x4 is making me somewhat envious that I don't get to join in the discussion...

 

[MarcelP]

The last four centers definitely took the longest for me to get used to.

Yes, I am still getting used to that. I am doing a few slow solves per day and it is getting better.

One of these days I'm going to have to get into 4x4. I've done some, but not too seriously and right now I have no good 4x4 to play with. I keep reading this thread and all this talk about 4x4 is making me somewhat envious that I don't get to join in the discussion...

LOL.. You will be super fast in a week.. just like with Pyraminx Only problem with 4 X4 is that it takes a lot longer to do a solve, so 1000 per day or even 100 is way to much. I think I do 5 solves per day. If you get a new 4 X 4, you should get a Shenghou. They are awesome out of the box. But after a few hundred solves they are even better.

 

[sneaklyfox]

LOL.. You will be super fast in a week.. just like with Pyraminx Only problem with 4 X4 is that it takes a lot longer to do a solve, so 1000 per day or even 100 is way to much. I think I do 5 solves per day. If you get a new 2 X 2, you should get a Shenghou. They are awesome out of the box. But after a few hundred solves they are even better.

Well pyraminx was easy because it doesn't take long for a solve unlike 4x4. 1000 per day?? Who has time for 1000 4x4 solves a day? I don't even do 1000 3x3 solves a day. I don't even think I would have the time to do 1000 pyraminx solves a day lol. Well, whenever I do get into 4x4, I will probably get whatever is best on the market at the time. Right now, it's SS. I don't think I would have the time to mod it though. Anyway, I'm sure it will take much longer than a week to get super fast at it, but thanks for your confidence.

 

[MarcelP]

Anyway, I'm sure it will take much longer than a week to get super fast at it, but thanks for your confidence.

Well, I remember you getting sub 30 with 3 X 3 on 4 X 4 allready so you allready can turn fast. That helps a lot. I think my 3 X 3 on 4 X 4 are around 40 - 50 seconds..

 

[Lchu613]

I haven't done a timed solve with the 4x4 yet, I should get around to that...

 

[Kattenvriendin]

Hey Marcel.. time to post something here.. we need to stay active on our unwanted threads now LOL

 

[Lchu613]

Yes, very.
My parents think that cubing takes away from my school time and homework time and things like that
What they don't realize is that the opposite is true

 

[sneaklyfox]

Yes, very.
My parents think that cubing takes away from my school time and homework time and things like that
What they don't realize is that the opposite is true

lol

 

[cxinlee]

Yes, very.
My parents think that cubing takes away from my school time and homework time and things like that
What they don't realize is that the opposite is true

Yeah that's exactly what I think. But you realize that your parents are your authority and you can't do anything about it. So I decided to sacrifice my other free time for cubing lol.

 

[MarcelP]

Hey Marcel.. time to post something here..

Yeah, I have something to share. I looked into commutators today:

3X3X3 Fewest moves : 32


Scramble L2 D L2 D' F2 L2 U' B2 F2 D2 U' B R F' U B' F' L' U2 F D2

F R' U R U' L2 U2 R' * D // 2 x 2 x 3 Pseudo block
D' // Pre move to fix pseudo
L F' // 3RD F2L
U L2 U2 F U F' // COMPLETE F2L
D L2 D' L' D L' D' //All but three corners (last move cancelled by pre move )
F2 R B2 R' F2 R B2 R' // * Commutator insert

Solution: F R' U R U' L2 U2 R' F2 R B2 R' F2 R B2 R' D L F' U L2 U2 F U F' D L2 D' L' D L' D'

 

[sneaklyfox]

Yeah, I have something to share. I looked into commutators today:

3X3X3 Fewest moves : 32


Scramble L2 D L2 D' F2 L2 U' B2 F2 D2 U' B R F' U B' F' L' U2 F D2

F R' U R U' L2 U2 R' * D // 2 x 2 x 3 Pseudo block
D' // Pre move to fix pseudo
L F' // 3RD F2L
U L2 U2 F U F' // COMPLETE F2L
D L2 D' L' D L' D' //All but three corners (last move cancelled by pre move )
F2 R B2 R' F2 R B2 R' // * Commutator insert

Solution: F R' U R U' L2 U2 R' F2 R B2 R' F2 R B2 R' D L F' U L2 U2 F U F' D L2 D' L' D L' D'

Wow, that's pretty cool. Just that the last move of your solution is supposed to be D2. But very cool... I haven't done any FMC stuff at all. It looks fun though. Seems like you're doing well in that.

 

[mark49152]

Yeah looks fun - I wish I had more time to try these things too! Would also like to try BLD.

 

[Cubenovice]

3X3X3 Fewest moves : 32


Scramble L2 D L2 D' F2 L2 U' B2 F2 D2 U' B R F' U B' F' L' U2 F D2

F R' U R U' L2 U2 R' * D // 2 x 2 x 3 Pseudo block
D' // Pre move to fix pseudo
L F' // 3RD F2L
U L2 U2 F U F' // COMPLETE F2L
D L2 D' L' D L' D' //All but three corners (last move cancelled by pre move )
F2 R B2 R' F2 R B2 R' // * Commutator insert

Solution: F R' U R U' L2 U2 R' F2 R B2 R' F2 R B2 R' D L F' U L2 U2 F U F' D L2 D' L' D L' D'

Nice
Too bad about the skeleton not having any good insertions...
I found 5 possible locations for insertions but none of them cancelled any moves.
Insertion Finder confirms that there indeed are no cancelling insertions.

So all in all you could just have added a commutator at the end of the solve for the same result
L2 B R B' L2 B R' B' or U' R2 U L2 U' R2 U L2
But at this stage in your FMC career the insertion attempt mus thave been some great practice!
How many possible locations forn an insertion did you find?

Wow, that's pretty cool. Just that the last move of your solution is supposed to be D2. But very cool... I haven't done any FMC stuff at all. It looks fun though. Seems like you're doing well in that.

In Marcel's 2nd line he mentiones the premove D'.
This equates to the final move D' becoming D2 when not performing the premove.
So marcels notation is correct

Just remember that in submitting a solution in an official FMC you must write it without any extra annotations so there it would have to end on D2 indeed.

 

[MarcelP]

Seems like you're doing well in that.

Yeah, it's real fun and something quite different than speedcubing.But I have one of the best FMC-ers to teach me every once in a while. I am getting better

Would also like to try BLD.

That's too hard for me.

Nice
But at this stage in your FMC career the insertion attempt mus thave been some great practice!
How many possible locations forn an insertion did you find?

None, and I have found this one by accident. I understand the concept of commutators 100%, but finding them on a scrambled cube is something completely different. I need loads of practice on that.

 

[Kattenvriendin]

Amazing that you can do this *giggle* I wouldn't know how to solve the cube other than what I am used to, and then just try and find the fewest moves way for F2L and continue from there. That is what I'd do in any case. Obviously I don't have a clue hahaha

 

[MarcelP]

Well, FMC is very hard in the beginning. I find it very difficult. The trick is to find a very good beginning of about 6 - 8 moves that has big potential. With normal F2L that is often not the case. If you are good at block building, then FMC is a lot easier.

 

[Cubenovice]

Marcel,

I suppose Guus already told you this: for insertions you use stickers to mark the pieces you need to cycle.
This way the pieces to be cycled stand out. You are also allowed to do this during WCA competitions.
I use small round stickers and I think I have seen Guus using those pre-printed stickers that come with VHS tapes .

I typically first write my solution without pre-moves (so actually adding them at the back), then check it on the cube and if it indeed leaves three corners I sticker them. So for your solution it would be the D2 ending.

Reason for taking the solution without pre-moves: solving the cube with or without premoves changes which corners need to be stickered!
If you sticker on the cube with the pre move (s) and then by accident look for insertions without applying it/them your insertions will be wrong.

So to be on the safe side I always correct the pre-moves before stickering.

Before you get too creative:
Insertion-hunting on either normal, inverse or pre-move solutions will give you the same insertions. (It is just that your stickers will be on different cubies).

Currently at work but if you like I can indicate where there are insertions possible later today.
Then it is up to you to post the commutators

 

[sneaklyfox]

Reading on what you guys are all saying, FMC sounds really fun, but I don't know if I will get into it anytime in the near future. Maybe when I'm a fair bit older and brain is working slowly and fingers aren't as fast then maybe. All the same, it's interesting to me... more than BLD. Personally, I find BLD an impressive trick to the spectator and a boring exercise of memory for myself.

 

[MarcelP]

Currently at work but if you like I can indicate where there are insertions possible later today.
Then it is up to you to post the commutators

Well, Guus told me at work today that we will do a commutator-training-session in near future. I had stickered my cube with the three bad corners at the end of the solve with the pre move done. I had seen a nice video (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FuHHEQV2z4o) but the examples he made where completely different than the cycle that my corners had to make. So..LOL

Reading on what you guys are all saying, FMC sounds really fun, but I don't know if I will get into it anytime in the near future. Maybe when I'm a fair bit older and brain is working slowly and fingers aren't as fast then maybe. All the same, it's interesting to me... more than BLD. Personally, I find BLD an impressive trick to the spectator and a boring exercise of memory for myself.

Yes, that's the same how I feel about BLD. You could always do one FMC per week (like I do) with the weekly contest! It will be fun to compete against you!